USER1999
Grand Slam Winner
This is why having a 'pro' ball is the easiest solution.
Different balls for the pros
- Thread starter jim8flog
- Start date
HomerJSimpson
Hall of Famer
Monty has come out for bifurcation https://www.facebook.com/GolfMonthl...T1DNX4Wb3aFEBPtRV53rX-4k_Dc5eImtWyWwAI8Nq3vQc
BubbaP
Occasional Player of Golf
Sorry late to this thread but have to tell this story. Was probably about 12, and returning from a big easter holiday in the algarve. In the airport we spot Daley Thompson and some others - had my cap signed.
Once on the package Dan Air flight, Daley ends up sitting in front of me. But anyway the point was the whole aisle had to lift up our legs while they threaded all the poles under the seats!
Was DIY for the athletes back then.
Average driving distance of the top 10 longest drivers on PGA Tour :
1980 271
1990 277
2000 290 (Long John and Cat almost breach the 300 mark)
2010 308
2019 313
So over 40 yards increase in 40 years. And what has it done for the game ? Nothing other than spoil great golf courses, make the game less one of skill, increase the cost of golf course construction and maintenance, and increase the time to play a round.
Tail back the ball by 15% for all. Having a different ball for pros or tour is completely unnecessary and only brings another negative to the game.
Pros not being able to knock it passed 300 yards would be a great thing all round. The number of wedge shot seconds is just a farce these days. The game, and courses, were designed to provide a range of second shots right through the bag. And the game was much the better for it.
1980 271
1990 277
2000 290 (Long John and Cat almost breach the 300 mark)
2010 308
2019 313
So over 40 yards increase in 40 years. And what has it done for the game ? Nothing other than spoil great golf courses, make the game less one of skill, increase the cost of golf course construction and maintenance, and increase the time to play a round.
Tail back the ball by 15% for all. Having a different ball for pros or tour is completely unnecessary and only brings another negative to the game.
Pros not being able to knock it passed 300 yards would be a great thing all round. The number of wedge shot seconds is just a farce these days. The game, and courses, were designed to provide a range of second shots right through the bag. And the game was much the better for it.
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I dont understand this point of view at all, let alone the 'clearly'. Its all relative. A longer shot is only help if the course is long. Shorter course, shorter ball, and you're back where you started. When decent amateur golfers maxed out their drives at 200yards, the game was no more difficult for them. Or a five iron going 150 roll and all.
The longer ball and driver (for that is what it is for the amateur and his longer shots today) have brought the amateur nothing. The more forgiving big faced driver, maybe something. But only in the easy of getting a decent hit. The extra distance is not the real benefit. The gym bunny pros at the top end get something extra again, but if the distance of the gear was reined in, the benefit of out and out strength would be curtailed as well.
DanFST
Head Pro
Big boy Bryson would have definitely won the masters in 2016 then.
It would be nice if the rough was slightly more punishing, but nothing crazy. I'm confused as to how Bryson "gamed the system" his body change has taken huge amounts of work, it's not easy to just change body type. He identified that as his bet shot at winning, but he didn't win.
I want to see professionals in any sport being the best they can be, not handicapped in anyway. Hitting it long does not equate to a good score in this game.
Crow
Crow Person
You sound like an ideal candidate for playing vintage clubs!
Give me a shout if you're interested in more information.
Crow
Crow Person
He didn't win but he was only one shot off the winning score, a pretty good advert for Distance Wins.
Swinglowandslow
Well-known member
Your word exciting is obviously subjective. You find long hitting exciting( and of course, so do many others): some others ,though, find accuracy and ball control to be the best aspects of the game.
It has to be said that nowadays the courses are being reduced to driver and short iron.
This works because Pros rarely lose balls. There's always someone to see where their (off fairway) ball finishes up.
What needs to happen is that where it finishes up off the fairway is a really bad place to be.Either lost or unplayable.
(Apart from water hazards, when was the last time you saw a two club length drop from unplayable lie being taken by these Pros, because they were in a bush or Reed bed or whatever?)
However, you could manicure a course so that if you drive moderately you get pretty good lies.
Now the Rorys and Phils have a decision to make. Risk or reward?.
The Courses can be prepared to offer that, at relatively little expense and bother.
As things stand, with more and more young Pros coming on, none of whom are "short", we are likely to find the Tournaments becoming a putting competition.
Swinglowandslow
Well-known member
I agree that bit. But what is happening is that long hitters are going "off piste", and without much chance of losing the ball, and without much chance of finding an unplayable lie.
If those two factors were more likely, they would need to maybe change tactic, or get more accurate.
As it is, the game, for them, is just not hard enough
I watched some of this last night. A handsome course, a real enjoyment to watch. I saw players take 3 wood off the tee, irons off the tee and also some risk reward drivers to reach a green. The trees created problems if you were off line so it was not, on the whole, a bomb and gouge course. I found it a real pleasure and a better test than last weeks course where being off line was irrelevant. No need to change the ball on a course like that.
The problem is for the other courses that are not as well blessed, or designed.
D
Deleted member 3432
Guest
They still took it apart looking at the scoreboard.
Orikoru
Tour Winner
Yeah I watched a bit of that last night. Looked like a good course, Bryson and DJ didn't have the driver out that many times. The commentator said something like the average driving distance of the winners there has been 275, as opposed to the average on tour which is over 300.
Grizzly
Well-known member
Hardly - yes there were some low scores, but the weather had been wet earlier in the week and the greens were therefore holding well - and it was still only half the field that beat par. I sat there musing how well the course proved my argument that what we need is not bifurcation or regulation, its better choice and management of courses - the bombers had an advantage at times, but it came with a risk to it which meant that many of them decided against defaulting to driver on every hole.
They scored well but it was a different style of golf. Every golfer was capable of scoring well, it was not just about the bombers. You need an all round type of game to score well there, based on my limited viewing of the course.
I suspect it was also a style of course that they could toughen up each day quite easily via speed of greens. They will not be ripping it up on Sunday.
D
Deleted member 21258
Guest
You only have to look at these chart to see massive increases over the 50ish years.
Orikoru
Tour Winner
So the biggest leap was 1995 to 2005. But the ten years that followed that didn't see a great deal of change. So what happened in 1995 to cause that? Was it the ball or was it the bigger drivers?
D
Deleted member 21258
Guest
If I had to guess the big increase about 93 to 03 was down to :-
1) Better balls (think pro vi was about that timing, certainly better balls than penfolds or commandos
)2) Players starting to swing faster
3) More forgiving/straighter hitting drivers (how much of an effect on top long hitting pros that had, am not sure, as they find the middle of the face and COR was maxed out by them and restricted about 2003ish, guessing...)
4) Much better technology coming like flightscope/trackman ?(or that may have been after that period ?)
Even since 03 the distance has increase by 10ish yards
Balls I think is the biggest difference, but sure the information is out there, if you wish to do some research
D
Deleted member 3432
Guest
It would be the ideal track in my view if they very coming in from 30 yards further back, make it a great test of iron play. No better sight in golf than watching the best players working the ball with longer irons in their hands.
I don't think its a coincidence that Tiger is one of the best iron players of all time and probably still the best iron player on tour.
Start tricking up the greens and you are heading to US Open territory where you can make players look silly.
I agree. I am not saying they will do that but it is something they have up their sleeves on day 3 and 4. Just a little extra slickness, not take it off the scale.
