Club Pros and Assistants in club competitions

[D-S]

As a Professional can easily now maintain a valid WHS Handicap, does your club allow them in your competitions?

Many/most assistant Club Pros are reasonable golfers but many wouldn't get into the County side. A lot play little or no competitive golf and those that do hardly make any money at all from the regional PGA events. I would guess that are quite a few amateurs that earn more money from winning golf prizes than most Pros. Is there a good reason as to why you wouldn't/don't allow them to play in club comps?

 

[Doon frae Troon]

Yes, but not in inter club matches or club Scratch events.

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

Our assistants can make a reasonably decent income from lessons - we have a relatively wealthy membership so plenty of members looking for teaching. They also do all our junior and academy coaching and so are able to develop personal coaching income streams. Besides. The winnings from any club comp is only going to be equivalent to a lesson or two - and I don't think it would be a good look were our ass pros to be walking away with some of what is a members comp prize pot. There are some - more fun (so other than medals and board)- club comps that I think they can and do enter.

That said they do play a fair bit of golf with their mates in the club - there may well be some side bets going on in these.

 

[Arthur Wedge]

All the Pros and Assistants at the club are not members - the Pro Shop is a franchise so the assistant is employed by the Pro - so they can’t play in any club comps

 

[Lord Tyrion]

I can see that causing bad feeling amongst the membership, after all, they don't pay subs do they? Equally, if they are playing in comps, are they doing the job they are paid to do, be available in the shop or for lessons. There are lots of local PGA events about, there certainly are up here, and if you become a club pro, that is where you play your competitions.

 

[Burnsey]

I enjoy a knock with our club pro, but no, he doesn't play in club comps.

 

[Arthur Wedge]

As a Professional can easily now maintain a valid WHS Handicap, does your club allow them in your competitions?

Many/most assistant Club Pros are reasonable golfers but many wouldn't get into the County side. A lot play little or no competitive golf and those that do hardly make any money at all from the regional PGA events. I would guess that are quite a few amateurs that earn more money from winning golf prizes than most Pros. Is there a good reason as to why you wouldn't/don't allow them to play in club comps?

They won’t be members of the club

 

[jim8flog]

Pros were always welcome to play in our winter open.
There was a time when we had several.

When I first told our pros they could have handicaps it was met with derision. However I have since learnt that our manager (a PGA pro at the time) has been told by the club where he went to he must have a handicap. He is still a good player and I understand his H/C is 2.

 

[jim8flog]

They won’t be members of the club

Not necessarily true. We gave lifetime membership to one of our Pros in recognition of their achievements on tour.

 

[Lucifer MorningStar]

That’s actually a really interesting question. I can imagine for some people playing with the Pro/Assistant would shatter their illusions that these players are in some cases not any better than the Clubs lowest/Best Am’s (there’ll always be that mysticism that club players want their pro to be better than them)

Also a lot of members will be aggrieved at essentially an employee or franchisee who is not a member and doesn’t pay subs taking part in their competitions.

I think a happy medium would be maybe add a roll up comp each month to the schedule. Alternative months it could be a mid week comp and weekend the other months gives all members chance to play then. Have it as a beat the pro event Stableford prizes are shop vouchers and top prize includes a free lesson. That way the pro gets to mix it with the members, they get a fun comp and something back from them.

My first club had a 4BBB comp Pro & Captain vs members ran over the playing season can’t remember exactly how it worked out overall but was always Well received.

 

[AussieKB]

Majority of clubs in OZ the Pro and Assistants play in the competition, cannot win anything, we even have DP World Tour Pro's playing, it's good for the members to get the odd game with them, sometimes they even give a tip or two.

 

[Arthur Wedge]

Not necessarily true. We gave lifetime membership to one of our Pros in recognition of their achievements on tour.

