Mandofred
Well-known member
Huh? I must be missing something. At the Olympics.....they show up with their own stuff. It just has to meet the standards before they can use it.
Different balls for the pros
- Thread starter jim8flog
- Start date
Mandofred
Well-known member
Goes in the oversize section or shipped through a specialty outfit I would think. If I were a vaulter (I tried....scared the heck out of me) the thought of my poles (they would have a bunch of them) going onto the carousel would be my worst nightmare.
USER1999
Grand Slam Winner
Sats
Challenge Tour Pro
Terrible idea.
PNWokingham
Journeyman Pro
I would not advocate tightening courses for normal play. the bunker set up is a different matter but any tournament couse wilkl know well in advance and it can then instigate measures to calm the bombing and make the pros think wigh rough pinch points etc
SGC001
Challenge Tour Pro
Then the problem is just shifted down the line, when playing the tier below elite amateur events... Easier and fairer to just change something for all.
The effect of equipment on technique is huge, edit while there at it they can decrease the size of them drivers so they are not as forgiving on off centre hits.
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Ye Olde Boomer
Well-known member
I still believe that pros should play the game as designed for us, not them, and if they start breaking sixty, I don't care.
It more accurately reflects the difference between a professional tournament player and a scratch playing club champion.
But perhaps I've forfeited my entitlement to an opinion, because my sixtieth season on the links isn't going to happen.
Covid 19 has beaten me. I'm now officially a former player, because I have no interest in playing differently than I always played before.
How long as it been since they banned steel spikes? I never stopped boiling over that.
What they're doing to the game now, though, has finished removing the allure for me.
It's not the game with which I fell in love in 1961, and that game, like so many other things that I miss, is never coming back.
Let this be a cautionary tale for those of you who are middle aged, because senior citizenship is just around the corner for you.
When you get there, you realize that you're still alive but you also discover that your world isn't.
You're now finishing out your days in a world made for somebody new.
It's not totally bad, though.
It's what fate does to remove your fear of dying.
By the way, I've got a brand new set of Titleist irons that haven't even been outdoors yet.
The set will probably see sunlight for the first time when they're emptying my home because my wife and are are both ashes in an urn.
It more accurately reflects the difference between a professional tournament player and a scratch playing club champion.
But perhaps I've forfeited my entitlement to an opinion, because my sixtieth season on the links isn't going to happen.
Covid 19 has beaten me. I'm now officially a former player, because I have no interest in playing differently than I always played before.
How long as it been since they banned steel spikes? I never stopped boiling over that.
What they're doing to the game now, though, has finished removing the allure for me.
It's not the game with which I fell in love in 1961, and that game, like so many other things that I miss, is never coming back.
Let this be a cautionary tale for those of you who are middle aged, because senior citizenship is just around the corner for you.
When you get there, you realize that you're still alive but you also discover that your world isn't.
You're now finishing out your days in a world made for somebody new.
It's not totally bad, though.
It's what fate does to remove your fear of dying.
By the way, I've got a brand new set of Titleist irons that haven't even been outdoors yet.
The set will probably see sunlight for the first time when they're emptying my home because my wife and are are both ashes in an urn.
Orikoru
Tour Winner
What the hell are you talking about? What have they done besides saying don't touch the flag??
USER1999
Grand Slam Winner
Club house is closed, so no meeting for brekkie, no lunch with a few beers and a chat, and no where indoors where you can wear your hat I guess.
Golf is not just about golf for many, and I am one of them.
badgermat
Club Champion
Haven't read the whole thread, but why on earth would anyone want to restrict how the pros play?
Who cares if they can drive 350m plus? Or hit a 56* wedge 150m? Or any other club any other distance.
The pro game should be the pinnacle of sporting achievement, anything less is a cheat or a failure. So the objective should be to get every hole in one. And until someone gets there, the game is secure.
bm
Who cares if they can drive 350m plus? Or hit a 56* wedge 150m? Or any other club any other distance.
The pro game should be the pinnacle of sporting achievement, anything less is a cheat or a failure. So the objective should be to get every hole in one. And until someone gets there, the game is secure.
bm
D
Deleted member 21258
Guest
I would say, just as they did in the javelin, the pros are hitting it out of the 'park'.
Therefore sense would say you will wind down the distance they hit it(or throw it in the javelin), with the ball being the clear choice as it affects all clubs and brings the ball 'back in the park' and courses back playable.
Long hitters will still be long etc
badgermat
Club Champion
But they're not "hitting it out of the park". No one has ever got close to scoring 18.
Golf is much more than just hitting the ball a long way. It's about accuracy and game strategy and all kinds of other things.
And until we can restrict all of those things, there's no reason to restrict the ball.
bm
GB72
Money List Winner
This is certainly a big part of the argument in that some courses on the PGA tour especially have also taken away the accuracy and strategy element. By having less than penal rough and bunkers to even that they are seen as a preferential place to put the ball if not on the fairway, some events have become a case of rip as far as you can. I think that the point has been made that scoring can be controlled by course design and set up or equipment but at the moment neither is really being looked at.
