WHS doesn't work

[clubchamp98]

View attachment 52206

Working well for this chap

Jeez you wouldn’t want to meet him in the matchplay.

 

[Imurg]

In our Medal yesterday a guy with 10 shots shot +3 nett 64
A guy with -2 shots shot a 70 -1 nett 72..
He'd have needed to shoot a 61 to win......
And the 10 capper is a genuine Index....p.enty of cards in, just o e of those days....
If I was that low I'm not sure I'd bother....

 

[rulie]

Some days are diamonds , some days are stones .

 

[Mandofred]

Yesterday was Stones for me then......after a couple of months of pretty decent consistency .........it all went bye-bye.

 

[nickjdavis]

We've discovered over the last couple weeks 11 examples of visiting players submitting scores when playing our course...the only thing is that on the WHS Portal all of our tees are closed for handicapping/qualifying purposes, as the white and yellow tees are so far forward the course does not meet the criteria for qualifying.

It appears that these visiting players are simply returning their physical cards to their home clubs and getting their local handicap secretary to enter the scores.

 

[woofers]

We've discovered over the last couple weeks 11 examples of visiting players submitting scores when playing our course...the only thing is that on the WHS Portal all of our tees are closed for handicapping/qualifying purposes, as the white and yellow tees are so far forward the course does not meet the criteria for qualifying.

It appears that these visiting players are simply returning their physical cards to their home clubs and getting their local handicap secretary to enter the scores.

How is that a WHS problem?

 

[nickjdavis]

How is that a WHS problem?

Simply the fact that there is a loophole in the system, that allows players to bypass the controls that are put in place, to prevent scores being submitted, when the course is not of acceptable standard.

Given that it is the WHS platform where you can lock the tees so scores are not submitted, you would have though that there might be some auto cross referencing, when a handicap secretary of another club enters scores manually, that the tees on the date in question were configured to allow scores to be submitted.

 

[Backsticks]

How is that a WHS problem?

Because it allows general play cards to count towards HI.

 

[woofers]

Or the Handicap Secretary of the ‘other club’ could consider how the players ‘pre-registered’ their intent to submit a general play card?

 

[woofers]

Simply the fact that there is a loophole in the system, that allows players to bypass the controls that are put in place, to prevent scores being submitted, when the course is not of acceptable standard.

Given that it is the WHS platform where you can lock the tees so scores are not submitted, you would have though that there might be some auto cross referencing, when a handicap secretary of another club enters scores manually, that the tees on the date in question were configured to allow scores to be submitted.

Fair point and the ‘cross referencing’ would be a good move.
Out of interest were the secretaries of the other clubs informed of the non compliance and asked to remove those scores from the players records?

 

[nickjdavis]

Or the Handicap Secretary of the ‘other club’ could consider how the players ‘pre-registered’ their intent to submit a general play card?

Maybe they had a casual away day where they each put a fiver in the pot, had no gimmies, played to the rules of golf, thus "automatically" deeming their trip as being acceptable for handicap purposes and thus automatically "pre-registered"....all they didnt do was tell their handicap sec that the course wasnt set up properly (either by deliberate omission or it simply never occured to them!!).

Fair point and the ‘cross referencing’ would be a good move.
Out of interest were the secretaries of the other clubs informed of the non compliance and asked to remove those scores from the players records?

We have only just discovered it in the last couple of days (given we are all volunteers we don't spend every day buried in the WHS portal running reports!!)....we will be contacting the other clubs handicap sec. If they don't remove the scores from the record then we may seek guidance from the County before considering removing them ourselves.

 

[wjemather]

Simply the fact that there is a loophole in the system, that allows players to bypass the controls that are put in place, to prevent scores being submitted, when the course is not of acceptable standard.

Given that it is the WHS platform where you can lock the tees so scores are not submitted, you would have though that there might be some auto cross referencing, when a handicap secretary of another club enters scores manually, that the tees on the date in question were configured to allow scores to be submitted.

It isn't a loophole; it's just lack of knowledge - often these tasks are performed by non handicap committee members, e.g. pro shop or office, who have insufficient knowledge of the rules of handicapping - or diligence by the home club.

