6 Nations

[MegaSteve]

Think this is another 'sporting' thread that is heading the way of going tits up like the footie ones do....

 

[selwood90]

I'm a massive fan of the game, played it at a good level. Played for county then got selected for 3 counties and went on tour with the 3 counties side. Had to give up because of work. Like people say, it's not going to happen overnight. This was by no means a great showing, do England have the making of a great side? In my opinion yes. I'm personally just not sure Hartley is a leader. He has all on keeping a lid on his own game, nevermind the 14 other blokes on the pitch

 

[HomerJSimpson]

Think this is another 'sporting' thread that is heading the way of going tits up like the footie ones do....

Looks like it and not hard to see why. Shame. On a positive side I was impressed with the Italian performance in Paris

 

[User20205]

expect i watch more than most as i bet on it a lot, also watch a lot of the southern hemisphere rugby which is where a lot of my gripes come from, the difference is so large and we only realise it each time the world cup comes around

You give the impression of knowing your stuff, esp re sarries. I'm not involved or watch as much as I used to, but at least I don't pretend I do. It's a bit like the football thread where the same old tabloid/twitter opinions are regurgitated. England were dire :blah:

I was surprised at Jones' first team, thought it was conservative, but I suspect he wants to evolved an already strong group.

I agree re the Southern Hemisphere but it's not necessarily about skill level, more about mindset.

 

[User20205]

Looks like it and not hard to see why. Shame. On a positive side I was impressed with the Italian performance in Paris

No petty tribalism on here, just I'm not having the ' England were poor, should be chucking it around, rather lose that win like that' drivel

 

[Doon frae Troon]

So you wouldn't celebrate if Scotland beat England at any sport ? Regards of who the game was played

Ok....... I shall make this easy for you If Scotland played England at football and the Scottish team hoofed the ball and the players all over the park, provoked the opposition players so two got sent off and won 1-0 with a disputed penalty............NO I WOULD NOT CELEBRATE.
I really do not understand the second part of that question.

 

[fundy]

You give the impression of knowing your stuff, esp re sarries. I'm not involved or watch as much as I used to, but at least I don't pretend I do. It's a bit like the football thread where the same old tabloid/twitter opinions are regurgitated. England were dire :blah:

I was surprised at Jones' first team, thought it was conservative, but I suspect he wants to evolved an already strong group.

I agree re the Southern Hemisphere but it's not necessarily about skill level, more about mindset.

Yeah am a Sarries fan, have been since i had a trial there as a kid when they were several leagues below the top flight!!!

The really huge difference between NH and SH seems to be at the breakdown, the game is just so much quicker in this phase in the SH which gives the attacking side far more options and makes it so much harder for the defending side to kill the game, yet seems to be the biggest issue for England rugby and one we dont want to try and fix

 

[GB72]

Part of the breakdown issue is also down to how it is reffed but agree we lack a decent 7. Give it s few months then see if we pick O'Connor from Tigers. He looks the real deal, is England qualified and would accept the call up. Sadly he was injured just at the wrong time. Daly will get a shot but Joseph has shown enough to get another go despite playing in a pretty woeful bath side. Think the decision to pick Care over Youngs was vindicated, front row looked so much more solid and defence held well. Jones needed to get the basics right and after the world cup any win was important to start building confidence. Expect some changes for the safer home fixture against itlay next week

 

[Hobbit]

I thought Scotland played to their strengths and could have won the first half. I thought they spoiled well, got in the faces of the England forwards but ran out of energy in the second half.

i thought Jones put out a conservative squad, as it's a squad game these days, and got what he played for. That said, there isn't much strength in depth in England rugby these days. There's a solid core, which he picked, and some good league players who will only ever be league players if they're not brought on properly. I just hope Jones does that.

As to Hartley. Whatever he did in the past is history at this moment in time. If he does it again he should be consigned to history. Would I have picked him? I've done it with a problem child and it worked, but I wouldn't have done it at this level.

 

[Deleted member 15344]

Yeah am a Sarries fan, have been since i had a trial there as a kid when they were several leagues below the top flight!!!

The really huge difference between NH and SH seems to be at the breakdown, the game is just so much quicker in this phase in the SH which gives the attacking side far more options and makes it so much harder for the defending side to kill the game, yet seems to be the biggest issue for England rugby and one we dont want to try and fix

Is not a lot of it down to the superior individual skills of a lot of the SH players - 1 through to 15 being comfortable on the ball and each own able to handle the ball with confidence so they get into the breakdown quick and seem at ease with picking it up and looking for gaps and releasing the ball and not being bothered if it's a Prop or a wing on their shoulder

Think England do have the players to improve massively - Daly and Itodje are two clear ones with George IMO one player who should be amongst those two and can see Jones bringing them in over the 6 Nations

Just think he went with what was safe first time around to get a win under their belt and then look to build

Against Italy can see Daly in for Ford with Farrell going to 10 and Itojde in for Lawes/Launchbury.

