The Footie Thread

[Bdill93]

As I said in my earlier reply, away to Palace, home to Spurs and away to Villa are a tough set of fixtures and three losses or even just one win would definitely get alarm bells sounding I think both from the fans and hierarchy

They wont lose all 3 though. That's why he keeps his job, always gets the win when they most need it. But with the money spent on their squad they should expect 9 points.

 

[Arthur Wedge]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1830552851614998670

Another referee who clearly hates Chelsea. 3 games out of 3 so far

Booked Fofana and Neto in the first half for first offence, soft fouls in Palace’s half, whilst Kamada managed to give away 5 fouls and didn’t receive a yellow card (4 fouls in the first 20 mins, including 2 in 20 seconds)

Then Will Hughes does this - which based on Neto’s yellow, absolutely HAS to be a sending off.

Palace immediately subbed him off. They scored a few minutes later.

Refs love to influence results.

It was a clear yellow card and it’s half the issue now - no consistency

 

[Swango1980]

Missing one expensive player there

And what’s the style

Does he want to press high ?

Press from the centre forward , the wide players ? Press in 2’s or 3’s

Have the full backs overlapping

Is it a single pivot in the middle ? Or a double with Mainoo and Casemiro

Where does Fernandes play ? Is it a free role - a number ten ? Box to box ?


are they looking to have a slow build up , or look to be solid and break quickly

Look to pass from the GK or hit a no 9 long

As for Onana - got to be one of the worst seen in the nets for a while - he appears to have zero idea where his goal is , planted to his line and unable to close any angle down


Martinez is a solid defender but appears to be unable to read a game

de Ligt - he made Maguire look quick on the turn

it’s hard to see any signing where it’s been a success

Many are obsessed with a single style of play. I never remember this being an issue. Has this been something that pundits have suddenly loved to hurl out as much as possible as it makes them sound smart? Something that has cropped up since Pep arrived in the PL, and pundits have had to fill 24hours of sports coverage across the airwaves?

What was Sir Alex's style of play? Given that some games Utd would dominate possession, others they'd play much more defensive and look to hit quick on the counter, etc. he was generally able to adapt depending on the opponent and the players he had available to him. This also became much easier when he had a settled side with good players he could rely on.

Obviously, much of this debate is just repeated, because the same old comments are made every time Man Utd don't win a game of football, or even sometimes when they only win by a single goal and the opposition failed to score the odd decent chance. What style of play will any manager at Man Utd played last year, when most of the players were out injured (especially at the back) and the rest of the players are deemed not good enough by most? He could probably just played ultra defensive football all season, and been much more solid at the back. But he'd have been sacked for being boring. Presumably he is trying to implement a general style of football that you'd typically see a top football club play, but on that journey he will need give players time to adapt to it, or take time to see who just will never be good enough.

Yes, ETH looks to have a more settled side, and so he needs to start getting more consistent results. I don't know if he wants to play a single style of play, or if he is happy to adapt from game to game. I never watched Ajax, but I believe he likes to play a higher pressing style and quick attacking football. It is the reason most said Ronaldo had to leave the club as soon as he agreed to manage Utd. It is clear that the flaw in this is that when Utd lose possession, they don't have the players to deal with this (and even in possession, there are too many players being careless in passing or not giving their team mates easier passes to make). First season it was fine, as Casemiro was excellent and they had a pretty settled side. Last season was chaos. This season, Casemiro looks to have continued his shocking loss of form, I can't explain why this is. Ugarte has been seen as an important player to get in to help. I also noticed they signed Sekou Kone, which could be down to the fact they recognize the defensive midfield position is of huge importance, they can't just rely on Ugarte long term (injuries / form), and they are looking to bring in a promising youngster that can be phased into the side longer term.