Incidents like this just need to be brought to their attention so they don't happen in future - and the scores deleted.

 

[wjemather]

In our Medal yesterday a guy with 10 shots shot +3 nett 64
A guy with -2 shots shot a 70 -1 nett 72..
He'd have needed to shoot a 61 to win......
And the 10 capper is a genuine Index....p.enty of cards in, just o e of those days....
If I was that low I'm not sure I'd bother....

I can't imagine nett 72 wins very often.

Handicapping is about equalising the chance of winning, not equalising the chance of scoring 7+ better than handicap.

 

[woofers]

We have only just discovered it in the last couple of days (given we are all volunteers we don't spend every day buried in the WHS portal running reports!!)....we will be contacting the other clubs handicap sec. If they don't remove the scores from the record then we may seek guidance from the County before considering removing them ourselves.

I am a volunteer handicap committee member myself and take an interest in this. We have switched off the tee marker facility in the EG WHS platform to prevent GP scores being submitted via the App. If a visitor plays at our course (when it’s open!) and takes a physical card back to their secretary to input I have no control over this.
Did it come to light when running the Score Listing By Day report in WHS?
If not, I’d be interested in knowing how. Thanks

 

[nickjdavis]

I am a volunteer handicap committee member myself and take an interest in this. We have switched off the tee marker facility in the EG WHS platform to prevent GP scores being submitted via the App. If a visitor plays at our course (when it’s open!) and takes a physical card back to their secretary to input I have no control over this.
Did it come to light when running the Score Listing By Day report in WHS?
If not, I’d be interested in knowing how. Thanks

Yes...exactly this.

 

[Swango1980]

Yes...exactly this.

If only the software at all clubs (i.e. MyEG) had some way of knowing that any course was "closed" to acceptable scores on particular days. Therefore, even if a handicap sec at another course tried to process an Away score from a week or 2 earlier, the system would give them a warning saying that the home club had turned off the ability to submit scores on that particular day.

 

[nickjdavis]

If only the software at all clubs (i.e. MyEG) had some way of knowing that any course was "closed" to acceptable scores on particular days. Therefore, even if a handicap sec at another course tried to process an Away score from a week or 2 earlier, the system would give them a warning saying that the home club had turned off the ability to submit scores on that particular day.

The ability surely already exists...its just a matter of writing what must be a short piece of code to...

i) create a recent historical record of what tees were closed...maybe something that gets updated on a daily basis keeping a 30 day rolling history
ii) reference back to this record when someone tries to manually enter a card.

 

[wjemather]

If only the software at all clubs (i.e. MyEG) had some way of knowing that any course was "closed" to acceptable scores on particular days. Therefore, even if a handicap sec at another course tried to process an Away score from a week or 2 earlier, the system would give them a warning saying that the home club had turned off the ability to submit scores on that particular day.

MyEG doesn't allow submission of scores from tee markers that are switched off.
This doesn't prevent manual score input by someone with administrative access to the WHS dotgolf platform - and it should only be done by a handicap committee member, who knows what to check first.

 

[Swango1980]

MyEG doesn't allow submission of scores from tee markers that are switched off.
This doesn't prevent manual score input by someone with administrative access to the WHS dotgolf platform - and it should only be done by a handicap committee member, who knows what to check first.

Yes. But, if a handicap committee member gets a number of cards submitted from other clubs, I wonder how many of those committee members phone that club to check if it was on a measured course that day. My guess is, not a lot.

Practically, it seems like the most likely way of finding out about this issue, is when a handicap committee member notices away players scores being entered on days where the score submission was closed. And, I'm sure this rarely happens as well. Hence why it would be a good idea that those with administrative access could get a warning when entering such a score, with the WHS dotgolf platform indicating that the tees were closed that day.

 

[D-S]

MyEG doesn't allow submission of scores from tee markers that are switched off.
This doesn't prevent manual score input by someone with administrative access to the WHS dotgolf platform - and it should only be done by a handicap committee member, who knows what to check first.

How would they check? Surely it can’t be the responsibility of a committee member to phone up every club to check that a particular tee set was open on a specific date before inputting any manual GP card.