Should clubs offer reduced green fees for UK golfers ?

[GB72]

I don't think as a general rule Americans earn more than us but those working as bankers/doctors/dentists/lawyers all seem to have much more disposable income than over here. I've played with many Americans over the years and for them to come over and spend $5-10k on a week long trip is often no big deal. I looked at a job in IT over there and the salary was a bit higher but nothing significant.

From my understanding they do not get anywhere near the same amount of paid time off as we do and so if they are going to take a week off then they want to do it properly. May be incorrect and is only information gleaned from talking to Americans taking short breaks in the Caribbean and Mexico about why they generally stay for much shorter periods. Certainly the classic 2 week holiday was unheard of.

 

[Deleted member 23270]

From my understanding they do not get anywhere near the same amount of paid time off as we do and so if they are going to take a week off then they want to do it properly. May be incorrect and is only information gleaned from talking to Americans taking short breaks in the Caribbean and Mexico about why they generally stay for much shorter periods. Certainly the classic 2 week holiday was unheard of.

You are correct. The job I looked at was 2 weeks holiday which built up over many years to 5 weeks. At the time due to my length of service and shift arrangements I was on 48-50 days leave a year so it was a no brainer for me!

 

[sunshine]

From my experience, the statutory minimum in US is 2 weeks holiday, but good employers give 4-5 weeks so comparable with Europe.

I work for a global firm, I’d be looking at at least 50% pay rise if I moved to the US. They offer unlimited holidays too, although the culture is short breaks (eg long weekends) and it’s very rare to take 2 weeks off in one go.

But loads of things we take for granted are really expensive in the US. Eg dental care and health care. Insurance costs tens of thousands of dollars per year and if you need extra care the bills quickly top 100k.

Overall the standard of living is higher in the US, they have more disposable income and can do more with the cash. Still wouldn’t want to live there though.

 

[TigerTime]

Because it is good for the game?

I lived in Hawaii for a bit in the late 90s. Over there, there is a locals rate for lots of things, not just golf. Hotel rates was a big one we used.
It keeps local people interested in using local facilities, such as golf courses.
To those who don't agree, it is not like people are getting on for nothing.
Kings Barns Scottish resident rate is about £165, still a lot to pay and you can only book 2 weeks in advance. No doubt most of the times are booked out so you are unlikely to get on in the summmer

Kingsbarns Scottish resident rate was £195 when I played it in September and is going up to £210 next year.

 

[Trapdraw]

I enquired with YGT about a trip next year to St Andrews, 4 people, 3 nights (sharing rooms), 3 rounds, Old Course, Kingsbarns and Castle Course. Cost was £15,180

 

[Boabie]

If only there was a way to charge visitors the same fee as their home club charges their visitors. OR Set a green fee rate as a % of the membership fee.

 

[rystaman]

It's saddening seeing the jump up in the past 10 years... I wasn't in a position to play these types of courses until the past few years and while I feel lucky to have played the Eden in St Andrews and Leven on a twilight rate, seeing the prices for next year e.g. Craighead at Crail being £120, Castle Course being £170. It's just out of reach for the average UK person who wants to play these courses. It's all obviously aimed towards the Americans who come over and spend the £££

 

[KenL]

It's saddening seeing the jump up in the past 10 years... I wasn't in a position to play these types of courses until the past few years and while I feel lucky to have played the Eden in St Andrews and Leven on a twilight rate, seeing the prices for next year e.g. Craighead at Crail being £120, Castle Course being £170. It's just out of reach for the average UK person who wants to play these courses. It's all obviously aimed towards the Americans who come over and spend the £££

Craighead £120.

 

[rystaman]

Craighead £120.

Balcomie - £170… Considering a 25-29 membership is £300 that’s utterly ridiculous.

 

[Crow]

Balcomie - £170… Considering a 25-29 membership is £300 that’s utterly ridiculous.

I played both courses at Crail a few years back (probably more years than my memory allows me to think) but it was only about £25 or £35 a round summer rate.

Thinking hard it was probably 10 years ago.

 

[rystaman]

I played both courses at Crail a few years back (probably more years than my memory allows me to think) but it was only about £25 or £35 a round summer rate.

