WHS doesn't work

[rulefan]

21.3(b)(2) Score Entered for Each Hole. To meet the requirements in Rule 3.3b for entering hole scores on the scorecard:​

• If Hole Is Completed by Holing Out:
  • When Score Results in Hole Being Won or Tied. The scorecard must show the actual score.
  • When Score Results in Hole Being Lost. The scorecard must show either no score or any score that results in the hole being lost.
• If Hole Is Completed Without Holing Out. If the player does not hole out under the Rules, the scorecard must show either no score or any score that results in the hole being lost.

 

[clubchamp98]

The gross score will matter for handicap though, especially as there is one of his best 8 dropping off?

Exactly.
But it was a strange thing having a putt for half but you can’t really go at it like matchplay as the next one dosnt matter.

You still need to think of the one coming back!

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

Exactly.
But it was a strange thing having a putt for half but you can’t really go at it like matchplay as the next one dosnt matter.

You still need to think of the one coming back!

Which is why I don’t think a bogey comp score should count towards your handicap. The player has a quite different objective for a hole - save getting the ball in the hole in as few shots as possible - except that in bogey any score worse than nett par is irrelevant.

 

[Whereditgo]

Exactly.
But it was a strange thing having a putt for half but you can’t really go at it like matchplay as the next one dosnt matter.

You still need to think of the one coming back!

While remembering that there may be a difference between course handicap and playing handicap and which hole that is on.

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

Exactly.
But it was a strange thing having a putt for half but you can’t really go at it like matchplay as the next one dosnt matter.

You still need to think of the one coming back!

Rule 21.3b(2) says that if a player loses a hole, or if he cannot at best halve the hole he should pick up, and his scorecard for the hole should show no score or any score that signifies loss of hole.

How can the above for a lost hole, especially the ‘any score’ bit, count for Handicap purposes.

 

[Swango1980]

Rule 21.3b(2) says that if a player loses a hole, or if he cannot at best halve the hole he should pick up, and his scorecard for the hole should show no score or any score that signifies loss of hole.

How can the above for a lost hole, especially the ‘any score’ bit, count for Handicap purposes.

The guidelines for Par/Bogey competitions is puzzling me a little now.

Without doubt, the score goes onto your handicap record, and you need to hole out on every hole, until you can no longer beat nett double bogey. Otherwise, your score on the handicap record will be wrong, and could be significantly wrong.

But, under the Rules of Golf, it is fair to say that for this format, once you cannot beat or tie against the hole, it is safe to pick your ball up and it will not impact the competition result. But, the Rules of Golf do not necessarily tie in with the Rules of Handicapping in this case. I did try and find an exact clarification in the WHS Manual (and the CONGU guidelines to it), but I couldn't really find anything concrete. So, not sure if I've missed it, it isn't there, or you need to use a more generic guideline within the WHS manual to fit in with the Par/Bogey format

So, if players are playing this format, and strictly following the Rules of Golf, and picking up as soon as they can no longer match nett par, then they could have much higher Score Differentials. I dare not think what sort of handicaps these players might have, if their club happen to play this format quite frequently. Thankfully, we only do one a year.

 

[rulefan]

The guidelines for Par/Bogey competitions is puzzling me a little now.

Without doubt, the score goes onto your handicap record, and you need to hole out on every hole, until you can no longer beat nett double bogey. Otherwise, your score on the handicap record will be wrong, and could be significantly wrong.

But, under the Rules of Golf, it is fair to say that for this format, once you cannot beat or tie against the hole, it is safe to pick your ball up and it will not impact the competition result. But, the Rules of Golf do not necessarily tie in with the Rules of Handicapping in this case. I did try and find an exact clarification in the WHS Manual (and the CONGU guidelines to it), but I couldn't really find anything concrete. So, not sure if I've missed it, it isn't there, or you need to use a more generic guideline within the WHS manual to fit in with the Par/Bogey format

So, if players are playing this format, and strictly following the Rules of Golf, and picking up as soon as they can no longer match nett par, then they could have much higher Score Differentials. I dare not think what sort of handicaps these players might have, if their club happen to play this format quite frequently. Thankfully, we only do one a year.

Doesn't #3841 give the answer?

 

[rosecott]

Do we have to record a gross score when playing a match? And are matches an acceptable format for WHS? No. Bogey is just a field of players each playing a match against the course. You can’t mix matchplay and strokeplay….

