Wedges - advice?

[rksquire]

Found out during the week that my club account is looking pretty healthy, so, of course without intending to spend any money on new equipment, I've now started to consider the 'gaps' in my bag - there's space for a 5w or 3 hybrid, but what's really intriguing me is sorting out my wedges. I currently have a cobra PW (43degrees), SW (55degrees) and a slazenger 64 degree (quite effective on the rear occasions it is used).

I'm thinking of dropping my cobra SW and going for a 50, 54 and 60. I was trying to source callaway md4 (as cheaper now!) but can't seem to get them in anything but stiff. So I'm looking at Callaway Jaws MD5, Ping Glide 3.0 or Cleveland RTX4 (also looked at Taylormade Milled Grind 2 and Vokeys).

I'm unlikely to get to test anytime soon, although I have tried a friends MD4s but this was just for a few shots. The real reason for considering wedges is that for shots over 60 yards and under 110 I've been manipulating 1/2 and 3/4 PW swings - I'm not unhappy with the results necessarily, but I'd probably prefer to have the option of a full swing. My PW goes 110 yards, my swing is quite steep and ball flight is high (if that has any relevance!).

Anyway, a bit of guidance would be appreciated, now that I know the money is there it's burning a hole in my pocket!

 

[Grant85]

I would say I have a similar distance as you and really struggled on a round 100 yard shot. I had a 52 in the bag and just couldn't get 100 yards out of it.

I have 50 / 54 / 60, which I think works well in terms of gapping and also not having too much overlap in terms of what club to use.

The biggest thing for me was getting someone to explain the various grinds available. I ended up with vokeys and most of the manufacturers have their own grinds on a similar theme.

I have a 50 F, which is designed for fairway play. So I play this as a full shot of 100 yards and might dial it down for 80 yards.
My 54 is an M grind, which is designed for opening up the face for shorter shots around the greens off the turf. But I also use this for pretty much all shots inside 75 yards - other than simple chips along the ground.
Both are 8 degrees of bounce. So I consider them not ideal for playing out of bunkers.

I have an old Cleveland 60 with 12 degrees of bounce, which is my go to bunker club. Also use this out of rough around the greens. I concede I happened upon this by accident after getting the vokeys last year and not being able to stretch to a 3rd new wedge.

I have had Clevelands and I think they are great value clubs. They may not have quite the same range of options with regards to the vokeys. But when you start looking at the combinations of lofts, bounce angles and grinds, it can get over whelming, so hopefully you have a pro that knows what he's doing. Maybe call ahead so he can arrange some time away from the shop to look at your technique and talk you through the options, even if he doesn't have 5 dozen demo clubs sitting there.

 

[rksquire]

I would say I have a similar distance as you and really struggled on a round 100 yard shot. I had a 52 in the bag and just couldn't get 100 yards out of it.

I have 50 / 54 / 60, which I think works well in terms of gapping and also not having too much overlap in terms of what club to use.

The biggest thing for me was getting someone to explain the various grinds available. I ended up with vokeys and most of the manufacturers have their own grinds on a similar theme.

I have a 50 F, which is designed for fairway play. So I play this as a full shot of 100 yards and might dial it down for 80 yards.
My 54 is an M grind, which is designed for opening up the face for shorter shots around the greens off the turf. But I also use this for pretty much all shots inside 75 yards - other than simple chips along the ground.
Both are 8 degrees of bounce. So I consider them not ideal for playing out of bunkers.

I have an old Cleveland 60 with 12 degrees of bounce, which is my go to bunker club. Also use this out of rough around the greens. I concede I happened upon this by accident after getting the vokeys last year and not being able to stretch to a 3rd new wedge.

I have had Clevelands and I think they are great value clubs. They may not have quite the same range of options with regards to the vokeys. But when you start looking at the combinations of lofts, bounce angles and grinds, it can get over whelming, so hopefully you have a pro that knows what he's doing. Maybe call ahead so he can arrange some time away from the shop to look at your technique and talk you through the options, even if he doesn't have 5 dozen demo clubs sitting there.

Thanks - It is overwhelming, the 'grinds' in addition to bounce is new to me - it gets confusing between manufacturers. At the minute there's about £45 per club difference between the SM7 and SM8 - and your description of the F and M is very helpful! I initially started looking at the vokeys, not sure why I circled away from them. I will have a chat with the pro though, he's managed to sort a few things around the green for me in terms of technique / consistency so hopefully he'll remember. My bunker play is shocking so although not expecting miracles he might be able to guide me with the right choice of grind / bounce here.

 

[Deleted member 3432]

Plenty of options you could take.

50,58 and address the other end of your bag or 48/50, 54/56 & 60

I think Vokey use all these grind options as a marketing tool, all other brands will have suitable grind options.without making a song and dance about it. Get the correct bounce options for your own game (digger or sweeper for example) and type of course you play (links or parkland). As an example you dont want to be playing a flop shot off a bare hardpan links lie with a high bounce wedge.

