The Footie Thread

[Fade and Die]

That all sounds nice but the fact is I might as well be watching kabaddi or quidditch for all I know of what's going on on the pitch.

Also its not much of a spectacle live. 16 blokes scrummaging down the other end of the pitch then either a penalty for some reason you cannot fathom or something else you cannot make out! Much more enjoyable on the TV.

 

[Deleted member 16999]

The plethora of streaming companies will deal with the increase in money. Sky will pay the same but for less matches and then the like of Amazon Prime or any other streaming company that wants to up its profile will pay a premium for a small tranche of matches. Good for club pockets, bad for the fan. Hate to think what you would need to pay now to see all of your clubs televised matches.

£50.00 per year for the dodgy firestick from Mick on Facebook.

 

[GB72]

£50.00 per year for the dodgy firestick from Mick on Facebook.

Hardly suprising that people resort to that with having to pay Sky, BT, Amazon etc just to see all of your teams matches.

 

[nickjdavis]

What I have never understood is why Boxing day and New Year fixtures are not dedicated to being local derbys. Promote and market it as this and I am sure it will be popular. Each club plays the nearest 2 clubs ot them over those 2 matches or even do the home and away fixtures back to back.

They used to be....back in the "olden days" (Very olden days), but in more modern times the fixture computer rarely thinks so intelligently (having said that...my perception is that fixtures have seemed a bit more sensible over the Xmas period in recent years).

I do remember going to watch Newcastle away at Southend on New Years Day once in the early 90's....luckily I lived in Essex so it was far quicker/easier to get to than a home game at the time....but the poor sods travelling back to Newcastle after a 4-0 defeat....I did feel for them!!!

 

[GB72]

They used to be....back in the "olden days" (Very olden days), but in more modern times the fixture computer rarely thinks so intelligently (having said that...my perception is that fixtures have seemed a bit more sensible over the Xmas period in recent years).

I do remember going to watch Newcastle away at Southend on New Years Day once in the early 90's....luckily I lived in Essex so it was far quicker/easier to get to than a home game at the time....but the poor sods travelling back to Newcastle after a 4-0 defeat....I did feel for them!!!

it is not lmited to football. Tigers have had the treck down to Exeter on New years Eve very recently.

 

[Liverbirdie]

That is how the world works though, not just football. Some people just get born lucky, they happen to have a rare talent and they ultimately get paid a lot for it. Whether it be many different types of sportsperson, movie star, pop star or even many in business. Yes, they may buy a back pack for £6k which is mental to most of us, but at least they are spending their money. That £6k goes into someone else's pocket, and so on and so forth. I've bought golf t-shirts for £100, and there will still be people that think that is relatively mental, everything is relative. Anyway, maybe this back back had some nice features

Liverpoolphil is correct though, unless a worldwide cap is applied, then putting a salary cap in the PL would end up being a massive own goal for them.

In terms of 7 games on a Saturday at 3pm, this can get tricky if you have 4 teams playing in the Champions League and 3-4 teams in Europa League. In many cases, Sunday matches may be better for some of those teams? You also have Monday Night Football, which is pretty popular amongst fans. If you start limiting live PL football to a Saturday evening and a couple of matches on a Sunday, it may become less attractive for fans to buy Sky, or at least both Sky and BT.

However, one interesting point is, are we at the peak in terms of the money gained from broadcasting in its current format? It is difficult to see how broadcasting companies can aim to make even more money, unless they can rake in more and more fans. I can't see them spreading out the fixtures much more than they do, so unless they can get to a point where every game is televised, even 3pm on Saturday, how do they make even more money? I wonder if that is why clubs tried to vote for that Super League, as they knew the only way they could get more money was to change the format to suit them, rather than improve broadcasting rights on the existing formats of each league.

I'm sorry, but you can keep on throwing what ifs and maybes, and why dont we's at me, but overall you have only looking at it from the TV fan perspective, and unless you have done the hard yards the other way, you wont understand what is involved.

I go to 95% of the home games now, and virtually no away games as lost all my credits (my own decision) so although dont travel any more, it was something I did from between the ages of 13-45 (1983-2015), so have gone on the old footy specials, regular rail, coach, ferry, plane, car and possibly others, so know what planning, money and commitment is involved.

It doesnt benefit me any more but I would still massively take into account the away fans views on many things though. The £20 cap was a great idea, sadly I missed it by 1-2 years, but when West Brom start charging you £52, it was time to sack it.

And before you get up in arms about it, how was the spectacle of the premiership with no fans in - crap - so think about it without any fans before "advising" away fans what they should just put up with!!!!

 

[Liverbirdie]

True but Germany are not big wage payers and suddenly you have a ton of players on the market looking to go to a more limited number of clubs. If you have 3 strikers all looking for a deal to get out of the premier league, the clubs are gong to negiate wages down due to that excesss supply.

Germany's zeigeist should be copied by all European leagues - just get rid of Bayern Munich, though.

