Tag Marshall

[patricks148]

My club are starting a trial with Tag Marshall at the moment, its an electronic tag given to each group to track pace of play and where groups are in relation to the rest of the groups on the course.

should highlight once and for all who the slowcoaches are in comps, not that most don't already know

any other clubs using this and has it worked??

 

[Deleted member 21258]

There were in use at Ballybunion and Waterville, can say I found them a bit of an insult and from reading reviews of the course it doesn't improve course times(at one of them course, they said we could take 4.5hrs as a 3 ball ). They said sometimes 4 balls are taking 5.5 hrs

They were lucky I didn't accidently drop it in a bunker on the 17th, I don't need to be tagged or forced to play with people or forced to have a caddy on a course, I would rather not play at the course.

Course Marshall would be far better..

 

[xreyuk]

I can see something like this being put it at our club. They've already sent out a warning email and asked people to submit their cards as soon as they're in, slow pace will get 3 warnings before they're told to play at the back of the field.

 

[IanM]

Got be be better than doing nothing...... which is what is happening now.

New theory: In the days of waiting lists, high demand and low availability, Clubs could chuck offenders out!!! Now they need the money more!

 

[Deleted member 15344]

What a great idea imo - simple but effective , surely the only people that will have a problem with them will be the guys who are indeed slow and causing issues on the course - slow play is a bug bear for 99% of the golfers so highlighting them is a good thing

 

[patricks148]

There were in use at Ballybunion and Waterville, can say I found them a bit of an insult and from reading reviews of the course it doesn't improve course times(at one of them course, they said we could take 4.5hrs as a 3 ball ). They said sometimes 4 balls are taking 5.5 hrs

They were lucky I didn't accidently drop it in a bunker on the 17th, I don't need to be tagged or forced to play with people or forced to have a caddy on a course, I would rather not play at the course.

Course Marshall would be far better..

TBH, not much they can do to visitors, might make some of the caddies at ours think a bit more, take 4 slow players add 4 caddies usually = even slower at ours.

we shall see, good time to try it tomorrow as its a black tee comp that usually really slow as its open to all handicaps, rough has gone mental with all the rain we have had the last 3 weeks

 

[Deleted member 21258]

TBH, not much they can do to visitors, might make some of the caddies at ours think a bit more, take 4 slow players add 4 caddies usually = even slower at ours.

we shall see, good time to try it tomorrow as its a black tee comp that usually really slow as its open to all handicaps, rough has gone mental with all the rain we have had the last 3 weeks

Would be interested to hear how it goes and whether it is quicker, what times they set as guidance and then leading on over time, do they actually enforce those times at busy & quiet times and also when playing in comps and what they do if someone is caught being slow. What the starters said to us, basically other than tagging you, they seemed to do very little afterwards.

Its a tough one, as I hate slow play, but just felt it probably wont help as they set 4.5 hrs as the pace and then enforcing it is hard( whether members or visitors).

Wait to hear the updates.

 

[Imurg]

The only problem I have with things like this is they don't tell the whole story.
Ok, a group may take 40 minutes longer than they're supposed to but the question is why?
Is it "slow play" or is it that they've simply had a bad day between them and had to look for a lot of balls?
As has been mentioned in another thread, with only 3 minutes to look for a ball there will be less calling through as it will take longer.
So if a group has to look for nearly 3 minutes on every other hole, especially if the rough is thick, then they're going to take at least half an hour longer without any other delays.
Have they simply been keeping up but the group in front has been a little slow..?
Without knowing why a group is taking X hours/minutes it's hard to penalize.
First group out may fly round, playing well so fewer shots, no lost balls or searches.
2nd group has a bad day, searches for balls on a dozen holes and takes 35 minutes longer.
Have they been "slow" or just taken longer?
Not necessarily the same thing.

 

[williamalex1]

There's no point in having the exercise , if the club doesn't act on the results.
Years ago, we tried having a guy sit at the 9th green , noting the times of every game as they came off .
We had another guy waiting at the 18th green noting the finishing times of every game.
It highlighted where and who the main culprits were, but NOTHING WAS EVER DONE.


A couple of slow games out 2 early on and that's just the start of the problem .
A Course Marshall, or a Ranger is the answer.

 

[USER1999]

3 guys could be racers, one guy a tortoise. It doesn't tell the story.

 

[Cake]

If it was used for (or sold as being for) insight like this (what areas of the course are heavily used so focus on them for conditioning, identify optimal spacing of tee times etc) then it might not offend people so much?

https://www.forbes.com/sites/scottkramer/2019/05/16/how-technology-is-improving-golf-courses/

That said if they are only giving one token per group then I guess it can only be a pace of play tracker.

 

[HomerJSimpson]

Can see the pros and cons. Yes it will highlight the regular offenders but only as a group and so you still need to distinguish the common denominator from there. Also, I am sure many groups will have excuses, such as looking for balls, etc and I can see many people resenting the "big brother" element impacting their enjoyment

 

[bladeplayer]

Took us 4hr 20 for a 3 ball sford 2 weeks ago all caused by first group. 4 groups held up ? Wouldnt tags show us all around equal time for playing course ?