I've hated watching a lot of games in the last year. I've screamed at the screen, and questioned both players and manager at times. But, I also was realistic that it could take 3-5 years minimum to even start challenging right at the top again, let alone win the league. Players have contracts, so it isn't as simple as just sacking everyone you don't want and bringing in world class players to replace them. So, it takes a while to phase the bad eggs out, and find the good talent to replace them. I don't expect every decision to be perfect. I'm glad there are more competent people at the club now above ETH, that can make decisions and hopefully invest more wisely. If a manager has been a catastrophic failure, I can see why a club will get rid of them asap. But, if that hasn't happened, I'd like to think a manager would get at least 3 or so years minimum to build some foundations.

 

[HomerJSimpson]

They wont lose all 3 though. That's why he keeps his job, always gets the win when they most need it. But with the money spent on their squad they should expect 9 points.

Can you see a win there? Palace away will be tough. I can see Spurs setting up to play on the counter and nicking a win or draw especially if United are so out of shape positionally as yesterday and again Villa away seems a big ask given the current issues and the way Emery has had Villa playing

 

[Hobbit]

To be honest, I don’t think Utd have any issues out wide either defensively or in attack. Admittedly playing the fullbacks so high in attack means there’s space behind them which sees the centrebacks pulled wide when the ball is played across them. All they’re missing is a solid defensive midfielder and a good, holding player up top.

I’d be interested to see their heat map - not sure all the players left everything out on the pitch.

Early days… currently 14th…. Will they do better than 8th?

 

[Arthur Wedge]

So it’s 4 paragraphs to get around it and you don’t know what style of play he is trying to implement into the team

It’s been two seasons and £600mil plus spent

How many playing now are the “bad eggs” to phase out

how many from the 1st yesterday were there when ETH arrived ? Fernandes ? Dalot

Anyone else

3-5 years ?!

 

[Swango1980]

Can you see a win there? Palace away will be tough. I can see Spurs setting up to play on the counter and nicking a win or draw especially if United are so out of shape positionally as yesterday and again Villa away seems a big ask given the current issues and the way Emery has had Villa playing

Going into each game, I can see Utd winning it. But, going into each game, I can also see Utd losing.

Given that nobody expected Utd to be challenging City or Arsenal, and probably not a few others, it would mean it is inevitable Utd will lose games through the season. Lose games that they shouldn't lose on paper, and lose games against teams people feel are better anyway. It'd obviously disappointing 2 of those losses have come in the first 3 games, so it means Utd fans can only hope for a mini run of games where they get a few more wins that they'd expect to be normal.

 

[HomerJSimpson]

Going into each game, I can see Utd winning it. But, going into each game, I can also see Utd losing.

Given that nobody expected Utd to be challenging City or Arsenal, and probably not a few others, it would mean it is inevitable Utd will lose games through the season. Lose games that they shouldn't lose on paper, and lose games against teams people feel are better anyway. It'd obviously disappointing 2 of those losses have come in the first 3 games, so it means Utd fans can only hope for a mini run of games where they get a few more wins that they'd expect to be normal.

I agree that despite what I wrote United could win some of those game or even getting a win and a draw (still think Villa away is a big ask) but if it does go wrong what then. I think at the start of the season United fans would have seen Liverpool as a must win based on the rivalry alone although the pragmatic may have seen it as a big challenge too soon which is how it panned out

 

[Swango1980]

So it’s 4 paragraphs to get around it and you don’t know what style of play he is trying to implement into the team

It’s been two seasons and £600mil plus spent

How many playing now are the “bad eggs” to phase out

how many from the 1st yesterday were there when ETH arrived ? Fernandes ? Dalot

Anyone else

3-5 years ?!

My post was no longer than any of yours. I'm trying to respectfully give you my point of view, I'd respect it if you didn't have a personal dig at the length of my post. After all, if I gave you a one line answer to your lengthy post, I don't think that would be suffice for you anyway?

We all know Utd have spent a lot of money. They have a lot of money to spend, but also the owners at the club in his first 2 seasons were particularly good at spending huge money carelessly. I've also said that Utd look to have a more settled squad this season, which was very much not the case last season. So, I expect them to do better, ETH will need them to do better. But, I'm not going to use a single match against Liverpool to prove the opposite.

