WHS doesn't work

[Swango1980]

Only gripe I’ve got with whs is I’ve only had 7 scores in from 2023 so most of my 20 scores are from July 2022 and on, so a full year ago and if your a old bugger like me a year takes it’s toll

WHS still different to what we had before in that respect. Much better.

Pre WHS, you would still have only had 7 scores from 2023. At best, that would increase your handicap by 0.7 (if you are implying a year has taken its toll on your ability?) So, you'd still have a lower handicap than suits, and probably still low due to scores several years ago.

 

[D-S]

WHS still different to what we had before in that respect. Much better.

Pre WHS, you would still have only had 7 scores from 2023. At best, that would increase your handicap by 0.7 (if you are implying a year has taken its toll on your ability?) So, you'd still have a lower handicap than suits, and probably still low due to scores several years ago.

Under UHS the committee would have been prompted to consider a 1 shot increase, if they met the criteria, to any player who played outside their buffer zone on 7 consecutive occasions - so 0.7 would not have been ‘at best’.

 

[Swango1980]

Under UHS the committee would have been prompted to consider a 1 shot increase, if they met the criteria, to any player who played outside their buffer zone on 7 consecutive occasions - so 0.7 would not have been ‘at best’.

If you had a Committee that regularly ran the Continuous Review. It is my understanding many didn't, so they would not be prompted. Even if they did, it may not be that regularly, and they may decide to make no change at all.

So, in terms of how the system works by itself, 0.7 was at best what the handicap would have increased by. Then, if the Committee reviewed the handicap, they could increase it further if appropriate. Of course, they can also review the handicap under WHS as well

 

[IanM]

Once folk accept the fact a WHS handicap is telling you something fundamentally different from the previous incarnation, it's all fine!

The debate as to whether maximum handicaps are too high, and if it's easier to manipulate them now, will rumble on. (And on)

 

[Ians_sporting_bro]

Someone will ba along shortly to tell you that’s not WHS fault.
52 points is a joke.
we had several like this but it has taken three years to settle down a bit.

That because it's NOT WHS's FAULT!

Handicaps over 28/36, so up to 54 came in in 2018, under UHS; WHS came in 2020!

New golf handicap changes mean golfers can play off handicaps up to 54!

Previously men could have a competition handicap of up to 28, and women up to 36.

www.golfmagic.com

World Handicap System has now launched in Great Britain and Ireland

The World Handicap System (WHS) comes into effect today for golfers in Great Britain and Ireland.

www.golfmagic.com

To me, any problems are caused by inept committees who haven't adjusted, using such tools as Divisions or Handicap Limits, to the 2018 change!

 

[Alan Clifford]

Only gripe I’ve got with whs is I’ve only had 7 scores in from 2023 so most of my 20 scores are from July 2022 and on, so a full year ago and if your a old bugger like me a year takes it’s toll

Have you only played 7 rounds of golf in 5 months?

 

[Rlburnside]

Have you only played 7 rounds of golf in 5 months?

No we play non Qualifying winter competition until April when our season starts, only played in two competitions and five general play rounds since then.

 

[clubchamp98]

This is utter drivel.
Under WHS, a new golfer's index is very sensitive to good scores, so a 52 point score will result in an extreme reduction. Indeed, it would be a far greater reduction than would be seen under the old system, which would require manual intervention to set a new exact handicap.
Your old club had gone rogue if they were truly doing this - which is very doubtful.

A few weeks of general play cards will soon knock off that very good score all ready to do it again.

Thats exactly what they did once 28 or below you never went over 28 again.
nobody questioned it !

 

[clubchamp98]

That because it's NOT WHS's FAULT!

Handicaps over 28/36, so up to 54 came in in 2018, under UHS; WHS came in 2020!

New golf handicap changes mean golfers can play off handicaps up to 54!

Previously men could have a competition handicap of up to 28, and women up to 36.

www.golfmagic.com

World Handicap System has now launched in Great Britain and Ireland

The World Handicap System (WHS) comes into effect today for golfers in Great Britain and Ireland.

www.golfmagic.com

To me, any problems are caused by inept committees who haven't adjusted, using such tools as Divisions or Handicap Limits, to the 2018 change!

I am well aware of when handicaps were raised. That’s not the problem.
General play cards are the biggest reason for handicap increases imo.
its not the very high cappers doing all the winning that I see but when they do they do stick out for the stupid scores.
its the 16/22 cappers that have suddenly got another four shots since WHS.

The system is so open to abuse it’s laughable .
” Need a few more shots back to make me competitive again” heard that a lot .

We were told comittiee workload would not increase.
That was just plain wrong. Given the huge amount of GP cards.
Mostly volunteers at my club ,lots have packed in.

 

[jim8flog]

It didn’t happen then as far as I can remember.
if you shot a great score you were docked an extra shot.

So the WHS is no different in that respect. Shoot an exceptional score and you get extra shots deducted of you H.I.

 

[Deleted member 15717]

if you shot a great score you were docked an extra shot.

You needed to shoot 2 (or more) great scores in quick succession to obtain an ESR. The same still applies with WHS too.

 

[jim8flog]

” Need a few more shots back to make me competitive again” heard that a lot .

We were told comittiee workload would not increase.
That was just plain wrong. Given the huge amount of GP cards.
Mostly volunteers at my club ,lots have packed in.

