Your Club's Course Rating & Slope Index

[rulefan]

As I've said before. Par has little to to with SSS rating (ie difficulty).

18 x 300 yard par 4s length 5400 = par 72 (SSS 66ish)
18 x 400 yard par 4s length 7200 = par 72 (SSS 74ish)

 

[jim8flog]

I understand but it is that extra conversion that complicates. I have to be honest, I don't think I have ever heard golfers talk about SSS outside of this forum. Most people turn up, mark their h/c on the card, play, record their score and away they go. Bar chat is never about SSS or CSS, but maybe that is just the circles I play in

I guess use of the table will ultimately be like when comps give you 90% of h/c, 7/8 etc so I guess we will get used to doing that. I'm pleased I follow this forum as it should have sunk in by the time the system is in place.

Hovisbap, thanks for the post.

I should add, I fully understand why the system has been brought in and that slope will be a good thing. It is just the enacting it that is not so simple.

Yes it is one of the problems - getting players to understand SSS/CSS. I even play in one swindle where you get a 2 shot cut for playing to your handicap because the organiser does not understand the principle.

 

[OLgolfer]

Yes, but you know only to well that the underlying issue (an inherent belief that the target is par) will never go away for the vast majority of players.
It's the 'in your face' reference point and is as automatic as assuming 36 stableford points is playing to your handicap (see the 26 billion posts that make that assumption on there every year for proof...).
It's all in the mind, it's flawed, but it's powerful

This is a good point.

Majority of weekend or casual golfers do not know (or care) about SSS and CSS. They simply think shooting 36 points = I played to my handicap. My whole group of mates are like this, and I have endless arguments with them about this. With these people (dare i say who are the majority of golfers?), the new system will make very little difference, other than they might choose to learn a little more as they may get some more shots based on the slope/course handicap.

They will still go out and try to shoot 36 points...

 

[Lord Tyrion]

That is a little surprising as the CSS is used to determine any handicap adjustment. This will go of course. Handicaps will be adjusted on the basis of how you played, not everyone else.

Most just want to play, see what their score is at the end of the round, will they win any money? They would like a cut but don't sit and work out whether it will happen. They wait for the update from HDID and have no interest in how it changes, just does it change? Reluefan, you are one of the committed ones, far more of the turn up and play (nothing wrong with that as it largely includes me as well)

 

[Deleted member 15344]

98% of club golfers don’t care about SSS or CSS or slope etc - they know their HC , they turn up , play put their card in then wait for the results and any HC alteration

Same with away comps - enter with CDH which will have your up to date HC - play and then await the results

It will be the same with the new system - people will just play and see where they come and if there is a HC change , same when they go to Away comps

People already playing in swindles with different HC systems etc

This will just be a new one which I suspect will reduce HC slightly compared to the current system - and people will just carry on regardless

 

[OLgolfer]

Most just want to play, see what their score is at the end of the round, will they win any money? They would like a cut but don't sit and work out whether it will happen. They wait for the update from HDID and have no interest in how it changes, just does it change? Reluefan, you are one of the committed ones, far more of the turn up and play (nothing wrong with that as it largely includes me as well)

I'm hoping (and expect) that under the new system you simply turn up, work out what your course handicap is for that day based on the tees you are playing... then just play and submit your score as usual. The behind the scenes stuff will take care of everything else and the next day you'll know how your handicap has changed.

So all I can see, is there is 1 extra step needed which is to work out your course handicap for the day. Which, as has been mentioned before, is as easy as looking at a chart or using an app. Very very simple.

 

[OLgolfer]

Ok ladies and gents, the Australian system is pretty much closely aligned to how the WHS is going to work for you back in the UK. For the insomniacs amoungst you, here is a link that gives you the best chance of understanding how the WHS is going to affect you and some explanation.

www.golf.org.au/handicappingandcourserating

Happy reading.
Long and short I’ve found since moving to Aus, your handicap won’t change much from what it was. You will probably end up getting two shots extra at really tough courses.dont worry about working it out. The scorecards are all automated and gives you the handicap for the day on the course you are playing....simples

Please don’t come back with Aus and Whs will be different, I give you it as an example of ONLY HOW IT WILL ROUGHLY WORK....

I've gone back and looked at my comps and worked out my new handicap under the new system (I've used the basis from the Aussie guide above so it won't be completely accurate), but my new HANDICAP INDEX would be 8.6. My current exact is 9.3.

 

[duncan mackie]

I've gone back and looked at my comps and worked out my new handicap under the new system (I've used the basis from the Aussie guide above so it won't be completely accurate), but my new HANDICAP INDEX would be 8.6. My current exact is 9.3.