Who was at the club before ETH that started Sunday? Dalot, Bruno and Rashford

Two players making their first starts, De Ligt and Zirksee. And Mazraoui new as well. So, happy to give those 3 players a chance at least, before trying to prove a point about them either way.

Mainoo and Garnacho who have been brought through under ETH, and generally thought to have been a success and good potential moving forward.

Martinez and Casemiro who were bought in ETH's first season. Martinez who most Man Utd fans very much like, and Casemiro who was excellent for a season, and has been shocking since.

Then Onana, who I agree the jury is out.

 

[Bdill93]

Can you see a win there? Palace away will be tough. I can see Spurs setting up to play on the counter and nicking a win or draw especially if United are so out of shape positionally as yesterday and again Villa away seems a big ask given the current issues and the way Emery has had Villa playing

We never beat United so theres 3 points.

Biggest bogey team we have, just never ever seem to beat them even though we outplay them at times.

 

[clubchamp98]

To be honest, I don’t think Utd have any issues out wide either defensively or in attack. Admittedly playing the fullbacks so high in attack means there’s space behind them which sees the centrebacks pulled wide when the ball is played across them. All they’re missing is a solid defensive midfielder and a good, holding player up top.

I’d be interested to see their heat map - not sure all the players left everything out on the pitch.

Early days… currently 14th…. Will they do better than 8th?

With the fullbacks so high though it sort of lets the wing men off the hook a bit.
Look at the work rate of Liverpools forward line.
The MU defenders / midfielders had no time on the ball so made mistakes.

Contrast that with the work rate of MU forwards.
VVD etc had a lot of time on the ball and found the midfielders in pockets all day long.

Imho a lot of what is wrong at MU is attitude.!

 

[4LEX]

It's been done to death before and I can't be bothered to repeat the same thing over and over but for me the main issues are;

The manager. Just totally clueless, arrogant, stubborn and needs to be sacked right away. Due to the embarrassing handling of his job over the summer, he won't be sacked for a few months or else it will make the new owner and structure look really bad. I reckon he'll struggle on until November before the plug is pulled.

Onana isn't good enough, it was clear last season yet there was no talk of him being replaced. Looking at the goals yesterday he's partly to blame for all of them through poor positioning, sluggish movement and terrible reflexes on low shots either side. Compare him to Allison who made some amazing saves he had little right to make.

The lack of a ball playing central midfielder who can control possession and run the game. Ugarte will replace Casemiro and cut down on mistakes but the midfield of Mainoo and Bruno still lacks something as they treat the ball like a hot potato.

There's a lack of quality out wide. Rashford should've been sold before his stock plummets further and a proper winger brought in. Compare Diaz and Salah to their wingers yesterday and it's clear to see the difference is huge in quality.

No top striker. To spend around £600m and end up with Hojlund and Zirkzee is embarrassing. I know one is a young prospect and the other a squad player but that was the first position that needed sorting out 4-5 years ago. Even as bad as Utd were yesterday, they had a few good chances. If you have a world class striker instead of Zirkzee that game is totally different.

Still think Utd will get Top 4 on the basis there's a big drop in quality from City, Arsenal and Liverpool down but it will probably take a manager change later in the season for it to happen. The signings while not being top class are all good signings and will contribute to a better squad and competition for places. Villa have the CL, Chelsea are a scattergun of a club, Newcastle haven't improved and Spurs are Spurs.

 

[IanM]

There's a new category of, "how badly can we run the club."

Chelsea just ahead of Utd currently. But they're working on it
Plymouth making an audacious bid for promotion in this category but appointing Rooney.

 

[4LEX]

There's a new category of, "how badly can we run the club."

Chelsea just ahead of Utd currently. But they're working on it
Plymouth making an audacious bid for promotion in this category but appointing Rooney.

I think Reading take that one Ian. Just the 18 point deductions in 3 seasons and been on a transfer embargo for 5 years

 

[HampshireHog]

There's a new category of, "how badly can we run the club."

Chelsea just ahead of Utd currently. But they're working on it
Plymouth making an audacious bid for promotion in this category but appointing Rooney.

