The NHS - Decent basic nursing is what we need from it.

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

Minimum 3 weeks waiting time to see a doctor at my surgery. This has not changed in more than 6 years. Yet it closes on Wednesday afternoons and all weekend. By any stretch of anyone's imagination that is not a 7 day NHS.
A close relative of mine has been hospitalised for the past 5 months. The nurses were amazing, in fact the entire team in the hospital were fantastic. So I have to disagree with the OP. We don't have a 7 day NHS in many areas where we need it and the standard of nursing care imho is very high indeed.
Clearly it's A&E that is struggling, probably because people cannot get to see a doctor. That is where the money and development needs to go. Surgeries and A&E and less on management.

I know I go on about 'entitlement' - but I fear the strains on GPs and A&E are brought about by too many folks feeling entitled to see their GP - when they want to see their GP - and at their own convenience. Let's call it Amazon Prime Syndrome - decide you need something today - you can order it today - and you get it tomorrow. And other than in real emergencies - the only way to get that with GP appointments is to complain, complain, complain and adopt a 'he who shouts loudest gets heard' mindset.

 

[User62651]

Interesting read, clearly some forumers have first hand knowledge of how the system works or doesnt work as the case may be.
I get the impression the NHS is almost being deliberately run in a bad and inefficient top heavy way to force change through subversive privatisation by other means. The part in this thread about one hospital specialist consultant not being able to refer an outpatient to another specialist consulatant without referring them back to their GP first seems like madness to me.
NHS England seems to be worst for patients, I assume for sheer pressure of numbers, my experiences of NHS hospitals in Scotland is varied but never terrible, have had inpatient stays for surgery or illness in 2 Aberdeen hospitals, Inverness, Greenock and outpatient day surgical procedures in Vale of Leven and Melrose. All ran pretty efficiently in my experience without any undue delays at the hospital at least. The time issue up here seem to be getting there in the first place through the system of GP/specialist/referal to another specialist before any procedure, that's the really frustrating part that should imo be way way quicker, takes years to get through for some procedures or MRIs etc. In Argyll I keep having to follow up myself and keep chasing to get where I need to get, not getting the care I have had in other parts of Scotland.
I hate the NHS24 service or 111 here or whatever its called, I went up to my A&E last October at the weekend in some discomfort, not something I've done before, and was seen by the on-call doc but without being informed in no uncertain terms by the receptionists I shouldn't do that but must call 121. Fair enough but god I miss the old days when the local GP, whom you knew as a family, came to your house and had a look at you if you weren't fit to go out. People dont call 111 or NHS 24 as its basically crap. We as a nation seems to have gone backwards big style wrt health care under NHS since 30 years ago. How did we manage back then wrt costs and recruitment of medical professionals etc but cant now?
If we do have to take private medical insurance American style in time, will the Govt remove the proportion of National Insurance we currently pay monthly to cover NHS, somehow I doubt it and we'll be the worse off financially....again.
This country......tssssk.

 

[Imurg]

I know I go on about 'entitlement' - but I fear the strains on GPs and A&E are brought about by too many folks feeling entitled to see their GP - when they want to see their GP - and at their own convenience. Let's call it Amazon Prime Syndrome - decide you need something today - you can order it today - and you get it tomorrow. And other than in real emergencies - the only way to get that with GP appointments is to complain, complain, complain and adopt a 'he who shouts loudest gets heard' mindset.

I get what you're saying but if you're I'll or need to see a Doctor then you're I'll or need to see a Doctor..
Having a 4-5 week wait to see a GP is simply ludicrous.
When I developed a problem with my hand this time last year I had no alternative but to go to A&E - I didn't need to but I needed to get the hand assessed to see if there was any damage as it rendered me unable to drive = no work.
As it happens some ibuprofen and ice sorted the issue to at least allow me to work while I waited a month to see a Doctor.

Biggest issue with the NHS is that it has a finite budget to treat a potentially infinite number of people...