And on both your white and yellows that would equate to a playing handicap of 10...so the world isn't going to go through any shattering events soon 🤔

 

[OLgolfer]

And on both your white and yellows that would equate to a playing handicap of 10...so the world isn't going to go through any shattering events soon 🤔

Not at all. Now I'm armed with a little knowledge to bore my group of mates with

 

[OLgolfer]

No need for phones, just pick up the slope rating sheet from the office

I spend a fair bit of time in Spain with the in-laws living there and they have exactly this at their club, which is soo simple, and it also allows them to do multi tee comps which is also great.

However, I guess the Spanish calculate the playing handicap differently to the USGA? If I were to play off your White tees at Peralada with my exact handicap of 9.3, I would get 13 shots. However, if I use the USGA calculator with your white tee slope of 137 and my exact of 9.3, I would only get 11 shots.

Anyone know why this is, or the differences between Spanish slope? (by the way, this is also the same if I use the slope chart for my in-laws club in spain).

Sorry everyone for going into too much detail on this thread...


EDIT: I've found the answer. The spanish system adds an additional step, which is to adjust your playing handicap further by taking account for the course rating compared to par. So your playing handicap is first adjusted based on slope (113/course slope), then... adjusted again by taking the course rating and subtracting the par.

 

[duncan mackie]

I spend a fair bit of time in Spain with the in-laws living there and they have exactly this at their club, which is soo simple, and it also allows them to do multi tee comps which is also great.

However, I guess the Spanish calculate the playing handicap differently to the USGA? If I were to play off your White tees at Peralada with my exact handicap of 9.3, I would get 13 shots. However, if I use the USGA calculator with your white tee slope of 137 and my exact of 9.3, I would only get 11 shots.

Anyone know why this is, or the differences between Spanish slope? (by the way, this is also the same if I use the slope chart for my in-laws club in spain).

Sorry everyone for going into too much detail on this thread...

I'm guessing but suspect that table incorporates the underlying course ratings as well so that it gives you a final directly comparative net score from each tee?

 

[User20204]

Am I the only one playing the game trying to be as good as I can be i.e. as low a handicap as possible getting as little shots as possible ??

If seems reading posts folk are desperate to get more strokes.

 

[duncan mackie]

Am I the only one playing the game trying to be as good as I can be i.e. as low a handicap as possible getting as little shots as possible ??

If seems reading posts folk are desperate to get more strokes.

Don't see a single post that I can read that into...

 

[User20204]

Must just be me then haha.

 

[Lord Tyrion]

Don't see a single post that I can read that into...

Agree, I think we are all just trying to work it out, get our heads around it. h/caps are being mentioned as a way of sorting out how it affects each individual, nothing more sinister

 

[OLgolfer]

if trying to figure out how it all works = desperate for more strokes, then I'm 100% guilty

 

[cliveb]

but you are forgetting the reason the SSS is low its not just easier for a scratch player, its everyone.

You seem to be saying that SSS is indicative of difficulty across the board, and there is no need to distinguish degree of difficulty for scratch versus bogey golfers. Is that what you're saying? Because if it is, then can I ask what you think is the purpose of slope rating - surely all you need is the CR?

 

[duncan mackie]

You seem to be saying that SSS is indicative of difficulty across the board, and there is no need to distinguish degree of difficulty for scratch versus bogey golfers. Is that what you're saying? Because if it is, then can I ask what you think is the purpose of slope rating - surely all you need is the CR?

No - he is saying that a low SSS on an 18 hole course is normally indicative of a course that most golfers will find relatively easy to score on in absolute terms ie you would expect to score low numbers, regardless of par.
The exception being courses with par lower than the low SSS - which is rare, but does happen!
The purpose of the slope rating is to fine tune handicaps for any relative differences in how the course plays for different underlying capabilities in practice. Again generally, as the course rating (SSS or USGA) reduces you will tend to get a reduction in the slope rating. But it doesn't always work that way.

 

[cliveb]

No - he is saying that a low SSS on an 18 hole course is normally indicative of a course that most golfers will find relatively easy to score on in absolute terms ie you would expect to score low numbers, regardless of par.

OK, fair point - to a certain extent, but see caveat below...

The purpose of the slope rating is to fine tune handicaps for any relative differences in how the course plays for different underlying capabilities in practice. Again generally, as the course rating (SSS or USGA) reduces you will tend to get a reduction in the slope rating. But it doesn't always work that way.

This is why I like the idea of slope rating. SSS alone is a blunt instrument. With the new WHS, we finally have a mechanism that can cope with a course that, while being easy for the scratch golfer, might be relatively harder for the bogey golfer.

 

[rulefan]

I agree. SSS is only a measure of the difficulty for a scratch player. It says little about the relative or actual difficulty for the bogey (or any other player). But because of the relative weightings given to length and obstacles, as Duncan says, slope very rarely goes up when the CR goes down.