 

[fundy]

Is not a lot of it down to the superior individual skills of a lot of the SH players - 1 through to 15 being comfortable on the ball and each own able to handle the ball with confidence so they get into the breakdown quick and seem at ease with picking it up and looking for gaps and releasing the ball and not being bothered if it's a Prop or a wing on their shoulder

Think England do have the players to improve massively - Daly and Itodje are two clear ones with George IMO one player who should be amongst those two and can see Jones bringing them in over the 6 Nations

Just think he went with what was safe first time around to get a win under their belt and then look to build

Against Italy can see Daly in for Ford with Farrell going to 10 and Itojde in for Lawes/Launchbury.

not really no, the big difference is they clear the breakdown out properly, albeit as Greg has alluded to it is reffed a little differently. they pick proper opensides who get there first and fight for the ball as there prior objective and the rest of the forwards hit the rucks with aggression and clear the other side out

 

[Deleted member 15344]

not really no, the big difference is they clear the breakdown out properly, albeit as Greg has alluded to it is reffed a little differently. they pick proper opensides who get there first and fight for the ball as there prior objective and the rest of the forwards hit the rucks with aggression and clear the other side out

So the question is who is the open side they should look at ?

Kvesic
Armitage
Clark
Clifford

Or wait for O Connor ?

 

[fundy]

So the question is who is the open side they should look at ?

Kvesic
Armitage
Clark
Clifford

Or wait for O Connor ?

Armitage is by far the best player but politics involved sadly and they clearly arent going to pick him now having overlooked him at the world cup, which is a real shame imo, he is basically what we need and the complete finished article

I like Kvesic a lot and O Connor clearly well thought of albeit Ive not seen enough of him to judge

 

[Doon frae Troon]

Define playing it properly? England did OK. Nothing more. Ford was quiet, Joseph under used, Haskell did OK @
Openside.

Murray field was always going to be hard especially after the scotch performance against the Aussies but the result was never in doubt.

It's about building teams, you don't do that with wholesale changes to a team that has a good core, the fella from sarries and Daly may be included next week.

Time of year when all the arm chair fans come out, myself included. Who here can honestly say they watch the premiership week in week out (apart from gb72?)

I was replying to LP silly wee question on that.

England played within the rules of the game, and were the stronger team.
I just would not wish to buy a ticket to see them playing like that on a regular basis.
I would love to see England playing 'unleashed'. So many of their teams seem to go on the field with a 'do not lose' mentality rather than a 'win with style' one.

[PS It's Scots, not Scotch which I believe is an alcoholic drink]

 

[Deleted member 15344]

Armitage is by far the best player but politics involved sadly and they clearly arent going to pick him now having overlooked him at the world cup, which is a real shame imo, he is basically what we need and the complete finished article

I like Kvesic a lot and O Connor clearly well thought of albeit Ive not seen enough of him to judge

Is Armitage really the better or was his stock put higher because he wasn't available ?

Kvesic was very impressive last time I saw him

 

[fundy]

Is Armitage really the better or was his stock put higher because he wasn't available ?

Kvesic was very impressive last time I saw him

Armitage in a different league to the other options imo, just pure class

 

[User20205]

[PS It's Scots, not Scotch which I believe is an alcoholic drink]

Really I didn't know ......

 

[Deleted member 15344]

Armitage in a different league to the other options imo, just pure class

They were talking about it last night before the Bath game and Dalliglio had Kvesic as the man to go to

 

[Val]

Nit one for the purists that one. Scotland will never have a better opportunity to beat England IMO we just didn't compete hard enough in the ugly side of the game. Utterly disappointed but I'll live. Well done England, you deserved it yesterday, sometimes ugly games just need seen out and that is exactly what England done.

As for the respect the kicker comment, unfortunately it's crept in to many stadiums now but that's the first I've heard it as loud at Murrayfield.

Massive hangover today, had a good night in Edinburgh and got some great craic with some smashing England fans, that's what sets rugby apart from other sports. Passion for your team with passion for a good time afterwards.

 

[upsidedown]

Agree with you there Val, thought the first half was enthralling with Scotland very much back in the game and were not for two missed kicks could have been 5 to the good.
England just too good in the second half although had we scored early doors who knows what the outcome could have been.

Nurse that hangover well, have had too many journeys South after epic post match nights in the fair city to recall For some reason after the Irish games always seemed to be the worse