CONGU - End discrimination in golf competitions

[guest100718]

right on. I've signed

 

[Face breaker]

Personally I think the handicap system is utter bullshit, I think a grouping system would make more sense, for example group A would be 70-80, group B 80-90 and so on through group C/D/E etc etc, there should be a set number of shots per group, let's say 3 just for arguments sake.

So for instance if a 'group A' player was too play a 'group C' player then the 'group C' player would recieve a 6 shot advantage over the entire round.

The groupings could be worked out via the ole 3 card system or even your comp scores throughout the year, so if you consistently score between 80 and 90 in a comp then you'll be group B so you'll recieve 3 shots from a group A player or you'll lose 3 shots to a group C player. :thup:

 

[Trojan615]

'No man with 2 arms and 2 legs should ever have more than one shot per hole'

😂😂

Yep 🤔

 

[Deleted member 15344]

I see your point, but he has 17 more holes of help left. If you want to call extremes, then what about the poor chap off 1 playing matchplay with the 28 capper. The higher handicapper has 2 shots on six holes (if my maths is correct). We are going to have to agree to disagree I think as we all have our own views on this subject. I have made my opinions on the subject clear enough, and I understand the views of others. I don't want it to turn into another forum slanging match.
In answer to the OP. I won't be signing your petition.

This year in the summer KO I played against a 26 HC so had to give them 22 shots

I beat them 4&3

A Scratch golfer would 9 times out of ten beat a 28 HC in matchplay

 

[HomerJSimpson]

^^^^
This. If I had my way all competitive golf would be 18 max.

Easiest way to lose members. Many of the entrants in our club are over 18 and have been members for many years. If they weren't allowed to play off their full handicap in comps why bother being members. What benefit will you be getting?

 

[FairwayDodger]

This year in the summer KO I played against a 26 HC so had to give them 22 shots

I beat them 4&3

A Scratch golfer would 9 times out of ten beat a 28 HC in matchplay

It's not about winning or losing though. When the gap is so high any "competition" is ridiculously artificial and simply no fun whatsoever. One reason I don't play in my clubs knockout. I could easily have to give someone 34 shots in which case how well I play is irrelevant; all that matters is if they have a good day or not.

 

[Craigg]

Easiest way to lose members. Many of the entrants in our club are over 18 and have been members for many years. If they weren't allowed to play off their full handicap in comps why bother being members. What benefit will you be getting?

Someone else hasn't read the whole thread I see.

 

[Craigg]

This year in the summer KO I played against a 26 HC so had to give them 22 shots

I beat them 4&3

A Scratch golfer would 9 times out of ten beat a 28 HC in matchplay

I assume you have some data to back this up?

 

[Deleted member 15344]

Nope just experience of seeing the results of our KO matches and the KO matches I have had to play.

The problems aren't the high 20 HC's - it's the 10-18 HCs that can quite clearly play to lower than their HC - they are the dangerous ones

After years doing the HC and Comps at my place you can see exactly who the ones that will be the dangerous ones in comps and KO and it's not the high HC.

When i looked at the winners of our comps this year

In the board comps - one person over HC of 20 won one - a 28 HC won the big presidents comp with a net 67 - he beat me by one.

In the medals and Stablefords we have two divs 1-14 and 15 to 28 - the winners in div one are the guys from 8-13 and in div 2 it's the guys 15-21 plus we have two ladies win in the div 2.

 

[Break90]

Personally I think the handicap system is utter bullshit, I think a grouping system would make more sense, for example group A would be 70-80, group B 80-90 and so on through group C/D/E etc etc, there should be a set number of shots per group, let's say 3 just for arguments sake.

So for instance if a 'group A' player was too play a 'group C' player then the 'group C' player would recieve a 6 shot advantage over the entire round.

The groupings could be worked out via the ole 3 card system or even your comp scores throughout the year, so if you consistently score between 80 and 90 in a comp then you'll be group B so you'll recieve 3 shots from a group A player or you'll lose 3 shots to a group C player. :thup:

There is a system just like that, it's the current system however the 'groups' are 1 shot groups, not 10 shot groups.


Not great when a Group A player potentially off 8hcp (assuming a par 72 course) is drawn against a Group A player potentially off +2.

10 shot diff under current setup, would play off scratch in your suggested utopia.

Don't know too many 8 hcp who would stand much of a chance against a +2hcp to be honest.....

 

[HomerJSimpson]

Someone else hasn't read the whole thread I see.

Yes thank you. I just don't agree with your elitist stand regarding competitions and 18 handicap. One part of a wider picture but one I wanted to comment on

 

[guest100718]

suggesting no one should get more than 1 shot per hole is golf snobbery at its finest. standard fare for quite a few on here though.

