New Rules - what are you for and against?

[Jacko_G]

We had a wee discussion about this today while walking around the links.

It's only days away until some fairly "interesting" changes come into play.

I'm liking the fact that I will be able to tap down and fix spike marks, scrapes and imperfections on the putting surface, I think this rule has been a long time in coming and is a good positive move.

I can live with putting out with the flag stick still in and we did this a few times today and we agreed that it actually probably is quicker doing this. No farting about with tending the flag, "I want it left in" - "I want it tended" - "Can you stand the other side please" it actually works well.

I'm pretty sure the "drop" instead of going back to the tee will be fairly widely abused. Not convinced it's a good rule. Then again if it is designed to speed up play I guess it ultimately will do that.

Only 3 minutes to look for a ball. We have all heard the argument that if the ball isn't found in that timescale then it's unlikely you are going to find it etc etc. I think the biggest problem is ettiquette in this rule, I've played numerous times when you or a member of the group sprays one offline and one of the playing partners always says "I didn't see it". I don't get this.

This 3 minute rule will still be abused as much as the current 5 minutes is at present.

My biggest question and criticism is the double hit. For me that is still a penalty. You have struck your ball twice, it's two shots. We've all done it and hopefully all called it on ourselves. Can't work out why that is not still a penalty.

What "new" rules are you happy with or not so happy with?

 

[Slab]

Happy with almost everything
Except congu messing with the OOB/lost ball local rule for qualifiers

 

[IanM]

This 3 minute rule will still be abused as much as the current 5 minutes is at present.

My biggest question and criticism is the double hit. For me that is still a penalty. You have struck your ball twice, it's two shots.

Good points.... I would say that

...with the first, at least it'll be abused more quickly!

..with the second, the second contact rare goes where you want!

 

[Lord Tyrion]

Generally all for them. Having seen the 'drop' clarified in the rules section I suspect it will be largely ignored by clubs as if it is not allowed for Q comps why run 2 sets of rules in one club. It can only lead to problems and confusion and so I doubt that will have the roll out and impact hoped for.

My only criticism is that I would have taken them further, simplified more rules, dropped some others.

In answer to your questions, I agree very much with all of the ones the OP quoted. I don't object to any of them.

 

[Deleted Member 1156]

I'm not happy with the drop when OOB, opens up a real can of worms.

 

[Deleted member 15344]

I wasn’t happy with the OOB drop and the Lost ball drop and glad that Congu decided they couldn’t be used in qualifying comps

Also not a fan of the flag left in - takes a little bit of the skill away , don’t think it saves that much time at all

The rest of the rules aren’t that dramatic but will be interesting to see how the time limits are enforced

 

[Jacko_G]

I wasn’t happy with the OOB drop and the Lost ball drop and glad that Congu decided they couldn’t be used in qualifying comps

Also not a fan of the flag left in - takes a little bit of the skill away , don’t think it saves that much time at all

The rest of the rules aren’t that dramatic but will be interesting to see how the time limits are enforced

I think you will be surprised at the flag. I know we were today.

 

[Twire]

I'm pretty happy with all of them apart from the OOB drop but I don't think many clubs will be taking that up. It will take a while to get used to them and remember the changes, but they are designed to make things more simple.

I'm very good friends with someone on the R&A rules committee and every time I challenged one of the new rules, there was always solid, sound logic behind the change.... saying that, there was one rule that split opinion.

 

[Deleted member 15344]

I think you will be surprised at the flag. I know we were today.

We have been doing it as part of “Winter Rules” in social golf for years now - you can have it out or in but not tended. It gets to be a pain when some want it in and some want it out and I have seen a number of times people over hit putts only for it to hit the pin and stop dead by the hole.

 

[ger147]

I'm pretty happy with all of them apart from the OOB drop but I don't think many clubs will be taking that up. It will take a while to get used to them and remember the changes, but they are designed to make things more simple.

I'm very good friends with someone on the R&A rules committee and every time I challenged one of the new rules, there was always solid, sound logic behind the change.... saying that, there was one rule that split opinion.

What did he say the reason was for the change of drop height to knee height?

 

[duncan mackie]

I reserve judgement on the spike marks and flagstick - both will provide much interest in the new years televised events. Those that remember when the tour hard card was (briefly) permitted to do this (repairing spike marks) as a trial will know what I mean. Time wise it won't make any difference to the pro game because an individual caddy handles each players situation - I anticipate much messing around in the club game ie it will get slower, but really hope I'm wrong.
Singling out the double hit, as done above, is interesting. Firstly if you currently strike it 3 times it's still only a single penalty - so there's no more logic to the existing rule! Second, it's one of the rules that follows the enlightened thinking of many on this forum 'no gain, no pain' and as such I'm surprised people don't approve of the change.
In the same vein I really appreciate those new rules that permit the player to undo his breach of the rules, and avoid penalty. Excellent stuff.
Always seemed silly that a fellow competitor could move your ball when searching for it in the long stuff, but you would get penalised for doing the same...more sense.
A lot of sense around the restructuring of the rules, and writing them so that you get all your info in the one area (most of the time).
There are loads more - principles are sound, application mixed (players edition of rules sets out to be too much for a short document and falls short as a copy of the rules).