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

I have had experience of NHS Scotland over the last 18months. It was excellent. My mother was admitted to the new Queen Elizabeth hospital in Glasgow following falls and was diagnosed with an inoperable brain tumour. Her care on the Acute Receiving Unit was OK - but the staff didn't have time to really care for her in a focussed sort of way. But it was fine guiven it was ACU.

As mum's condition was terminal she was transferred within a week from ACU (to clear the bed) to a Palliative Care (End of Life) Home - Mearnskirk House on the south side of Glasgow. The care mum received in Mearnskirk was exemplary. Mum was in the home for a year before passing away, and in that year I can say that she was give genuine loving care by the nurses and care assistants from day one - even although they were often stretched giving care to all the residents of the home. And they were very supportive to us (and some were actually rather upset) when mum passed away. God Bless them all.

Unfortunately - we heard before Christmas that Mearnskirk is scheduled for closure in the next few years.

 

[Tashyboy]

Interesting read, clearly some forumers have first hand knowledge of how the system works or doesnt work as the case may be.
I get the impression the NHS is almost being deliberately run in a bad and inefficient top heavy way to force change through subversive privatisation by other means. The part in this thread about one hospital specialist consultant not being able to refer an outpatient to another specialist consulatant without referring them back to their GP first seems like madness to me.
NHS England seems to be worst for patients, I assume for sheer pressure of numbers, my experiences of NHS hospitals in Scotland is varied but never terrible, have had inpatient stays for surgery or illness in 2 Aberdeen hospitals, Inverness, Greenock and outpatient day surgical procedures in Vale of Leven and Melrose. All ran pretty efficiently in my experience without any undue delays at the hospital at least. The time issue up here seem to be getting there in the first place through the system of GP/specialist/referal to another specialist before any procedure, that's the really frustrating part that should imo be way way quicker, takes years to get through for some procedures or MRIs etc. In Argyll I keep having to follow up myself and keep chasing to get where I need to get, not getting the care I have had in other parts of Scotland.
I hate the NHS24 service or 111 here or whatever its called, I went up to my A&E last October at the weekend in some discomfort, not something I've done before, and was seen by the on-call doc but without being informed in no uncertain terms by the receptionists I shouldn't do that but must call 121. Fair enough but god I miss the old days when the local GP, whom you knew as a family, came to your house and had a look at you if you weren't fit to go out. People dont call 111 or NHS 24 as its basically crap. We as a nation seems to have gone backwards big style wrt health care under NHS since 30 years ago. How did we manage back then wrt costs and recruitment of medical professionals etc but cant now?
If we do have to take private medical insurance American style in time, will the Govt remove the proportion of National Insurance we currently pay monthly to cover NHS, somehow I doubt it and we'll be the worse off financially....again.
This country......tssssk.

When Missis T was in hospital a couple of times last year, each time she was in she had to see specialist consultants. She was " advised " by the consultant she initially saw that she had to see X number of specialists re investigations to her problem. But he could not refer her. The consultant had to refer Missis T back to her GP who then had to send a letter to said specialists for an appointment/s. The reason. So the hospital could get paid for said consultants appointments by Missis Ts GP. If she was referred by the initial consultant, the hospital never got paid as she went through A and E. It creates more work on an over stretched department.

 

[Sweep]

I know I go on about 'entitlement' - but I fear the strains on GPs and A&E are brought about by too many folks feeling entitled to see their GP - when they want to see their GP - and at their own convenience. Let's call it Amazon Prime Syndrome - decide you need something today - you can order it today - and you get it tomorrow. And other than in real emergencies - the only way to get that with GP appointments is to complain, complain, complain and adopt a 'he who shouts loudest gets heard' mindset.

I would agree that too many see it as a right to see their GP for any and often trivial ailments. But a 3 week wait to see your doctor is ridiculous and needs sorting. To me it seems surgeries are funded the wrong way. They get funded upfront. They should be funded largely on how many patients they treat. It's a great service but frankly useless if you can't access it.