 

[Craigg]

Yes thank you. I just don't agree with your elitist stand regarding competitions and 18 handicap. One part of a wider picture but one I wanted to comment on

It's nothing to do with elitism, but it's your prerogative to disagree. I can take it.

suggesting no one should get more than 1 shot per hole is golf snobbery at its finest. standard fare for quite a few on here though.

If you say so

 

[Fyldewhite]

I read with a smile that David Bernstein, David Davies, Greg Dyke, Alex Horne and David Triesman believe the FA is run by elderly white men, and that suggestions for improvement are systematically road-blocked often before discussion.

They could so easily have been describing golf.

So much for freedom of speech, equality, and removing discrimination.

Every golf club member can obtain an authorised handicap, and then compete equitably world-wide regardless of golfing prowess.

However, the rules of golf allow clubs to have competitions with a maximum allowance of say 18 for men. This means one chap who scored 4 more than his/her handicap could hand in a scorecard with say 90-16=74. Another golfer with a handicap of 28 who scores 4 better than his handicap would write 94-18=76. Guess what, the player who played worse relative to his handicap would win!!

If anyone feels the rules should be changed (for both men and women), please sign the petition to persuade CONGU to End DISCRIMINATION in golf competitions: https://www.change.org/p/congu-end-discrimination-in-golf-competitions

We have an open comp for players 0-9 handicap. We have another for 10-18. Sure if you are off 25 you could enter and play off the maximum but why on earth would you do that? Maybe just play in the other 95% of competitions we run that don't have limits. Or maybe practice a bit more? I'm not being elitist in saying that btw, when I started I had an ambition to play in the 0-9 handicap Open, it's the Club's biggest day of the year. If it was "just another comp", open to everyone, then it wouldn't be. I never once thought I was being discriminated against so I'm afraid I won't be signing your petition. Good luck with that.

 

[351DRIVER]

Obviously haven't read the whole thread then.

If it is ok with you, i will post on whichever part of the thread I want, i was not aware that we had to have our posts approved by you first.

 

[Papas1982]

Golf handicaps if legit work perfectly well IMO.

If if they are false then of course they will favour a person who's got the higher one.

But imo, if you have a sub 10 handicapper versus a 28. The 10 will win more often, but the 28 will win more empthatically when they have a good day.

Handicaps are are what makes the sport appealing to the masses. Enabling all groups to play one another whilst striving to improve yours.

If when i began someone didn't want to give me more than a shot a hole I'd have simply let them enjoy their round on their own!

 

[351DRIVER]

Golf handicaps if legit work perfectly well IMO.

If if they are false then of course they will favour a person who's got the higher one.

But imo, if you have a sub 10 handicapper versus a 28. The 10 will win more often, but the 28 will win more empthatically when they have a good day.

Handicaps are are what makes the sport appealing to the masses. Enabling all groups to play one another whilst striving to improve yours.

If when i began someone didn't want to give me more than a shot a hole I'd have simply let them enjoy their round on their own!

Agree 100%

 

[harpo_72]

Not sure if 18 is that difficult to play to if you take a " boring " course management approach. Was talking to my Dad, asked what club did he consistently hit longest and what distance, he said 3 hybrid 150 yards ... 3 of those is 450, 4 of those is 600 go and practice putting and 18 isn't such a difficult proposition.
I'll get my coat now.

 

[Ross61]

Not sure if 18 is that difficult to play to if you take a " boring " course management approach. Was talking to my Dad, asked what club did he consistently hit longest and what distance, he said 3 hybrid 150 yards ... 3 of those is 450, 4 of those is 600 go and practice putting and 18 isn't such a difficult proposition.
I'll get my coat now.

Very simplistic.
Only problem is always hitting in straight, getting the long approach shot to land on the green. Let alone ponds, bunkers, trees, dog legs, wind etc.
I know many high handicappers that desperately would like to play to an 18 handicap (myself included... 21.5 at present). I can assure you it is not for the lack of trying. Why can some low handicappers not understand that there are people that are simply not physically gifted enough to take a back swing and return it to the ball and strike it cleanly with even 75% consistency?

 

[harpo_72]

Very simplistic.
Only problem is always hitting in straight, getting the long approach shot to land on the green. Let alone ponds, bunkers, trees, dog legs, wind etc.
I know many high handicappers that desperately would like to play to an 18 handicap (myself included... 21.5 at present). I can assure you it is not for the lack of trying. Why can some low handicappers not understand that there are people that are simply not physically gifted enough to take a back swing and return it to the ball and strike it cleanly with even 75% consistency?

Fair point, but have you tried half a back swing and full follow through?
The pros kind of mislead, they have fantastic timing and balance. It is understanding that your not doing this everyday and working out your strengths and weaknesses. But as others have said they are content with their handicaps. I was just trying to change the thought process and approach.