Thinking hard it was probably 10 years ago.

It's ridiculous to be honest, but will continue to go up until visitors stop paying (which the Americans won't). If anything the Americans probably see a higher green fee and want to go more...

All of the courses with history are just getting absolutely pumped up in price for the foreign visitors and pricing out normal people.

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

I enquired with YGT about a trip next year to St Andrews, 4 people, 3 nights (sharing rooms), 3 rounds, Old Course, Kingsbarns and Castle Course. Cost was £15,180

That’s so absurd it’s not even funny.

 

[D-S]

It's ridiculous to be honest, but will continue to go up until visitors stop paying (which the Americans won't). If anything the Americans probably see a higher green fee and want to go more...

All of the courses with history are just getting absolutely pumped up in price for the foreign visitors and pricing out normal people.

I get it for all the courses on the American Tourist Trail but what about those who have increased by similar ludicrous amounts that never see an American Tourist from one year to the next? The gulf in pricing between decent local courses and those with some sort of a name because they appear in the lower ranks of a list has grown out of all proportion.

 

[Doon frae Troon]

I recall in the late 1960's a golfer having a right moan at my dad.
He was a Geordie and used to visit my dad's East of Scotland course two or three times a year.
Kill the golden goose, getting quite extortionate, and other phrases were used.

My dad asked him if his home course was better than his [he was a member of a top NE England course]
No
Was the green fee cheaper
No
Could he play as a visitor at the weekend
No it's members only at weekends.

Dad shrugs shoulders, laughs and slowly shakes head.

 

[rystaman]

I get it for all the courses on the American Tourist Trail but what about those who have increased by similar ludicrous amounts that never see an American Tourist from one year to the next? The gulf in pricing between decent local courses and those with some sort of a name because they appear in the lower ranks of a list has grown out of all proportion.

Also very true, out of curiosity I looked at a best green fees under £60 list from 22/23 and picked one of the top ones at random (Southerndown Golf Club) and here are the prices 22/23 and now 23/24.

Category	Old Fee (£)	New Fee (£)	Percentage Increase (%)
Standard Weekend AM	95	99	4.21
Standard Weekend PM	90	99	10.00
Standard Weekday AM	70	80	14.29
Standard Weekday PM	65	80	23.08

Just a casual 23% increase for a weekday afternoon tee time... I love going to a new course for the first time and just discovering, but when a previous top sub-£60 course is now £100 for a Sunday afternoon that isn't on the American tourist trail I'll save my money.

 

[rystaman]

As I started planning a trip up to Scotland already, I've seen some large increases from last year:

Carnoustie Burnside has had a 20% increase from £75 to £90
Lundin Links up 25% to £120
Elie up 25% to £150
Crail Craigshead was already mentioned but it's a 22% increase
Leven Links up 20%

Also, the Links with History Pass included Crail last year, to go with their 20% price increases, they've opted out this year so instead it's just Monifeith, Scotscaig, Lundin and Ladybank.

 

[pendodave]

I played both courses at Crail a few years back (probably more years than my memory allows me to think) but it was only about £25 or £35 a round summer rate.

Thinking hard it was probably 10 years ago.

Just checked my old emails, and paid £79 in 2018. So more than doubled in 5 years.
They gave us the Balcombie (sp) for about £20 because they had been tining the greens...

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

It seems that visitor green fees may be (the) one area that ‘trickle down’ economics works - though not to the benefit of the ‘getting ever poorer‘ consumer.

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

With all the discussion on this thread and others about the cost of playing a green fee to play the recognised better, never mind the best and championship courses, I had cause to pause and ponder when going through a couple of boxes of old score cards and course planners this weekend.

There in amongst it all was my receipt for a round at Blairgowrie Rosemount - 22nd August 1988. It was £12. It’s now £140. I can’t remember back then whether I felt £12 was a lot or not. That said I balk at paying £140, and when I finished work couple of years back I most certainly was not earning near 12x salary of back then.

But would I pay £140. Prrrrrobably, but certainly not definitely.

 

[KenL]

If inflation averaged 5% each year, £12 35 years ago would now be £66.19