 

[SocketRocket]

I know I go on about 'entitlement' - but I fear the strains on GPs and A&E are brought about by too many folks feeling entitled to see their GP - when they want to see their GP - and at their own convenience. Let's call it Amazon Prime Syndrome - decide you need something today - you can order it today - and you get it tomorrow. And other than in real emergencies - the only way to get that with GP appointments is to complain, complain, complain and adopt a 'he who shouts loudest gets heard' mindset.

I think people should be entitled to see a GP if they have a health concern. The problem is more to do with too many people visiting A&E for non emergency issues rather than a GP. The Triage system seems to not be working due to hospitals being frightened to turn people away unless they make a mistake and have to compensate. People are told that if they have a serious condition it needs to be caught early but then cant get seen for weeks.

Also, this is a symptom of there being too many people in the country and not enough tax being proportionally raised to supply support services. Chickens are returning to roost.

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

I think people should be entitled to see a GP if they have a health concern. The problem is more to do with too many people visiting A&E for non emergency issues rather than a GP. The Triage system seems to not be working due to hospitals being frightened to turn people away unless they make a mistake and have to compensate. People are told that if they have a serious condition it needs to be caught early but then cant get seen for weeks.

Also, this is a symptom of there being too many people in the country and not enough tax being proportionally raised to supply support services. Chickens are returning to roost.

My observation of 'entitlement' is that it seems too many folks feel entitled to see a GP immediately - or at their convenience. And when they don't get what they want when they want it - they get angry and resentful

 

[Deleted member 15344]

Maybe if people didn't miss one of the on average 150 missed appointments per month people might be able to get to see a GP quicker.

Far too many people in this country look for medical advice at the first sign of a sniffle , loads of people at the doctors looking for doctors notes to try and get out of work , people waiting to see the doctor for a sore back or a headache.

It's the same at A&E as well - people going because they believe it's an emergency when it's clearly not or when they can't get into the GP.

There is also a good amount of people who living longer now , but as they live longer then their lists of alignments grow which will increase a strain on the NHS

I still believe that we should all have some sort of medical insurance that will pay for our medical bills if required. But also if someone does go to A&E and clearly not an emergency then maybe some sort of fine , same with people not turning up to GP appointments - fine again

 

[SocketRocket]

My observation of 'entitlement' is that it seems too many folks feel entitled to see a GP immediately - or at their convenience. And when they don't get what they want when they want it - they get angry and resentful

Dont know what it's like for you but if I want to book an appointment I will be lucky to get one inside three weeks, otherwise I have to sit on the phone at eight o clock in the morning trying to get through and see if there is a slot available that day, the problem being that lots of others are doing the same ad the line is constantly engaged. It's absolutely rubbish, I can remember the time when I could turn up without an appointment and see the doctor. How is someone who feels a lump in their breast or testicles going to feel if they are told to wait three weeks to see a Doctor.

We are experiencing these type of problems in Health, Education, Housing, Transport, Defense, and just about anywhere the state has to supply a service to the public. Why is it so bad, is it that successive Governments have not spent enough money, is it that they cant raise enough, is it that demand has outstripped supply, have we through encouraging mass immigration and increasing birthrates created these problems and if so why did we not see this coming. I appreciate that things like medical science have progressed and is a cost to us but it's about time someone running the country gave these issues a serious look and gave us a rootmap to improve things or hold up their hands and admit it's beyond their control so just put up.

 

[HomerJSimpson]

I think there needs to be some form of fine for GP no shows or three strikes and your out and have to re-register or find another GP. I also think if you rock up at A&E and are assessed to be non-urgent/life threatening in triage then you wait until there is a lull, whether that's an hour, four or eight. Keep the four hour targets for essential cases and let those using it as a GP drop in sit there. Maybe they'll get bored after the first time and not bother again

 

[Tashyboy]

I think there needs to be some form of fine for GP no shows or three strikes and your out and have to re-register or find another GP. I also think if you rock up at A&E and are assessed to be non-urgent/life threatening in triage then you wait until there is a lull, whether that's an hour, four or eight. Keep the four hour targets for essential cases and let those using it as a GP drop in sit there. Maybe they'll get bored after the first time and not bother again

👍 Sometimes you gotta be cruel to be kind, coz the system is being abused.