You can’t overlook Everton, they’ve practically turned mismanagement into an art form.

 

[Tashyboy]

With the amount of crap I have taken from Utd fans over the years. I should be winning an Olympic gold in Gloating. Let’s just say that one thing it has taught me is Humility. Plus am a big boy.
Re Utd I just do not get ETH one bit. Before I put my two pennuth worth in. ETH reminded us the other day he was the second most successful manager in the league after Pep since he has managed Utd. Oddly enough a day later he said “ I am not Harry Potter”.
Anyway I have said before what is Utds style of play. But before I ramble on about that. What is his defensive style of play. I heard a lot about Liverpools energy the other day.. But when I have seen Utd play, as soon as they loose the ball I don’t see any controlled hunger or urgency to get it back. City, Liverpool and others have a five second rule to squeeze and try to win the ball back. But it is done as a unit, not individuals. The ball is squeezed into a part of the pitch that makes it hard to escape. It comes with coaching and I don’t see any of that. It also means the ball can be won in a dangerous defensive position. I don’t see any of that.
Back to Utds style of play, who are the players that look Comfortable on the ball at Utd. I honestly cannot think of one player that would fit into Utd or Liverpools starting 11. ETH has been there long enough to now have at least some identity on his starting 11 and now they play. He has spent enough for us to at least see a glimmer of it. Yet nothing.
Personally I hope he stays. For the good of the club, he should go. ETH May well be the second most successful manager after Pep, but at the moment I would be a lot happier following Liverpool, Arsenal, Spurs, Villa, and a few others. Ave a feeling it is going to be a very long season for the Utd fans again.

 

[Tashyboy]

There's a new category of, "how badly can we run the club."

Chelsea just ahead of Utd currently. But they're working on it
Plymouth making an audacious bid for promotion in this category but appointing Rooney.

Not quite reached the lows of City in Div 2 yet though I am going for a lie down as am having flash backs.

 

[PJ87]

With the amount of crap I have taken from Utd fans over the years. I should be winning an Olympic gold in Gloating. Let’s just say that one thing it has taught me is Humility. Plus am a big boy.
Re Utd I just do not get ETH one bit. Before I put my two pennuth worth in. ETH reminded us the other day he was the second most successful manager in the league after Pep since he has managed Utd. Oddly enough a day later he said “ I am not Harry Potter”.
Anyway I have said before what is Utds style of play. But before I ramble on about that. What is his defensive style of play. I heard a lot about Liverpools energy the other day.. But when I have seen Utd play, as soon as they loose the ball I don’t see any controlled hunger or urgency to get it back. City, Liverpool and others have a five second rule to squeeze and try to win the ball back. But it is done as a unit, not individuals. The ball is squeezed into a part of the pitch that makes it hard to escape. It comes with coaching and I don’t see any of that. It also means the ball can be won in a dangerous defensive position. I don’t see any of that.
Back to Utds style of play, who are the players that look Comfortable on the ball at Utd. I honestly cannot think of one player that would fit into Utd or Liverpools starting 11. ETH has been there long enough to now have at least some identity on his starting 11 and now they play. He has spent enough for us to at least see a glimmer of it. Yet nothing.
Personally I hope he stays. For the good of the club, he should go. ETH May well be the second most successful manager after Pep, but at the moment I would be a lot happier following Liverpool, Arsenal, Spurs, Villa, and a few others. Ave a feeling it is going to be a very long season for the Utd fans again.

I stand by my assessment that Eth is an useless manager out of his depth. If he can look that reporter in the face and seriously claim there aren't glaring issues at united he is delusional. Next he will be telling us he isn't bald.

 

[Tashyboy]

I stand by my assessment that Eth is a useless manager out of his depth. If he can look that reporter in the face and seriously claim there aren't glaring issues at united he is delusional. Next he will be telling us he isn't bald.

He could well be telling us he is “head and shoulders above most managers.

 

[clubchamp98]

Not quite reached the lows of City in Div 2 yet though I am going for a lie down as am having flash backs.

They might come true if the charges all 115 of them are proven.