Ok - beyond the one rare exception when a pro is a member 99.999999% of the Pros will be employed by the club and not members

 

[jim8flog]

Ok - beyond the one rare exception when a pro is a member 99.999999% of the Pros will be employed by the club and not members

According to the commentators on SKY quite a few touring pros are members of clubs.

 

[irip]

The last place I was a member any of the staff could be a member as well.
They had to pay the same fees but no joining fee was charged to them.
If they choose not to be a member they were allowed to play the course (certain times only) but not allowed to play comps or represent the club in any fixtures.

That seems like a fair approach to me

 

[Arthur Wedge]

According to the commentators on SKY quite a few touring pros are members of clubs.

So they arent the club pros then

 

[Lucifer MorningStar]

According to the commentators on SKY quite a few touring pros are members of clubs.

That’s a little bit different to a PGA pro who works for the club or as a contracted franchisee of a club providing a service of lessons and sales to a Tour player with zero affiliation paying to be a member somewhere to play in their down time and having somewhere to practice.

Plus someone like Rory paying to be a member at Wentworth or The many that are Members of Queenwood is vastly different from Pete the club pro at our local places!

 

[Arthur Wedge]

That’s actually a really interesting question. I can imagine for some people playing with the Pro/Assistant would shatter their illusions that these players are in some cases not any better than the Clubs lowest/Best Am’s (there’ll always be that mysticism that club players want their pro to be better than them)

Also a lot of members will be aggrieved at essentially an employee or franchisee who is not a member and doesn’t pay subs taking part in their competitions.

I think a happy medium would be maybe add a roll up comp each month to the schedule. Alternative months it could be a mid week comp and weekend the other months gives all members chance to play then. Have it as a beat the pro event Stableford prizes are shop vouchers and top prize includes a free lesson. That way the pro gets to mix it with the members, they get a fun comp and something back from them.

My first club had a 4BBB comp Pro & Captain vs members ran over the playing season can’t remember exactly how it worked out overall but was always Well received.

We have a Capt/Pro challenge during the year - once a month they take on a pair of members for charity

The Pro also plays in things like - Capt vs Vice , Club vs Staff and Club vs President etc

There are two lads who work for him that play in comps but they are also members

 

[wjemather]

I can see that causing bad feeling amongst the membership, after all, they don't pay subs do they? Equally, if they are playing in comps, are they doing the job they are paid to do, be available in the shop or for lessons. There are lots of local PGA events about, there certainly are up here, and if you become a club pro, that is where you play your competitions.

At most clubs, there are at least a few members who don't pay subs. In addition to honorary and life memberships, at many clubs, staff get free membership as a benefit, and this often extends to the pro shop and franchisees.

The implication of your subsequent point is that pros cannot enjoy their free time playing golf at the club where they work, which has to be wrong.

 

[Lord Tyrion]

At most clubs, there are at least a few members who don't pay subs. In addition to honorary and life memberships, at many clubs, staff get free membership as a benefit, and this often extends to the pro shop and franchisees.

The implication of your subsequent point is that pros cannot enjoy their free time playing golf at the club where they work, which has to be wrong.

The question was not 'should the pro / assistant be able to play the course?'. It was 'should they be able to play the competitions'. That is a very different thing. I don't think members would mind them playing the course, they probably expect them to. Playing in comps and taking their money, that's a different beast.

Honorary and life memberships are passed on by the club, members understand this. At the clubs I have been a member of staff do not get free membership. If they want to play the course, they pay the subs or the green fee. I'd particularly expect that if they were a franchise, so not even a club employee.

 

[Arthur Wedge]

At most clubs, there are at least a few members who don't pay subs. In addition to honorary and life memberships, at many clubs, staff get free membership as a benefit, and this often extends to the pro shop and franchisees.

The implication of your subsequent point is that pros cannot enjoy their free time playing golf at the club where they work, which has to be wrong.

Honorary and Life members are normally for people that have been members for a significant period of time

Don’t know many members clubs where staff get free membership

Any staff member at the club that wants to be a member pays the going rate