Countback............. !

[bladeplayer]

I have always thought that if the scores are level then it should be decided on who had the lowest gross score. Seems a better way to reflect who played the best golf.

Are you not changing the format of the comp you both entered then tho Mashie ? ie enterd a handicap comp & lost a gross comp ? favours the low person surely ? just a thought

Edit ,, sorry Jezz was typing mine as you posted yours

 

[User20205]

Not quite sure how you can resolve a handicap competition by reverting to gross scores. "In the event of a tie, the lower handicappers will always win" - doesn't quite seem fair...

I'm not sure the whole concept of handicapping is fair, necessary maybe, but not really fair

someone scabbing 3 shots to the green and sinking a 40 foot putt for a 4 point par didn't feel fair to me

 

[JezzE]

I'm not sure the whole concept of handicapping is fair, necessary maybe, but not really fair

someone scabbing 3 shots to the green and sinking a 40 foot putt for a 4 point par didn't feel fair to me

This would appear to be paving the way to the end of competitive golf as we know it at club level...

 

[Ethan]

I don't agree that lowest gross score should win. That is a clear bias. Much more sensible and fair to do as someone suggested on page 1, and use exact handicap and calculate the winner to one decimal place. Much less likely to still have a tie, although still possible.

 

[User20205]

This would appear to be paving the way to the end of competitive golf as we know it at club level...

either that or an incentive to reduce your handicap. Sometimes there seems to be very little reason, except for personal pride, to get lower.

whatever system there are winners and losers,. lowest gross as a last case scenario at least rewards the 'best' round

 

[Hobbit]

I'm not sure the whole concept of handicapping is fair, necessary maybe, but not really fair

someone scabbing 3 shots to the green and sinking a 40 foot putt for a 4 point par didn't feel fair to me

But by the very nature of the way they play, and their handicap, its not often a high handicapper can "scab" it around 18 holes and still win.

 

[chrisd]

Not quite sure how you can resolve a handicap competition by reverting to gross scores. "In the event of a tie, the lower handicappers will always win" - doesn't quite seem fair...

I agree and also it was a betterball pairs, so you couldn't know gross scores etc. There were holes that my partner and I did equally well on but only one of us was recorded on the card.

Our "Gold Letter" comps always have a play off in the event of a tie and minor placings are on countback.

As it's our golf week there are physical prizes at stake and not vouchers, so there is a need for outright winners and, as it happens, the Saturday competition was also decided on countback.


My reward was that I shot a 75 on the day off 11 handicap and played some of my best ever golf

 

[User20205]

But by the very nature of the way they play, and their handicap, its not often a high handicapper can "scab" it around 18 holes and still win.

agreed ! just sour grapes on my side.

However as a 9 handicapper, I would feel happy to lose to someone who had shot a well constructed lower gross round than me, no so happy to lose to gross 100, nett 72

 

[JezzE]

either that or an incentive to reduce your handicap. Sometimes there seems to be very little reason, except for personal pride, to get lower.

whatever system there are winners and losers,. lowest gross as a last case scenario at least rewards the 'best' round

The 'best' round in a gross competition, but not a handicap one...

 

[DaveM]

All this mucking about with the handicap to get a result is just sour grapes. Handicaps are there to make a level playing Field. So everyone can compete. So how could you then change it to gross. (sour grapes by low H/cers?).

Tell you what lets do away with handicaps. All play off scratch! Then three quarters of the people playing comps.Will not bother to enter.

Its swings and roundabouts. If A high handicapper wins on count back. Good luck to them. If you want to win, just play better, sorted.

 

[garyinderry]

i was beaten on countback a few weeks ago for a qualifier. sour grapes right here!

 

[User20205]

The 'best' round in a gross competition, but not a handicap one...

point taken I can't really play handicap comps and moan about losing based on handicap.

However we aren't talking about losing but what to do in the event of a tie. Countback maybe fair in as much as everyone knows the criteria before the start of the comp, but a round is played over 18 holes so why should the last 9/6/3 be more important ?

My handicap isn't especially low so I would probably lose more times than not in a club comp based on this. The lowest gross round at least is a fact that can't be contested.

Maybe the only fair method is a playoff, even a putting comp maybe more satisfactory (I would lose at that too!) but a least a winner would be decided by a golfing method.