On a side note . Rest of groups held up. us in a 3 . A 4ball .and 2 x2balls joined up .we were all complaining . We mostly all know each other . I entered card and went to throw clubs in car and a big group were chatting . Including the 3 slow ones .. i walked over and said "well what was the reason" all looked at me like i had 3 heads .. so i straight up said it . Every1 complaining why you held us all up and it not acceptable . But no 1 said it to ye ? They were under idea they played ok . Unless they are told they will think this is the norm.. still silence from.the complainers tho

 

[patricks148]

told by the starter yesterday it had already started working with visitor groups. they run some softwear with it and it tracks by GPS where groups are on the course. gaps spotted marshall dispatched to said gap and told to start letting groups through. next time i'm playing will ask if they had seen anything on the comp on Sat

 

[Lord Tyrion]

told by the starter yesterday it had already started working with visitor groups. they run some softwear with it and it tracks by GPS where groups are on the course. gaps spotted marshall dispatched to said gap and told to start letting groups through. next time i'm playing will ask if they had seen anything on the comp on Sat

It's what happens in Spain and Portugal I think. Tracking via the buggies, marshals sent out to chivvy groups that are out of place. Not experienced it myself.

Sounds positive for you.

 

[drdel]

The only problem I have with things like this is they don't tell the whole story.
Ok, a group may take 40 minutes longer than they're supposed to but the question is why?
Is it "slow play" or is it that they've simply had a bad day between them and had to look for a lot of balls?
As has been mentioned in another thread, with only 3 minutes to look for a ball there will be less calling through as it will take longer.
So if a group has to look for nearly 3 minutes on every other hole, especially if the rough is thick, then they're going to take at least half an hour longer without any other delays.
Have they simply been keeping up but the group in front has been a little slow..?
Without knowing why a group is taking X hours/minutes it's hard to penalize.
First group out may fly round, playing well so fewer shots, no lost balls or searches.
2nd group has a bad day, searches for balls on a dozen holes and takes 35 minutes longer.
Have they been "slow" or just taken longer?
Not necessarily the same thing.

I agree and could see arguments starting. Just timing a group is a very blunt instrument. Is a group automatically 'guilty' of slow play if their time is above average and so is there a right of reply?

There's numerous reasons why of a particular day a group's time may be higher. E.g. Take early morning Tee times. Given greenkeeping staff have priority (as they should) would golfers be tempted to 'play up' especially on par3's or wait while greenkeeper finishes.

 

[patricks148]

I agree and could see arguments starting. Just timing a group is a very blunt instrument. Is a group automatically 'guilty' of slow play if their time is above average and so is there a right of reply?

There's numerous reasons why of a particular day a group's time may be higher. E.g. Take early morning Tee times. Given greenkeeping staff have priority (as they should) would golfers be tempted to 'play up' especially on par3's or wait while greenkeeper finishes.

but as its GPS you can track gaps where people have lost ground on groups in front them, then take action

 

[duncan mackie]

told by the starter yesterday it had already started working with visitor groups. they run some softwear with it and it tracks by GPS where groups are on the course. gaps spotted marshall dispatched to said gap and told to start letting groups through. next time i'm playing will ask if they had seen anything on the comp on Sat

Sounds good when you write it up like that - the reality is that the damage to the field has already been done, and will be maintained, even if they let another group through etc
Partial damage resolved if the group's are required to walk a hole if they lose 1.5 holes...not great for competition fields!
As said, the real issue for clubs is what to do when they have established who and by how much. Which points to accurate but short term data followed by the implementation of an effective long term solution.
IMO this is an expensive solution generally implemented to avoid dealing with the underlying issues at club level.
I would like to be wrong!

 

[patricks148]

Sounds good when you write it up like that - the reality is that the damage to the field has already been done, and will be maintained, even if they let another group through etc
Partial damage resolved if the group's are required to walk a hole if they lose 1.5 holes...not great for competition fields!
As said, the real issue for clubs is what to do when they have established who and by how much. Which points to accurate but short term data followed by the implementation of an effective long term solution.
IMO this is an expensive solution generally implemented to avoid dealing with the underlying issues at club level.
I would like to be wrong!

ive got the feeling its more aimed at the visitor rounds, 4 and a half hours we had yesterday would be world record pace for some of the groups that are taking 5 hours plus. not sure how it will do anything with the comps, though most of our medals are not that bad we were just over 3 hours last time. yesterday was off the very back tee's and involved members from 3 other local clubs who historically get to play in about 3 of our silver trophy's..... no idea why, we don't get the favour returned.

this is being driven by our new CEO, who Ran Carnoustie for 20 years

 

[Grant85]

My club are starting a trial with Tag Marshall at the moment, its an electronic tag given to each group to track pace of play and where groups are in relation to the rest of the groups on the course.

should highlight once and for all who the slowcoaches are in comps, not that most don't already know

any other clubs using this and has it worked??

Fair enough, but the problem is you could spend 3 minutes looking for a ball at every hole. Would be harsh to penalise people in these circumstances.

However at least if you build a bank of information up and try to genuinely encourage someone who is always in the plus 4 hour groups to speed it up.

Played round Kinghorn this morning, 2 ball off the yellows. Holed everything out and were 2 hours 50. Short course, but we didn’t rush and took our time to read putts etc.