LIV Golf

[Beezerk]

Jamie Donaldson on Radio 5 just a short while ago, a lot of waffle at first but made some reasonable points about Stenson and some older golfers signing up. It was also refreshing having a decent interviewer who wasn’t trying to virtue signal and points score.

 

[Jimaroid]

I wouldn’t be surprised if the brands continuing have financial links to investment from that region.

Well, yes, but Vice is specifically a bad example. Their business model is direct to consumer, specifically not to be involved in tour level sponsorships, they are founded by two seemingly liberal German lawyers and after a quick check to reinforce my suspicions turns out they are funded by Oakley Capital, a European firm who's environmental, diversity, ethics and sustainability policy couldn't be any further from Saudi's if it tried.

 

[Oddsocks]

Well, yes, but Vice is specifically a bad example. Their business model is direct to consumer, specifically not to be involved in tour level sponsorships, they are founded by two seemingly liberal German lawyers and after a quick check to reinforce my suspicions turns out they are funded by Oakley Capital, a European firm who's environmental, diversity, ethics and sustainability policy couldn't be any further from Saudi's if it tried.

Ok bad example as no research had be carried out at the time of posting, but the theory remains the same in principle.

 

[Springveldt]

They would pick up some recognised players (let’s say bottom 28 from 48) and a far more reasonable price tag opposed to the headliners. Increase their brand exposure and effectively credibility as a premium ball for a fraction of the investment the likes of srixon, titleist and Bridgestone have to commit to for the big names on main tours.

I’m solely hypothesising here, but there has to be potential with big names now being out of contract.

It’s also going to see which sponsors carry on as is (Nike and Kepka) as an example.

I wouldn’t be surprised if the brands continuing have financial links to investment from that region.

If we are taking the moral high ground against LIV and is financial sources, do the anti live group now boycott these brands?

Bridgestone have been doing business in Saudi for years, they were proudly posting about their 70 year relationship a couple of years ago.

As I said earlier in this thread I think a lot of companies are getting out of expensive contracts with these players just now as it's easy to do now that they are no longer on the PGA Tour. I wouldn't be surprised to see the deals redone in a years time at a much cheaper rate.

 

[Jimaroid]

Ok bad example as no research had be carried out at the time of posting, but the theory remains the same in principle.

Yes there are plenty of individuals and businesses who are happy to engage in reputation laundering and sportwashing.

 

[Oddsocks]

As I said earlier in this thread I think a lot of companies are getting out of expensive contracts with these players just now as it's easy to do now that they are no longer on the PGA Tour. I wouldn't be surprised to see the deals redone in a years time at a much cheaper rate.

That makes sense. Sign BDC as an example pre covid as the next best thing which has proven not to be the “brand” he sold himself as. Now group that with global supply shortages in materials along with increased overheads such as energy costs to production and the cuts have to come from somewhere.

If they can renegotiate 12 months down the line using no Ryder Cup exposure, no DP/USGA Tour exposure, less events in general, they’ll resign him for a lot less.

 

[Oddsocks]

Yes there are plenty of individuals and businesses who are happy to engage in reputation laundering and sportwashing.

Like the LPGA and aramco?

Sorry, but these terms are getting boring.

 

[Jimaroid]

Sorry, but these terms are getting boring.

It's hardly my issue if you're bored by the truth. I'll continue to use them.

 

[Oddsocks]

It's hardly my issue if you're bored by the truth. I'll continue to use them.

I notice you only quoted the bit that suited? (Edited)

Out of interest, do you have that same view of golf monthly for accepting advertising revenue from LIV? After all they engaged.

I think if you dig deep enough you’ll always find dirt.

 

[Deleted member 15344]

So it seems in keep with slot of Luther big signings, Mr Stenson lost his long term sponsor A Mutual Of Omaha. Obvious he is not the first big signing to lose a sponsor, the most recent headline was DeShambles losing Bridgestone.

I’m curious as to the reasoning behind people losing sponsors because of the series. Is it because they feel they will not get the value of their investment through less events and less air time or simply because the prefer to be represented on the main tours?

