Playing to Handicap

[hovis]

My simplistic view is that, given how it is calculated, your handicap is you on a very good day and therefore you should expect to only shoot it occasionally.

I've never understood this mentality. handicap is what I shoot on a normal day. You then have very good days and very bad days. Handicap is supposed to reflect on your playing ability

 

[Canary Kid]

I've never understood this mentality. handicap is what I shoot on a normal day. You then have very good days and very bad days. Handicap is supposed to reflect on your playing ability

It‘s not a mentality, it is a fact. The method of calculating a handicap uses a multiplying factor of less than 1 which means that your handicap is not what you normally shoot. If you normally shoot your handicap, it is too high.

 

[Deleted member 3432]

Did you see my explanation?

Each time you play a course, your handicap will/might be different and will be worked out from the chart BEFORE you tee off.

You could be a 5 off whites at your own course and a 3 off yellows.
On another course you might be a 6 off the whites and 4 off the yellows.
Therefore, since the adjustment has already taken place, 36 is the benchmark for playing to that.

Post 26#?
So if I read that correctly someone who has been a 4/5 handicapper for 20 years could become 8/9 handicap overnighton the introduction of WHS because they play a difficult course?

 

[Deleted member 25172]

Did you see my explanation?

Each time you play a course, your handicap will/might be different and will be worked out from the chart BEFORE you tee off.

You could be a 5 off whites at your own course and a 3 off yellows.
On another course you might be a 6 off the whites and 4 off the yellows.
Therefore, since the adjustment has already taken place, 36 is the benchmark for playing to that.

I don’t think that is correct if it’s anything to be like it is in Sweden, which I posted a chart as an example off. Your handicap index stays the same wherever you go, but the amount of shots given on that particular course will vary dependent on the slope of the course. It is correct though that you will see how many shots any handicap is given before teeing off.

 

[Deleted member 25172]

Yes I believe we're saying the same, perhaps I should have written that your "shots received" instead of your "handicap". ?
For Brits we all just need to get our heads round our handicap/shots given being adjusted before we play.

Yeah, think we did. ?

Just take it from someone who used to play with this, it’s super simple really. Just look at the chart provided and if you’re given more shots than what your handicap index is, just take it and be happy.

 

[Deleted member 3432]

We will, I believe, have a handicap index, for example 4.6.
Every course will be rated and will have a chart. When you go and play, for example, Mickey Mouse Golf Course off the white tees, yes you might start the day off 7 handicap if the difficulty rating is 2 shots higher than par.

Every course, every set of tees will have its own rating.

Okay, I think I'm getting there.

Two golfers 4.6 index, one plays a rock hard track the other an easier track playing together at an away course. They are probably playing off different handicaps on the day?

How does this work with events with a handicap ballot?

 

[Backsticks]

It is something you should always expect to do.

Give yourself the gameplan, sufficient practice and mental approach to do so every round. (Strategy, technical and mental)

You certainly shouldn't expect to, unless you are a bandit. If playing off an honest and accurate handicap, then it's simply impossible to do so every time, or even anywhere near that. Taking a 36pts CSS, then you should average 31-34pts and only occasionally getting 36, even more rarely, beating it.
It depends what one defines as 'to your handicap'. 36pts, or, in your normal handicap range and so your handicap is correct.
Based on a single round, anyone exceeding 30pts has probably played to their handicap.

 

[hovis]

It‘s not a mentality, it is a fact. The method of calculating a handicap uses a multiplying factor of less than 1 which means that your handicap is not what you normally shoot. If you normally shoot your handicap, it is too high.

So if I played a hundred rounds and shot 36 points every time (css adjusted) my handicap is too high? Why doesn't it get cut the then?

 

[Backsticks]

So if I played a hundred rounds and shot 36 points every time (css adjusted) my handicap is too high? Why doesn't it get cut the then?

This is a flawed question. The hc system is built on the real world variation that an individual can achieve. So in reality you simply CANNOT shoot 36 a hundred times in a row. Even a pro tour event, with the à high concentration of the most skilled, consistent golfers in the world, will have a score variation of 15 shots on a given day.
So any one shooting too consistently in amateur golf has too high a handicap, and is using those spare shots to smooth their average.

 

[Canary Kid]

All this demonstrates is how a totally hypothetical, and incredibly unrealistic, situation will distort reality. Nobody would get 36 points in 100 successive rounds ... even the top players have a wide range in their scores, often in the same event. The fact remains that the calculation methodology means that your handicap will reflect you in a good, not a normal (i.e. average), round.

 

[fundy]

It is very easy to calculate what your handicap index, course handicap then playing handicap will be under the WHS (there will be charts for this when it comes in)

Look at your handicap record, take the best 8 gross differential scores from the last 20 divide by 8 and you have your handicap index (round to one decimal point).

Find out the slope index for where you are playing ( https://ncrdb.usga.org/ ) divide this 113 and multiply by your handicap index, round to a whole number and this is your course handicap.

For a singles strokeplay comp the Course Handicap is multiplied by 0.95 to get to a playing handicap (0.4 goes down and 0.5 or better goes up).

From all this I would expect to see about a 2 shot difference at most depending on what the decimal figure is in the last calculation.

your definition of very easy and that of most golf club members is pretty far apart i would think!!!!

 

[Orikoru]

So if I played a hundred rounds and shot 36 points every time (css adjusted) my handicap is too high? Why doesn't it get cut the then?