To you, it might feel like matchplay, but it is a form of strokeplay.

 

[rosecott]

Rule 21.3b(2) says that if a player loses a hole, or if he cannot at best halve the hole he should pick up, and his scorecard for the hole should show no score or any score that signifies loss of hole.

How can the above for a lost hole, especially the ‘any score’ bit, count for Handicap purposes.

"Stableford and Bogey – be aware of the point where you can no longer score a Stableford point or achieve a “half” in a Bogey. You should also be aware that your Competition Handicap may be 1 or even 2 shots lower than your Course Handicap so be careful not to pick up too early as WHS handicap calculations are based on Course Handicaps."

 

[Swango1980]

Doesn't #3841 give the answer?

No. That gives me the Rules of Golf, not handicapping.

And, even the Rule of Golf doesn't say "when a hole is lost, you must put in no score". It simply says you should put in no score, or any score that results in the hole being lost

 

[Voyager EMH]

Which is why I don’t think a bogey comp score should count towards your handicap. The player has a quite different objective for a hole - save getting the ball in the hole in as few shots as possible - except that in bogey any score worse than nett par is irrelevant.

But the same sort of scenario occurs in stableford.

Stableford is a strokeplay format where some of your bad shots might not be counted.

Bogey comp or stableford comp, you are returning a score for handicap adjustment and need to be aware of this score as well as the competition score.

 

[clubchamp98]

Rule 21.3b(2) says that if a player loses a hole, or if he cannot at best halve the hole he should pick up, and his scorecard for the hole should show no score or any score that signifies loss of hole.

How can the above for a lost hole, especially the ‘any score’ bit, count for Handicap purposes.

No score is a nett double bogey.
Not good for a single figure golfer.

 

[D-S]

It’s quite simple, use the Rules of Golf, play it as matchplay against the course, forget the ‘bogey for a point’ issue - just make it not acceptable for handicapping.

It is only once or twice a year for most clubs. Not every has to be qualifying. Golfers have lots and lots of opportunities to submit acceptable scores to demonstrate their ability.

 

[wjemather]

It’s quite simple, use the Rules of Golf, play it as matchplay against the course, forget the ‘bogey for a point’ issue - just make it not acceptable for handicapping.

It is only once or twice a year for most clubs. Not every has to be qualifying. Golfers have lots and lots of opportunities to submit acceptable scores to demonstrate their ability.

Rounds played in organised competitions that meet the requirements of Rule 2 of the RoH (authorised format, minimum number of holes, by the rules of golf, on a measured and rated course, etc.) are acceptable for handicapping and scores must be submitted. Clubs/individuals do not have the authority to decide otherwise, or pick and choose which rules apply to them.

 

[wjemather]

No score is a nett double bogey.
Not good for a single figure golfer.

There's nothing special about single figure golfers. Nett double bogey isn't good for anyone.

 

[D-S]

Rounds played in organised competitions that meet the requirements of Rule 2 of the RoH (authorised format, minimum number of holes, by the rules of golf, on a measured and rated course, etc.) are acceptable for handicapping and scores must be submitted. Clubs/individuals do not have the authority to decide otherwise, or pick and choose which rules apply to them.

I fully understand the rules. I just think that the authorities should make it not acceptable. I am allowed to have a suggestion for the authorities.

 

[wjemather]

I fully understand the rules. I just think that the authorities should make it not acceptable. I am allowed to have a suggestion for the authorities.

There was no hint that it was a suggestion for the authorities.

 

[Voyager EMH]

It’s quite simple, use the Rules of Golf, play it as matchplay against the course, forget the ‘bogey for a point’ issue - just make it not acceptable for handicapping.

It is only once or twice a year for most clubs. Not every has to be qualifying. Golfers have lots and lots of opportunities to submit acceptable scores to demonstrate their ability.

I took that to be addressed to the handicapping authority.

Bit pointless if it was addressed to anywhere/anyone else.

 

[clubchamp98]

There's nothing special about single figure golfers. Nett double bogey isn't good for anyone.

I didn’t say there was.
You made that up yourself!

Net double is great for a 54 handicapper I think you are wrong there.

 

[D-S]

There was no hint that it was a suggestion for the authorities.

Sorry, I will make it clearer in future - ok?