 

[duncan mackie]

What did he say the reason was for the change of drop height to knee height?

To increase the probability of a ball being dropped in the relief area staying in it (rather than more faffing about)

 

[Twire]

What did he say the reason was for the change of drop height to knee height?

'SHE' said because you no longer have the 2 club roll out, and the ball has to stay within the marked area, it's easier to do that from a lower height.

 

[pendodave]

I think the flag rule might be a giraffe to intended consequences. Nasty downhiller? Hitting it firmer at the flag so it stops might help more than it should. We'll see.

Think that a creative use of 'penalty areas' might speed up play by allowing a drop where a ball goes into an area which would normally result in a lost ball or long search.

 

[Jacko_G]

We have been doing it as part of “Winter Rules” in social golf for years now - you can have it out or in but not tended. It gets to be a pain when some want it in and some want it out and I have seen a number of times people over hit putts only for it to hit the pin and stop dead by the hole.

Fair enough but in a four ball today we certainly noticed we were faster when we didn't much about with the flag. That's a good thing.

 

[Jacko_G]

I reserve judgement on the spike marks and flagstick - both will provide much interest in the new years televised events. Those that remember when the tour hard card was (briefly) permitted to do this (repairing spike marks) as a trial will know what I mean. Time wise it won't make any difference to the pro game because an individual caddy handles each players situation - I anticipate much messing around in the club game ie it will get slower, but really hope I'm wrong.
Singling out the double hit, as done above, is interesting. Firstly if you currently strike it 3 times it's still only a single penalty - so there's no more logic to the existing rule! Second, it's one of the rules that follows the enlightened thinking of many on this forum 'no gain, no pain' and as such I'm surprised people don't approve of the change.
In the same vein I really appreciate those new rules that permit the player to undo his breach of the rules, and avoid penalty. Excellent stuff.
Always seemed silly that a fellow competitor could move your ball when searching for it in the long stuff, but you would get penalised for doing the same...more sense.
A lot of sense around the restructuring of the rules, and writing them so that you get all your info in the one area (most of the time).
There are loads more - principles are sound, application mixed (players edition of rules sets out to be too much for a short document and falls short as a copy of the rules).

Why are you surprised that I find a double hit should still be a penalty?

 

[shortgame]

We had a wee discussion about this today while walking around the links.

It's only days away until some fairly "interesting" changes come into play.

I'm liking the fact that I will be able to tap down and fix spike marks, scrapes and imperfections on the putting surface, I think this rule has been a long time in coming and is a good positive move.

I can live with putting out with the flag stick still in and we did this a few times today and we agreed that it actually probably is quicker doing this. No farting about with tending the flag, "I want it left in" - "I want it tended" - "Can you stand the other side please" it actually works well.

I'm pretty sure the "drop" instead of going back to the tee will be fairly widely abused. Not convinced it's a good rule. Then again if it is designed to speed up play I guess it ultimately will do that.

Only 3 minutes to look for a ball. We have all heard the argument that if the ball isn't found in that timescale then it's unlikely you are going to find it etc etc. I think the biggest problem is ettiquette in this rule, I've played numerous times when you or a member of the group sprays one offline and one of the playing partners always says "I didn't see it". I don't get this.

This 3 minute rule will still be abused as much as the current 5 minutes is at present.

My biggest question and criticism is the double hit. For me that is still a penalty. You have struck your ball twice, it's two shots. We've all done it and hopefully all called it on ourselves. Can't work out why that is not still a penalty.

What "new" rules are you happy with or not so happy with?

Agree. Would add that with 3 minute search time there may be even less chance of being called through

 

[chrisd]

I'm happy with all the new rules except maybe the 3 minutes search. Someone playing in a 4 ball hits a drive and assumes it'll be ok, gets to the area where it should be and can't find it, he looks for a minute then calls his fellow competitors over, they take a minute to get to the lost ball area and then they all only have one minute search time left so, in those circumstances he's lost 3 minutes of 3 searchers time.

 

[garyinderry]

I will pretty much be leaving the flag in on all downhill putts unless it leans excessively towards me.

I can see this causing time delays but those are the new rules and as such I will be using that to my advantage when I can.

I will also be happy if they were to revert this rule back to the way it was. It time they may do that once there is a year or two of faffing about with flags on the green.

 

[Jacko_G]

Really surprised at the negativity towards the flag.

From one game today I can see there being a lot less farting about over a flag then previously.