Competitive vs Recreational handicaps

[Highfade]

Could a potential solution to sandbagging simply be that a player has 2 handicaps?

1 considered to be their recreational, no pressure, game with your buddies handicap. Lateral drops, gimmes etc.
and the other is their white tees, tournament conditions, paired with randoms in organised club arranged competitions handicap.

This could potentially close the loophole on any player considering planning ahead for the club championship by submitting a wave of high scores to artificially raise their handicap as these scores posted in friends games would not count for competitions.

I also think competitions could be subdivided into 4 skill categories.
For example.
Class A. +0.0 and better.
B. 0.1-9.0
C. 9.1-18
D. 18.1+
Also a Gross score category.

That way it could be more inclusive and incentivise more players to enter as they have more opportunities for recognition with the potential for multiple winners per competition.

So many people are put off entering competitions assuming it will be won by the 18 handicap submitting a -10 net.

Our club has a toptracer range and has a winter league with prizes such as vouchers and rounds at top courses.
Last years winner was a 24 handicap who once posted a 21 net for the pebble beach 9 hole challenge round.

 

[NearHull]

No

 

[Neilds]

I sort of have 2 already. My WHS one that will be used for proper golf and then my winter society handicap is 1 shot lower as I came 2nd in the first competition so get a cut.

 

[DickInShorts]

Clubs already have the ability to create divisions in competitions to split ‘abilities’ - we have 3 for men’s and ladies and 2 for senior men’s. For info we usually have about 90entries for our senior men’s.

Regarding drawn competitions x- this wouldn’t work for us as their sheet is full from 7.30 to about 12.30 and players have their own preferred times- it is after all a social game. My previous club had draws in hour long slots for the club championship (4rounds) but you ended up with regularly playing with the same people over a few years

 

[rulefan]

So many people are put off entering competitions assuming it will be won by the 18 handicap submitting a -10 net.

How often does that happen in real life, not anecdotally ?

 

[Voyager EMH]

The best I can do is report "real life" at my club - but that is "anecdotal".

Very often it does happen at my club, but with by a tiny minority of very low handicappers in only a few competitions during the year.
And this is more frequent and prevalent than before WHS.

 

[Swango1980]

The comments will be interesting when a player had a reacreational handicap of 7, and a competition handicap of 20. Or vice versa.

And which handicap would be used for match play comps, or Open team events where scores cannot be submitted for handicap?

 

[Orikoru]

No

Simple as that really. Doesn't work at all. As soon as anyone wins off their 'competitive' handicap, and people find out their 'recreational' handicap is 3 shots lower, then all hell will break loose.

Plus there's already enough numbers floating about with index, course hcap, playing hcap, etc. I don't think we need any more.

 

[NearHull]

Still No.

Move on, nothing to see here.

 

[Highfade]

Fair enough.
Appreciate the feedback.
Was simply interested in perspectives.

 

[Swango1980]

Fair enough.
Appreciate the feedback.
Was simply interested in perspectives.

What would be interesting though would be to still have a single handicap, but to easily see what your handicap would be using only GP scores and what it would be using just Comps scores.

I believe handicap committees can already drill in to that information. Perhaps not allow others (outside admin) to see that info, as it may result in accusations flying around. But at least for the player to view that level of detail about their own handicap.

 

[rulefan]

And this is more frequent and prevalent than before WHS.

?

 

[D-S]

?

And apparently it is a ‘tiny minority’ in a ‘few competitions’ so not exactly easy to track.

Perhaps there are other ‘tiny’ groups who did not enter a ‘few competitions’ pre WHS which might counter balance this.

 

[Voyager EMH]

?

?

 

[Arthur Wedge]

I already have three HCs -

My HI that is used in comps etc

I have a HC in one swindle ( +2 ) and a HC in another swindle ( +1 )

 

[doublebogey7]

How often does that happen in real life, not anecdotally ?

Are lowest score in the 5 seasons since the introduction of WHS, is 8 under. The average winning score in our majors during that time is just under 5 under and almost identical to the average in the year prior to it's introduction. Personally I've seen little of the legendary low scores people on here talk about except the odd one or two in BB or AMAM opens.

 

[Voyager EMH]

We had 4 trophy comps, or board comps, won this year with scores of

PH 23 shot 14 over par, SD 11.3
PH 17 shot 9 over par, SD 7.0
PH 15 shot 6 over par, SD 4.5
PH 12 shot 3 over par, SD 1.9

Well payed those 4 chaps!

 

[rulie]

We had 4 trophy comps, or board comps, won this year with scores of

PH 23 shot 14 over, SD 11.3
PH 17 shot 9 over, SD 7.0
PH 15 shot 6 over, SD 4.5
PH 12 shot 3 over, SD 1.9

Well payed those 4 chaps!

I presume the Handicap Committee are doing their reviews?

 

[IanM]

We had 4 trophy comps, or board comps, won this year with scores of

PH 23 shot 14 over, SD 11.3
PH 17 shot 9 over, SD 7.0
PH 15 shot 6 over, SD 4.5
PH 12 shot 3 over, SD 1.9

Well payed those 4 chaps!

Apparently this never happens!

 

[wjemather]

We had 4 trophy comps, or board comps, won this year with scores of

PH 23 shot 14 over, SD 11.3
PH 17 shot 9 over, SD 7.0
PH 15 shot 6 over, SD 4.5
PH 12 shot 3 over, SD 1.9

Well payed those 4 chaps!

Well played indeed... but perhaps not nearly as well played as one could be mislead into believing as their PHs could be significantly higher (or lower) than HI (which is the only figure that can be compared to the SD) depending on Slope and the difference between CR and Par.