 

[garyinderry]

for some of the bigger comps a play off or match play situation would be at least fair on those beat on BOT!

 

[JezzE]

point taken I can't really play handicap comps and moan about losing based on handicap.

However we aren't talking about losing but what to do in the event of a tie. Countback maybe fair in as much as everyone knows the criteria before the start of the comp, but a round is played over 18 holes so why should the last 9/6/3 be more important ?

My handicap isn't especially low so I would probably lose more times than not in a club comp based on this. The lowest gross round at least is a fact that can't be contested.

Maybe the only fair method is a playoff, even a putting comp maybe more satisfactory (I would lose at that too!) but a least a winner would be decided by a golfing method.

I understand people's concerns about countback, but given that many competitions do have to have an outright winner and play-offs are not often practical, then there has to be some commonly agreed way of resolving ties. But you could argue for and against any suggestion - even your putting play-off suggestion might be construed as unfair if one player's strength is his long game, and another's is his putting even if his long game is a little 'off'.

I imagine the reason for back nine is that it might just show who was performing best when the pressure was on at the end of a round, though of course this explanation falls down when a two-tee start is in operation and some are playing the back nine first.

Surely best just to accept that that's the way it is, and not lose too much sleep over it. Easy for me to say, of course, as it's some time since countback was of any more relevance to me than elevating me from 31st place to 29th or whatever!

 

[Region3]

I played in a 4BBB comp at the club at the weekend, the winner of which was to go on to represent the club at The Belfry in the next stage.

We came in with 41pts and were leading, knocking the previous leaders into 2nd on countback.
We got overtaken by the end of the comp by another pair on 41pts, but we lost on countback.

Swings and roundabouts.

I think people dislike countback because it has been misconstrued that it is a method of determining the best golfers on the day.
As pointed out previously - it isn't - it's just the golfing equivalent of a coin toss.

The one thing I like about it is that if you reach halfway and are doing just ok, you know a great back 9 gives you a good chance in the event of a tie.

Maybe a better way as far as golfing goes would be the most 3pt or better holes, or the least 1pt or worse holes?

 

[User20205]

Surely best just to accept that that's the way it is, and not lose too much sleep over it. Easy for me to say, of course, as it's some time since countback was of any more relevance to me than elevating me from 31st place to 29th or whatever!

sorry I don't know what came over me must be a slow Monday morning. I was giving the impression of really being passionate about reinventing the countback system. I'm sure if there was a better way it would be in use. The analogy of penalties is a good one, it feels unsatisfactory but no-one can come up with a better solution.

Maybe as said before I'm just bitter after crumbling on the back 9 more times than I care to remember :angry:

 

[chrisd]

I understand people's concerns about countback, but given that many competitions do have to have an outright winner and play-offs are not often practical, then there has to be some commonly agreed way of resolving ties. But you could argue for and against any suggestion - even your putting play-off suggestion might be construed as unfair if one player's strength is his long game, and another's is his putting even if his long game is a little 'off'.

I imagine the reason for back nine is that it might just show who was performing best when the pressure was on at the end of a round, though of course this explanation falls down when a two-tee start is in operation and some are playing the back nine first.

Surely best just to accept that that's the way it is, and not lose too much sleep over it. Easy for me to say, of course, as it's some time since countback was of any more relevance to me than elevating me from 31st place to 29th or whatever!

I agree Jezz, there is no fair way to seperate players other than a play off, which I said earlier we do in big competitions but for ordinary ones, countback is the only answer. I have both won and lost using countback and accept it.

In the case of a whole day comp a putting comp or similar is out of the question as the two teams involved could be 6 hours apart on the course and the first ones out could be sitting watching the footie while the second ones are finishing

 

[Hobbit]

for some of the bigger comps a play off or match play situation would be at least fair on those beat on BOT!

At my previous club any tied board comps went to an 18 hole play off the following day.

 

[chrisd]

CANCEL THIS THREAD!!!

Just had an email, one of the winning team did not have a current handicap and they were dq'd!

Should I feel guilty?

 

[garyinderry]

At my previous club any tied board comps went to an 18 hole play off the following day.

proper order! i would even agree to swopping numbers with whoever is tied and heading out at an arranged date to play off.