Grant85
Head Pro
I personally would be against this.
Main reason is it becomes a dreadful grey area for elite amateurs who are hoping to turn to pro and might even be playing in some pro events or qualifying events.
My solution would be as follows;
Roll back the equipment so that the very highest ball speeds and distances are reduced, but lower ball speeds are less so. The bigger hitters will still have an advantage, but the likes of Bryson and Rory won't be hitting it 40 yards past Webb Simpson and Graeme McDowell.
I'd be happy for this to be done with a ball that spins a bit more, as well as smaller headed drivers with slightly thicker faces. i.e. I wouldn't try and make this change by changing one thing. Bigger hitters have gotten bigger as a result of all of these equipment changes.
Obviously not much you can, or should, do in terms of the strength of players, allowing them to generate more club head speed. That's the law of the jungle.
Appreciate this has a big impact on the amatuer game as people have spent hundreds on equipment, and I guess the only real solution is to give plenty of time for new rules to come into effect and maybe even grandfather any clubs manufactured after a certain date to be allowed for an extended period.
Ultimately Bryson has 'gamed the system' in terms of working out there is a huge advantage by being able to hit the ball very far and reasonably straight and you can still compete at the top of the game with very average iron play, short game and putting.
The top players should be far more rounded and golf is better to see a short hitter make up for this differential with accuracy and a great short game.
In my view the importance of big hitting has gone too far and we will see very few short to average hitters come through the development tours. Once the likes of McDowell, Zach Johnson, Donald, Simpson, Furyk, Kisner etc. retire or drop off the tour, we will see only one type of player competing in the big events.
Orikoru
Tour Winner
Did nobody think of that before??
Everyone was talking about Bryson's driving, but ultimately he didn't even win the event. So nothing to see really. I don't know what Berger's driving average was, but I don't think he's known as being a longer driver than average is he? I guess until the huge drivers are winning events every single week we just carry on as we are.
Grant85
Head Pro
Another point I'd make is that back in the 80s and 90s you had guys like Greg Norman and John Daly. These guys could hit it a mile past other pros, even top players of the era. And they recorded huge drives that would rival the likes of Rory and Bryson's current numbers. But they didn't try and hit it like that in tournament play.
They had an advantage in terms of being further off the tee and playing maybe 2 clubs less into a green.
But the bottom line was the clubheads were smaller and the ball would spin far more, so they were seriously punished for a wayward shot. If they tried to murder it like Bryson is doing now, anything that was a bit out, they'd risk not seeing that ball again and playing 3 off the tee. So they had a decision to make. Play a controlled shot or take a big risk to get it further. Given the course, you have to decide how much risk you can take.
Nowadays it's not even a risk, even on a tighter set ups. The driver head is so big and the ball spin is so low, that they can swing as hard as they can on every tee box.
Maybe John Daly didn't make this calculation and he did try and murder it every time, but that's why he would have a couple of mega hot weeks, but wasn't very consistent.
They had an advantage in terms of being further off the tee and playing maybe 2 clubs less into a green.
But the bottom line was the clubheads were smaller and the ball would spin far more, so they were seriously punished for a wayward shot. If they tried to murder it like Bryson is doing now, anything that was a bit out, they'd risk not seeing that ball again and playing 3 off the tee. So they had a decision to make. Play a controlled shot or take a big risk to get it further. Given the course, you have to decide how much risk you can take.
Nowadays it's not even a risk, even on a tighter set ups. The driver head is so big and the ball spin is so low, that they can swing as hard as they can on every tee box.
Maybe John Daly didn't make this calculation and he did try and murder it every time, but that's why he would have a couple of mega hot weeks, but wasn't very consistent.
badgermat
Club Champion
Grant85
Head Pro
Did nobody think of that before??
Everyone was talking about Bryson's driving, but ultimately he didn't even win the event. So nothing to see really. I don't know what Berger's driving average was, but I don't think he's known as being a longer driver than average is he? I guess until the huge drivers are winning events every single week we just carry on as we are.
Just carry on, nothing to see...
Did you not watch the event. Bryson was driving it 350, leaving himself 60 yards to the pin and hitting shots that you or I would hate, spinning wedges back off the front of greens etc. And he had a putt on 18 to get into the playoff.
As I said, not hating on Bryson - he's figured things out and executed, but there should be more to it.
Golf must have more of a premium on other parts of the game or it is going to become hugely one dimensional and any strategy element will be completely gone from the sport.
Grant85
Head Pro
How is it a handicapping issue?
Elite amateurs playing in British or US amateur (no handicaps), qualifying for the Open or the Masters... and not being able to use the same ball they qualified with?
badgermat
Club Champion
The other poster was implying that there was something unfair in pros using the same ball as elite amateurs. That's how I understood them, at least.
As far as I can see, either you accept handicapping (so equipment is irrelevant), or you play scratch (where equipment should conform). You can't have it both ways.
bm
Edit – and for the avoidance of doubt, I think we should all play scratch. I'm rubbish, but there is a purity in knowing where I stand.