 

[Swango1980]

I'm sorry, but you can keep on throwing what ifs and maybes, and why dont we's at me, but overall you have only looking at it from the TV fan perspective, and ubless you have done the hard yards the other way, you want understand what is involved.

I go to 95% of the home games now, and virtually no away games as lost all my credits (my own decision) so although dont travel any more, it was something I did from between the ages of 13-45 (1983-2015), so have gone on the old footy specials, regular rail, coach, ferry, plane, car and possibly others, so know what planning, money and commitment is involved.

It doesnt benefit me any more but I would still massively take into account the aways fans views on many things though. The £20 cap was a great idea, sadly I missed it by 1-2 years, but when West Brom start charging you £52, it was time to sack it.

And before you get up in arms about it, how crap was the spectacle of the premiership with no fans in - crap, so think about it without any fans before "advising" away fans what they should just put up with!!!!

Those are pretty important questions if you are proposing things change. It is pretty important to look at the consequences of your actions, not just looking at it from your own selfish point of view.

And yes, I'm looking at it from a fan who watches most football on TV. So of course I will be looking at it from a different angle to you. However, I am not the only one in my position. There will be millions more in my position as well.

So, you can demand player salary caps. You can demand more 3pm kick off games. You can demand less games on TV. All very well, but if you are not looking out for the potential negative consequences of those actions, what is the point?

 

[Deleted member 1740]

Maybe your attitude sums up fans living in the past?

How does my posts equate to living in the past?

If Sunderland are going to play away at Southampton, there is going to be a long trip ahead. Now some travelling fans may despise an early start (if it was a 12:30 kick off). Others might prefer it, as they prefer to travel early and get home at a semi reasonable time. Every fan will be different. However, if you are a fan that is committed to going to those games, don't moan about the logistics in getting there. I'd be more sympathetic if all your arrangements had been made, and then the fixture kick off / date was changed at the last minute. I certainly would back up your frustrations on that particular point.

I'm sure the calendar is not absolutely perfect in terms of every fixture being played at the ideal time, but it is not every week that a club is in Europe on a Wednesday and has a noon kick off on a Saturday. It happens, yes, especially to the big clubs, but it is not every week. And, if the fixture is moved because of TV, if it is such a hardship, watch it on TV that week. Nobody will think less of you.

Yes, Sky are selfish and are in it to make money. That is what businesses do. However, to do so they need to have a strong relationship with clubs and fans. They do so by giving clubs lots of money, and televising games for fans to watch (of which there will be many more than attend the game itself, again for the big clubs at least).

It is your attitude which scares me when people say it could be a good idea if fans were to take over clubs.

what attitude is that? Point where i said it was a good idea please

What would season ticket holders at clubs like Liverpool, City, Chelsea, etc do? Veto 12pm kick offs, even if the games can no longer be televised? Would they accept a severe loss in revenue? Would they be happy to tell the millions of die hard fans of their clubs, those that invest in Sky or go to the pub, that "sorry, the game will not be on this week because travelling fans do not want to get up early to get to the game"? But, it is match going fans who know what is best, so certainly my opinion should be in no way respected.

Jesus christ you dont half type some tripe. Is it really unfair for fans to ask the TV schedulers to think about fans when they're planning TV games?

PS: As I said before, I have full respect for the commitment of match going fans. I'd like to think most just get on with it, and enjoy their hobby. Perhaps they'll have the odd grumble when they've a long trip, unsuitable kick off time or go to a ground that is more inaccessible than many others. But, that is just part and parcel of football these days. We are not going back to the dark ages where every match is at 3pm on a Saturday, and the only chance non match goers will ever get to see their team is for a few minutes on Match of the Day.

Nobody is moaning at all. You asked for an example of a potential 7hr journey for a 1230 ko and i provided you with one.

Most match going fans accepted change in KO times many many years ago. The ones that never, stopped going, those who cant let go through the emotional attachment to football, having a big circle of friends through football etc keep going.

When you support a team from your local area and its ingrained in you from such a young age its very hard to let go.

I'll Guarantee you one thing, if there was more money to be made with Tlevised 3pm KO's then 3pm KO's would be back in a heartbeat.

My post 18,888 is accurate.

 

[Swango1980]

Nobody is moaning at all. You asked for an example of a potential 7hr journey for a 1230 ko and i provided you with one.

Most match going fans accepted change in KO times many many years ago. The ones that never, stopped going, those who cant let go through the emotional attachment to football, having a big circle of friends through football etc keep going.

When you support a team from your local area and its ingrained in you from such a young age its very hard to let go.

I'll Guarantee you one thing, if there was more money to be made with Tlevised 3pm KO's then 3pm KO's would be back in a heartbeat.

My post 18,888 is accurate.

Yes, there is a lot of truth in post 18,888. Telly clappers are important to football as well. They too are people like yourself, who love watching football.

Furthermore, I am sure there were many season ticket holders that were pleased that football continued during the pandemic. Yes, they couldn't go to the game, but I am sure many of them would have preferred to watch their teams on television at least, rather than have no football during a truly miserable time.