Do you have a club pro who knows your game who you could discuss your requirements with?

 

[azazel]

My wedges are 50, 54 and 58, all Cleveland although a mix of different RTXs. Can't speak highly enough of them and seem to be better priced than the equivalent model of Vokeys. I actually went for Vokeys a year ago but switched them out for Cleveland's after a few weeks. I also used to have a set of Mizuno wedges and they were pretty decent too.

 

[Grant85]

My wedges are 50, 54 and 58, all Cleveland although a mix of different RTXs. Can't speak highly enough of them and seem to be better priced than the equivalent model of Vokeys. I actually went for Vokeys a year ago but switched them out for Cleveland's after a few weeks. I also used to have a set of Mizuno wedges and they were pretty decent too.

Also think Clevelands tie in very nicely with the vokeys as they have similar shape and look if you end up with a mish mash set for whatever reason.

As I said, I have the 50 and 54 in the vokeys. Ideally I'd want a matched club for the 60, but given I'll use the 60 considerably less often (and practice less often with) than I will with the other 2, it would be a vanity purchase.

 

[jim8flog]

My bunker play is shocking so although not expecting miracles he might be able to guide me with the right choice of grind / bounce here.

Bunker play is one of the very key areas that bounce needs to be taken in to consideration.

You need the right amount of bounce to suit the sand where you play the most and also the conditions on the day of play.

e.g. where I play the sand is normall very deep and fluffy so I carry a SW with 14 degrees of bounce.

At the moment with bunker rakes having been removed and the very dry weather we have the bunker are now more compacted so I have switched to SW with 11 degrees of bounce

This sort thing can often be achieved by making sure that the 54/56 has a different bounce to the 58/60.

I currently have Cleveland RTX3 and have had Vokeys in the past. I am happy with either both good designs and manufacturers but I notice I get better spin with the RTXs.

 

[bobmac]

Can you spend the money in your account on lessons?
If so, I'd suggest sell the 64 and 55, buy a 50 and a 58, have some wedge lessons then practice what you've learned.

 

[rksquire]

Thanks all for the replies and advice.

Plenty of options you could take.

50,58 and address the other end of your bag or 48/50, 54/56 & 60

I think Vokey use all these grind options as a marketing tool, all other brands will have suitable grind options.without making a song and dance about it. Get the correct bounce options for your own game (digger or sweeper for example) and type of course you play (links or parkland). As an example you dont want to be playing a flop shot off a bare hardpan links lie with a high bounce wedge.

Do you have a club pro who knows your game who you could discuss your requirements with?

I do, had a series recently (prior to lockdown) to sort out why improvement had stalled - my 'draw' had become quite destructive (in my head), but he worked out whilst that needed some work shots were being lost on and around the green - since being back this has improved dramatically, 5 single putts on Saturday for example after missing the green. Granted, greens are slower at the minute but this is a big improvement. We didn't discuss equipment for this area, just worked with what I had but he should know my game and course (parkland).

Also think Clevelands tie in very nicely with the vokeys as they have similar shape and look if you end up with a mish mash set for whatever reason.

As I said, I have the 50 and 54 in the vokeys. Ideally I'd want a matched club for the 60, but given I'll use the 60 considerably less often (and practice less often with) than I will with the other 2, it would be a vanity purchase.

Like the look of the RTXs, can only get this years model though (limited in the shop to 46 and 60 if go RTX3 unless I mix and match chrome and black satin).

Bunker play is one of the very key areas that bounce needs to be taken in to consideration.

You need the right amount of bounce to suit the sand where you play the most and also the conditions on the day of play.

e.g. where I play the sand is normall very deep and fluffy so I carry a SW with 14 degrees of bounce.

At the moment with bunker rakes having been removed and the very dry weather we have the bunker are now more compacted so I have switched to SW with 11 degrees of bounce

This sort thing can often be achieved by making sure that the 54/56 has a different bounce to the 58/60.

I currently have Cleveland RTX3 and have had Vokeys in the past. I am happy with either both good designs and manufacturers but I notice I get better spin with the RTXs.

Bunkers are a write-off at the minute - club are holding back on new sand, so at the minute some are like concrete and the others are a bit of a lottery. Normal conditions would be clumpy type sand but deep, never fluffy. I was thinking of a bounce around 10 or so.

Can you spend the money in your account on lessons?
If so, I'd suggest sell the 64 and 55, buy a 50 and a 58, have some wedge lessons then practice what you've learned.

I can, I've pre-paid for a series before lockdown so I've still got some in hand, but would happily invest in more, especially it means I get the most out of any investment.