You would at the end of year reviews wouldn't you? Your handicap can't be you on an average day, based on the fact that playing ten shots over it only gets you +0.1 but playing 2 shots under it could see you cut 0.4 to 0.8 - it doesn't balance.

 

[nickjdavis]

Okay, I think I'm getting there.

Two golfers 4.6 index, one plays a rock hard track the other an easier track playing together at an away course. They are probably playing off different handicaps on the day?

How does this work with events with a handicap ballot?

No they wont be off different handicaps on the day.

The scores they shoot at their home course (for simplicities sake) are "normalised" so they would reflect a score at an average difficulty course....these normalised scores are then used to calculate the players handicap index..The thing to get your head round is the fact that the handicap index does not represent your ability round your home course.

A 4.6 index golfer at Carnoustie is the same ability as a 4.6 index golfer who plays the Windmill Crazy Golf course at Southend seafront.


In all likelihood going forward ballots for comps will be based on your handicap index...but its down to the individual event organiser to make that decision.

 

[Shooter McPowick]

Just running an example...
I just managed to find Hindheads details here: http://ncrdb.usga.org/courseTeeInfo.aspx?CourseID=21480
Plugged in the numbers here: https://www.usga.org/content/usga/home-page/course-handicap-calculator.html
Yesterdays 85 (off 12.4)was bang on handicap according to this: https://www.usga.org/handicap-calculator/course-handicap-table.html?cr=71.3&sr=125&par=70
Felt like with more local knowledge (first real round) and getting used to fast greens I could be shooting 80

 

[rosecott]

You would at the end of year reviews wouldn't you? Your handicap can't be you on an average day, based on the fact that playing ten shots over it only gets you +0.1 but playing 2 shots under it could see you cut 0.4 to 0.8 - it doesn't balance.

In the unlikely event of his 100 rounds/36 points happening he wouldn't have to wait for Annual Review. Any competent Handicap Committee would have picked up on the frequency of buffering/playing to handicap.

 

[doublebogey7]

No they wont be off different handicaps on the day.

The scores they shoot at their home course (for simplicities sake) are "normalised" so they would reflect a score at an average difficulty course....these normalised scores are then used to calculate the players handicap index..The thing to get your head round is the fact that the handicap index does not represent your ability round your home course.

A 4.6 index golfer at Carnoustie is the same ability as a 4.6 index golfer who plays the Windmill Crazy Golf course at Southend seafront.


In all likelihood going forward ballots for comps will be based on your handicap index...but its down to the individual event organiser to make that decision.

This is how I understand it, but to add each course will have a course rating (equivalent to SSS) so scoring 36 points will still mean you've played to your handicap only on course with a course rating the same as par.

 

[jim8flog]

I understand all this, the bit I am trying to get my head round was 36 points equating to par/handicap off any tee.

I understand different rating for different tee.

Lets say my handicap after all of the above is exactly the same as it is now, in the example I used I would go from 32 points as playing to handicap (css 4 higher than par) to having to score 36 points off same tees and same handicap. This is the bit I can't get my head round.

The question I would ask is - have you actually taken the time and trouble to work out what what your Handicap Index etc is where you play?
Whilst your handicap index may not vary much from your current handicap it could be that your playing handicap does because your course has a very high slope rating.

What course do you play at? Any course with a slope rating greater than 113 will produce a course handicap higher than a players handicap index.

It may well be over time that you see a change to your HI which reflects the way it is calculated. ie based upon scores that have a slope rating compared to the current system which does not. The system always uses the course rating (current SSS) as the basis for the calculation.

 

[doublebogey7]

The question I would ask is - have you actually taken the time and trouble to work out what what your Handicap Index etc is where you play?
Whilst your handicap index may not vary much from your current handicap it could be that your playing handicap does because your course has a very high slope rating.

What course do you play at? Any course with a slope rating greater than 113 will produce a course handicap higher than a players handicap index.

It may well be over time that you see a change to your HI which reflects the way it is calculated. ie based upon scores that have a slope rating compared to the current system which does not. The system always uses the course rating (current SSS) as the basis for the calculation.

I think you have this wrong, where a course has a relatively high course rating your WHS Handicap Index (HI) is expected to be lower than your CONGU handicap. as when making the initial HI is calculated your top 8 scores will be de-sloped. Your playing handicap under WHS is likely to be very similar to your CONGU handicap wherever you play most of your golf.

 

[NearHull]

I hope this helps whilst not actually answering your query.


According to and written by the EGU;
A Category 1 player (handicaps scratch to 5.4) is expected to play, on average, 2 shots
worse than handicap.

A Category 2 player (handicaps 5.5 to 12.4) - 3 to 4 shots worse

A Category 3 player (handicaps 12.5 to 20.4) - 5 to 6 shots worse

A Category 4 player (handicaps 20.5 to 28) should expect to play, on an
average day, 6 to 7 shots over handicap e.g. a 21 handicap player will usually play
to 27 over.

As the OP I have read all the posts on this thread with interest having just returned from the course (scored 34 pts - thank you for asking). Whilst the discussions are very interesting I find that Slime’s post answers my question as posed.
I think my question could also be reworded to “How often do you play to your expected standard?”

 

[rulefan]

Under current CONGU, 36 points is only 'playing to handicap' if the SSS is equal to par AND if you are not counting the strokes taken when recording net double bogey.
'Playing to bogey' is really recording the number strokes actually taken, subtracting the SSS (or arguably CSS)and getting an answer of 0.

I'll come back to WHS later as they cannot really be compared exactly.

But remember, under WHS there is no buffer zone. All strokes count.