 

[bluewolf]

Not sure if it's different in other areas, but where I live, if your GP practice is closed then you make an appointment at the walk in clinic. Never had to wait more than a day for an appointment. I even went up on Boxing Day due to severe tonsillitis. Rang up, got an appointment 2 hours later, had the antibiotics 30 minutes after that. Seems like there really is a 7 day NHS for those who really look for it.

 

[SocketRocket]

Not sure if it's different in other areas, but where I live, if your GP practice is closed then you make an appointment at the walk in clinic. Never had to wait more than a day for an appointment. I even went up on Boxing Day due to severe tonsillitis. Rang up, got an appointment 2 hours later, had the antibiotics 30 minutes after that. Seems like there really is a 7 day NHS for those who really look for it.

Walk in centre, if only and why do you make an appointment for a walk in centre.

The only walk in centre here is A&E

 

[bluewolf]

Walk in centre, if only and why do you make an appointment for a walk in centre.

The only walk in centre here is A&E

Ring the NHS helpline, explain symptoms, appointment arranged with the walk in centre, walk in, see Doctor, walk out. Simple really.

Take a look at NHS online and see where your nearest is. I'd hate to think that people were complaining about lack of access to a Doctor at the weekend just because that haven't looked.

 

[chrisd]

I recently was having surgery, paid for by my medical insurance, and the need for it stemmed from an earlier emergency NHS operation so my doctors record showed that the following up procedure was unavoidable. I asked my consultants secretary to contact my doctor to verify the need for the op and to get the ok - no! I had to make an appointment, take a morning off work for a 10 second Appointment! As I was done with the doctor after 10 seconds I asked her to check that my ears weren't blocked, no they weren't so she decided to make an Audiology appointment - no real problem but at that appointment the audiologist wanted me to see the specialist who was actually in my own doctor's surgery and had no one with him - NO CHANCE as my doctor hadn't done a referral to him and I'd have to get another doctors appointment to refer me on his next visit - you really couldn't make it up, how much did this all cost the NHS?

 

[bluewolf]

I recently was having surgery, paid for by my medical insurance, and the need for it stemmed from an earlier emergency NHS operation so my doctors record showed that the following up procedure was unavoidable. I asked my consultants secretary to contact my doctor to verify the need for the op and to get the ok - no! I had to make an appointment, take a morning off work for a 10 second Appointment! As I was done with the doctor after 10 seconds I asked her to check that my ears weren't blocked, no they weren't so she decided to make an Audiology appointment - no real problem but at that appointment the audiologist wanted me to see the specialist who was actually in my own doctor's surgery and had no one with him - NO CHANCE as my doctor hadn't done a referral to him and I'd have to get another doctors appointment to refer me on his next visit - you really couldn't make it up, how much did this all cost the NHS?

Yup, the management of the NHS is very poor.. You'd almost think that someone somewhere was attempting to drive down the efficiency of the NHS on ideological grounds so that they can privatise it.. But that would be ridiculous, wouldn't it?

 

[chrisd]

Yup, the management of the NHS is very poor.. You'd almost think that someone somewhere was attempting to drive down the efficiency of the NHS on ideological grounds so that they can privatise it.. But that would be ridiculous, wouldn't it?

I play golf with some pretty highly qualified medical people and the put the blame pretty much at the door of the management who swap from job to job because, by and large, they are bleedin useless, but looked after and earn a fortune

 

[bluewolf]

I play golf with some pretty highly qualified medical people and the put the blame pretty much at the door of the management who swap from job to job because, by and large, they are bleedin useless, but looked after and earn a fortune

Agree with the useless management part. I'm married to a NHS employee and the tales of management ineptitude are breathtaking.

 

[Tashyboy]

I did say that a couple of pages back. Re stoopid useless management. missisT because she NHS, now when she has to ring for an appointment will suggest that a telephone consultation may be better than an appointment. It usually happens that day. If GP needs to see her. She gets in. If he don't she is still sorted. but having said that. In her job she has met/ worked with many GP surgeries. Ours she rates very highly. Others she says are Rammel. How can they be so differant.