 

[Grant85]

Like the look of the RTXs, can only get this years model though (limited in the shop to 46 and 60 if go RTX3 unless I mix and match chrome and black satin).

You have to accept that a shop won't have a huge range of stuff. Unless you are going to source matching clubs from different places, I'd say stick to your guns and get everything matching if you are spending the money.

 

[GG26]

I dropped the PW from my Ping G700 set and now have Cleveland RTXs in 46, 50, 54 & 58. Use the 46 & 50 for full shots, the 54 mainly for bunkers and the 58 for shots over bunkers.

Before buying wedges check that the gapping ties in with the rest of your irons.

 

[clubchamp98]

I have MD5 50/10.
Phil Mlchelson grind 56/ 14. Odd looking at first but they work.
Phil Mickelson grind 60 / 08.
If your thinking Callaway the MD3 are the best.
They are the same as the new MD5 but just cosmetically look different. But a lot cheaper if you can find new ones.
Bounce and grind is important, YouTube will explain this it’s quite interesting to learn.
Consider a wedge fitting ???
If your buying three wedges go and get a fitting , shaft, bounce, loft ,grind are all catered for and gapping of your yardages should be sorted as well so it starts from your PW distance.
All the wedges you mentioned are good these days and it’s just personal preference .
You need to like what your looking at.

My main point would be “ get fitted”.

 

[rksquire]

Got to try SM8 (52, 56 & 60) and Taylormades Milled Grind (54 & 58) on course this afternoon, hopefully trying the Cleveland RTX 3 & 4 and Callaways on Friday afternoon (different pro-shop, but they've offered a fitting too - bit nervous about that to be honest!). From today, got on particularly well with the 56 degree SM8 - played 2 blinding shots into 2 holes from areas where I'd be manufacturing something with Pitching Wedge. If anything, the distance was probably further than I'd been expecting but feel and shape was good. Had a 58 (TM) and 60 (SM8) and tried some bunker shots, no magic fix there unfortunately, guy I was with said I definitely need help with my bunker play - I'm getting the ball out with an odd out to out shape (in his opinion), but never really in danger of giving myself a decent chance of an up & down. Anyway, as things stand I've probably eliminated Talyormade from my thinking.

 

[BeGood]

My first post, so please go easy. Sounds like my issue is similar to the OP's. I am looking for a gap wedge (probably 52 degree) and have narrowed my search down to two within my budget: the Callaway Jaws MD5 and the Cleveland RTX4. Popping along to a pro shop that stocks them and trying them on the range seems to be out of the question at the moment, so it looks like I will have to buy on spec.

If it’s relevant, my irons (down to PW) are Mizuno JPX EZ forged. My sand wedge is a fairly old Titleist Vokey SM4 58-09, which I love, but am only really comfortable hitting it 50-60 yds max. I hit my PW 100-110 yds with a full swing, so have to “manufacturer” 60-90 yd shots with it, which I don’t find easy when the green is protected front and back. I am therefore thinking modern 52/54-degree wedge with grooves to generate plenty of spin. Any thoughts appreciated.

Phil
(hcp 14)

 

[Dan2501]

My first post, so please go easy. Sounds like my issue is similar to the OP's. I am looking for a gap wedge (probably 52 degree) and have narrowed my search down to two within my budget: the Callaway Jaws MD5 and the Cleveland RTX4. Popping along to a pro shop that stocks them and trying them on the range seems to be out of the question at the moment, so it looks like I will have to buy on spec.

If it’s relevant, my irons (down to PW) are Mizuno JPX EZ forged. My sand wedge is a fairly old Titleist Vokey SM4 58-09, which I love, but am only really comfortable hitting it 50-60 yds max. I hit my PW 100-110 yds with a full swing, so have to “manufacturer” 60-90 yd shots with it, which I don’t find easy when the green is protected front and back. I am therefore thinking modern 52/54-degree wedge with grooves to generate plenty of spin. Any thoughts appreciated.

Phil
(hcp 14)

I've got Callaway MD5s and they're fantastic, never got as much a spin as I'm getting now. Absolutely love them. My advice would be to try a few different ones. I'd look at the Mizuno's as well seeing as you have Mizuno irons, their latest Wedges are supposedly fantastic.

 

[clubchamp98]

My first post, so please go easy. Sounds like my issue is similar to the OP's. I am looking for a gap wedge (probably 52 degree) and have narrowed my search down to two within my budget: the Callaway Jaws MD5 and the Cleveland RTX4. Popping along to a pro shop that stocks them and trying them on the range seems to be out of the question at the moment, so it looks like I will have to buy on spec.

If it’s relevant, my irons (down to PW) are Mizuno JPX EZ forged. My sand wedge is a fairly old Titleist Vokey SM4 58-09, which I love, but am only really comfortable hitting it 50-60 yds max. I hit my PW 100-110 yds with a full swing, so have to “manufacturer” 60-90 yd shots with it, which I don’t find easy when the green is protected front and back. I am therefore thinking modern 52/54-degree wedge with grooves to generate plenty of spin. Any thoughts appreciated.