I am wondering what happens at you club.

Prior to the WHS we had quite a number of supplementary scores being put in, at least 10 a day from memory. All these had to checked and put on to the players record by the office.
With the WHS general play scores are put on to the computer systems by the players themselves (EG or IG app means no work for the office).
We were advised by county that we only need to check something like one in ten of the cards being put in via the PSI so no real increase in the work load

Prior to the WHS we had a handicap committee meeting at least once every 3 months mainly to discuss the continuous review report. We now have a meeting once a year to do the annual review unless there is something specific we need to discuss.

Our committee is also responsible for competitions and rules so there may me be more frequent meetings and something to do with H/Caps might crop up.

 

[Rlburnside]

WHS still different to what we had before in that respect. Much better.

Pre WHS, you would still have only had 7 scores from 2023. At best, that would increase your handicap by 0.7 (if you are implying a year has taken its toll on your ability?) So, you'd still have a lower handicap than suits, and probably still low due to scores several years ago.

Yes you’re right, looking more closely my last 7 scores from 2023 I’ve gone up from 16.7. to 17.7 the old way I would have gone up to 17.4 so whs is reflecting my current ability better.

 

[jim8flog]

WHS still different to what we had before in that respect. Much better.

Pre WHS, you would still have only had 7 scores from 2023. At best, that would increase your handicap by 0.7 (if you are implying a year has taken its toll on your ability?) So, you'd still have a lower handicap than suits, and probably still low due to scores several years ago.

My handicap was increased by 2 shots under the Continuous Review procedure on top of the 0.7 from 7 0.1s on a row. Since the WHS has come in it has gone up a further 5 without the need for committee intervention.

 

[Backsticks]

You needed to shoot 2 (or more) great scores in quick succession to obtain an ESR. The same still applies with WHS too.

It doesnt. One score can trigger it in WHS, and can be 1 or 2 shots immediately. I addition to the score itself. So WHS has the potential to cut big scores faster.

 

[Swango1980]

Yes you’re right, looking more closely my last 7 scores from 2023 I’ve gone up from 16.7. to 17.7 the old way I would have gone up to 17.4 so whs is reflecting my current ability better.

It just depends on where your latest scores fit with the best 8 in 20. Yes, technically, in 7 rounds under WHS you may not go up anything, if you are only losing bad scores (although that would imply your best 8 up there amongst your most recent before you handed in those 7 scores, so your ability may not be declining as quickly as you'd think)

However, if you feel your ability is declining very rapidly, then I'd fully expect your handicap to start shooting up pretty soon, if it hasn't done so already. As submitting a few more scores will mean you will lose some very good ones, that are currently keeping your handicap far too low for you. For example, I went from 8.8 to 11.5 in 11 rounds. In fact, I went up from 9.7 to 10.6 in one round, and 9.4 to 11.5 in 5 rounds. That is a pretty big jump, not really declining ability, just pretty rubbish form. So, if you are a lot worse now than you were a year or 2 ago, technically your current handicap will not represent your ability at all from a year or 2 ago once you have 20 scores submitted since (in some cases even a bit less than that), except that the soft and hard caps will kick in if you are very much worse.

 

[Rlburnside]

It just depends on where your latest scores fit with the best 8 in 20. Yes, technically, in 7 rounds under WHS you may not go up anything, if you are only losing bad scores (although that would imply your best 8 up there amongst your most recent before you handed in those 7 scores, so your ability may not be declining as quickly as you'd think)

However, if you feel your ability is declining very rapidly, then I'd fully expect your handicap to start shooting up pretty soon, if it hasn't done so already. As submitting a few more scores will mean you will lose some very good ones, that are currently keeping your handicap far too low for you. For example, I went from 8.8 to 11.5 in 11 rounds. In fact, I went up from 9.7 to 10.6 in one round, and 9.4 to 11.5 in 5 rounds. That is a pretty big jump, not really declining ability, just pretty rubbish form. So, if you are a lot worse now than you were a year or 2 ago, technically your current handicap will not represent your ability at all from a year or 2 ago once you have 20 scores submitted since (in some cases even a bit less than that), except that the soft and hard caps will kick in if you are very much worse.

My 7 latest scores range from 93 to 104.
7 of my best scores are from July 2022 to September 2022, I also had a good score drop off from July 2022 yesterday, scored 97 but my h/c never changed.

 

[Swango1980]

My 7 latest scores range from 93 to 104.
7 of my best scores are from July 2022 to September 2022, I also had a good score drop off from July 2022 yesterday, scored 97 but my h/c never changed.

Well, at least your good scores are from less than a year ago. Your handicap is relatively up to date compared to many, unless you'd like the system to be even more drastic and be able to provide significant increases based on 7 scores, forgetting ones before that?

If you lost a good score and handicap stayed same, then it would be because it was replaced by a same score.

 

[Backsticks]

My UHS handicap included scores from over 20 years earlier. 2 or 3 year old scores in someones WHS is nothing.

 

[IanM]

My UHS handicap included scores from over 20 years earlier. 2 or 3 year old scores in someones WHS is nothing.

I know what you mean...but the whole premise of WHS is that it is more dynamic, and more about form in last 20. Whereas, the former system was an ongoing evolution from past scores. (As you said over 20 years)

The big (and probably unresolvable) loose end is that there is an infinite range of ages of the score in players' last 20.