It’s quite strange as there are rumours adidas are trying to buy a team name for $1bil.

I suspect there will be a number of reasons

RBC for example removed BDC , DJ etc because by playing in a LIV they were unable to fullfil some contractual obligations by not being at the Canadian Open etc

Some companies will just not want the negative publicity

Some will be worried about losing exposure because of the lack of media rights etc

I don’t expect any would be removing the sponsership because of links to Saudi

You can see many have lost sponsors and I guess that’s were the financial compensation comes into it from LIV

So with big brands walking away (example Bridgestone) is now the time for smaller brands like vice to sweep in and support this tour from early stages. There seems a great opportunity for newer or less established brands

I don’t think it’s within the remit of those type of brands , they don’t seem to be companies that look for player sponsers etc and just use customer markets instead

 

[Jimaroid]

Out of interest, do you have that same view of golf monthly for accepting advertising revenue from LIV? After all they engaged.

I think if you dig deep enough you’ll always find dirt.

You're jumping to conclusions. I agree all money is tainted and I've said as much numerous times. I haven't said I oppose LIV. What I oppose is the lies and masquerades.

If, for example, one of the players simply said they're doing it for the money I'd have no issue with that at all.

 

[Slab]

You're jumping to conclusions. I agree all money is tainted and I've said as much numerous times. I haven't said I oppose LIV. What I oppose is the lies and masquerades.

If, for example, one of the players simply said they're doing it for the money I'd have no issue with that at all.

We all know its for the money, if it was a charity gig we know none of them would've signed up... but in saying that I think its unlikely (even naive) for us to expect any player to 'only' say they're just doing it for the money.
Even the most recent, Stenson said (amongst other reasons) it was a "commercial decision" for him... But as fun as it would be they're never going to go the full Harry Enfield when they sign up are they, they're not idiots

 

[Oddsocks]

You're jumping to conclusions. I agree all money is tainted and I've said as much numerous times. I haven't said I oppose LIV. What I oppose is the lies and masquerades.

If, for example, one of the players simply said they're doing it for the money I'd have no issue with that at all.

But you have failed to answer a direct and simple question.

 

[Deleted member 29109]

You're jumping to conclusions. I agree all money is tainted and I've said as much numerous times. I haven't said I oppose LIV. What I oppose is the lies and masquerades.

If, for example, one of the players simply said they're doing it for the money I'd have no issue with that at all.

Agreed. Take the Stenson statement. He used the words. Commercial decision. Others such as Bryson has said things like it’s a business decision.

Why not be honest and just say they wanted the fat stacks?

 

[Jimaroid]

But you have failed to answer a direct and simple.

I have no issue with GM running their business on their terms.

 

[HeftyHacker]

Agreed. Take the Stenson statement. He used the words. Commercial decision. Others such as Bryson has said things like it’s a business decision.

Why not be honest and just say they wanted the fat stacks?

Isn't what they've said (business/commercial decision) just PR speak for exactly that though (fat stacks)?

 

[Oddsocks]

I have no issue with GM running their business on their terms.

Surely if you have thoughts on the source of money, the ethics behind it and with companies and people that in your own words “ engage in reputation laundering and sportwashing “ then this is double standards and hypocrisy of the tallest order.

 

[Oddsocks]

Agreed. Take the Stenson statement. He used the words. Commercial decision. Others such as Bryson has said things like it’s a business decision.

Why not be honest and just say they wanted the fat stacks?

They have said exactly that, just in a pc friendly manor.

 

[pokerjoke]

Agreed. Take the Stenson statement. He used the words. Commercial decision. Others such as Bryson has said things like it’s a business decision.

Why not be honest and just say they wanted the fat stacks?

If you were changing jobs now you could be doing it for lots of reasons.
Yes a wage increase but also
Less hours
Less commuting
Not working Sundays
The opportunity to spend more time with the family.
So all in all a few reasons not just the money.

 

[Beezerk]

They have said exactly that, just in a pc friendly manor.

I just can’t believe people are losing their because some golfers haven’t said they are being greedy ?