 

[4LEX]

I love live football and attend around 20 games a season. A dozen of my club and a mix of big games as a neutral. Some seasons it's more, some less. I have done home and away for a few years and had a season ticket for over a decade when younger so I understand the comments from proper match goers. I reached 60 of Club 92 at one point. However I find it staggering anyone with a full time job, family and interests can find the time to watch all that football and travel.

Like all sports, football has evolved and will continue to do so. As someone with a foot in both camps, I would like to see a balance of lower ticket prices for the match going fans but also more games on TV for the global audience. If that happens then a decent chunk has to be alloted for the clubs down the pyramid who would suffer. A wage cap would never happen as the current players would strike and no club, league or broadcaster would have the bottle to sit it out. You'd have to write of the current generation of stars and start again.

 

[Hobbit]

Yes, there is a lot of truth in post 18,888. Telly clappers are important to football as well. They too are people like yourself, who love watching football.

Furthermore, I am sure there were many season ticket holders that were pleased that football continued during the pandemic. Yes, they couldn't go to the game, but I am sure many of them would have preferred to watch their teams on television at least, rather than have no football during a truly miserable time.

Bizarrely, you could argue telly clappers are more important. Who do you think the tv ads are targeted at? Where does the majority of money come from? Advertising?

 

[Deleted member 1740]

Yes, there is a lot of truth in post 18,888. Telly clappers are important to football as well. They too are people like yourself, who love watching football.

Furthermore, I am sure there were many season ticket holders that were pleased that football continued during the pandemic. Yes, they couldn't go to the game, but I am sure many of them would have preferred to watch their teams on television at least, rather than have no football during a truly miserable time.

For the majority of last season most games BCD was a painful watch, thats without talking about Liverpool games. Fans in grounds makes the game the telly clappers crave.

Anyway thats enough of this subject for me. Enjoy Amazon's awful delayed streams for tonights games.

 

[Swango1980]

Bizarrely, you could argue telly clappers are more important. Who do you think the tv ads are targeted at? Where does the majority of money come from? Advertising?

I could, but the way the discussion was going, that would be the nuclear option. The "you can't handle the truth" card. And, no doubt I'd be accused of being a disgrace to football, and the worst enemy to all season ticket holders.

So, I'll take pleasure watching you run with that one

 

[Swango1980]

For the majority of last season most games BCD was a painful watch, thats without talking about Liverpool games. Fans in grounds makes the game the telly clappers crave.

Anyway thats enough of this subject for me. Enjoy Amazon's awful delayed streams for tonights games.

Agreed, football is relatively rubbish with no fans. I don't for one second want that. But, I'd rather have had that, than none at all.

 

[Hobbit]

I could, but the way the discussion was going, that would be the nuclear option. The "you can't handle the truth" card. And, no doubt I'd be accused of being a disgrace to football, and the worst enemy to all season ticket holders.

So, I'll take pleasure watching you run with that one

Like you, I bottled it. Hence “you could argue…” I didn’t say “it is…”

 

[Deleted member 16999]

Bizarrely, you could argue telly clappers are more important. Who do you think the tv ads are targeted at? Where does the majority of money come from? Advertising?

They’re more important to the TV companies, not to the game.

 

[Deleted member 15344]

Revenue is huge to the game right now - and a lot of that revenue comes down advertising.

It shouldn’t be top trumps on who supports a club better than someone else - each fan of a club will have their own importance to the next.

 

[Swango1980]

They’re more important to the TV companies, not to the game.

Interesting point, I'm not so sure. Just to try and isolate the two components:

Scenario 1: End all TV contracts. You want to see your team, go to the game.

Scenario 2: All matches shown on TV live, but empty stadiums.

No doubt, both scenarios are worse that the current situation. Fans would be lost from game. However, Scenario 1 would mean I, and millions of others, would never see our teams again. Forgetting travelling logistics, there are not enough seats at Old Trafford. And, there'd be none available, as tickets would initially be like gold dust. Ticket prices may end up being enormous due to supply and demand. Millions would simply stop following football, there'd be nothing to follow for many. Sure, this would probably result in more competitive football across the leagues, as the big clubs lose a massive amount of supporters, and small clubs retain their local support they probably already had.

Scenario 2 atmosphere would be killed, and that too would reduce fans. However, the game would still be accessible to millions more.

So, from my perspective, I'm going to go out on a limb to day the television fan is more important to the game. Maybe others, especially supporters of small clubs in lower leagues, would prefer Scenario 1.

Maybe there is no right or wrong answer. Scenario 2 may be right for me and millions of others. Scenario 1 could be genuinely the right answer for many match goers.

 

[Hobbit]

They’re more important to the TV companies, not to the game.

Would the Premiership exist in guise we know it without tv money? No. Would advertisers pay Sky if there were no viewers? No. Ergo football, indirectly, needs tv clappers.