Phil
(hcp 14)

MD5 are great clubs but not that much better than previous models .
The MD3 were great wedges have a look on eBay if there are any new ones left in stock.

 

[BeGood]

I've got Callaway MD5s and they're fantastic, never got as much a spin as I'm getting now. Absolutely love them. My advice would be to try a few different ones. I'd look at the Mizuno's as well seeing as you have Mizuno irons, their latest Wedges are supposedly fantastic.

Thanks Dan. Not sure why I didn't look at Mizuno first. Maybe because I started with a 'Top 10 wedges of 2020' review list. The Mizuno T20's look very clean and classic. I see that they they come with a quite heavy shaft as standard (Dyn Gold Tour Issue S400 - 134 grams) which would be quite a bit heavier than the XP105 shafts in my other irons. However, this could be sorted by doing a "custom fit" with some online supplies. One offers the Nippon Modus Tour 105 shaft (at no extra cost), which would probably be closest. The only problem is that online custom fitting apparently adds another week or so to the existing 8-10 working day delivery times. In contrast, the Cleveland and Callaway wedges seem to come with Dyn Gold Tour 115g shafts as standard, which would probably be Ok. Incidentally, in case anyone else is searching, the best price I have found for the Cleveland RTX4 is £95, with £129 for both the Callaway MD5 and the Mizuno T20.

 

[BeGood]

Thanks - It is overwhelming, the 'grinds' in addition to bounce is new to me - it gets confusing between manufacturers. At the minute there's about £45 per club difference between the SM7 and SM8 - and your description of the F and M is very helpful! I initially started looking at the vokeys, not sure why I circled away from them. I will have a chat with the pro though, he's managed to sort a few things around the green for me in terms of technique / consistency so hopefully he'll remember. My bunker play is shocking so although not expecting miracles he might be able to guide me with the right choice of grind / bounce here.

For bunker play, its 90% technique imo, less about the club. Once the 'penny drops' you'll be fine. I was watching a John Rahm video on YouTube last week in which he demonstrates how to get out of a bunker (with control) using a 4 iron. It was all in fun, of course (he played some conventional shots too!), but it emphasised a couple of key things about bunker play.

 

[HomerJSimpson]

If you don't mind 2nd hand here are some options. Other 2nd hand websites are available and this site may be a tad more expensive than others and you may find a better deal via e-bay but it'll serve as a good reference guide https://www.royalascotgolfclub.co.uk/course/course-tour/hole/9/

 

[rksquire]

Plenty of options you could take.

50,58 and address the other end of your bag or 48/50, 54/56 & 60

I think Vokey use all these grind options as a marketing tool, all other brands will have suitable grind options.without making a song and dance about it. Get the correct bounce options for your own game (digger or sweeper for example) and type of course you play (links or parkland). As an example you dont want to be playing a flop shot off a bare hardpan links lie with a high bounce wedge.

Do you have a club pro who knows your game who you could discuss your requirements with?

Winner - it's like you did my fitting! Fitter spent a lot of time with me, recommended off the bat 48, 54 and 60 (my PW is 43) and dispensing with my 55 and 64. Also felt, for value for money and the fact I had an issue at the other end of the bag that we focus more initially on the 'older' models, leaving options to have a look at distance clubs as well, and once things had been narrowed down look at the newer models to see if there was any significant difference to justify going the extra cost. For some reason the numbers with the MD4s and the Glides just didn't work as well for me as the RTX3 and SM7, although in fairness I did love the look of the MD4s. Ultimately, there wasn't much between the Clevelands and the Vokeys performance wise so tried the RTX4 and the SM8. The RTX4 had the most spin out of all the clubs I tried, but the fitter thought in terms of the additional cost it might not be worth it. Hit a snag with the RTX3 though in that all weren't available in the same finish, so one would have been in the black - I have to admit vanity played a role here (and the fitter advised it would look worn more quickly but performance would be fine) so have ended up going with the SM7! The fitter recommended adjusting the 48 (10 bounce, F grind) 1degree upright (also thought this would benefit my irons) but leaving the 54 and 60 as standard. Have also ended up with a 2nd hand RBZ stage 4 wood (same as my 3 wood) so that gap has been potentially addressed. Hopefully picking them up tomorrow and playing Wednesday.

The fitter did recommend I potentially consider a change of irons in due course (my game improving cobra s3s were bought 2nd hand, but were originally released 2011).... must admit I'm less sure of this, certainly not this year due to cost, and I'm playing as consistent as ever to be honest and would be hopeful that my hc should lower in the next couple of months. The wedges and 4 wood are probably enough equipment changes for this year.