The Footie Thread

[Deleted member 29109]

If you look at the formation 4-3-3

Four at the back, 2 def midfielders with mount in the middle, then three up front. It’s like he is playing a diamond with mount at the base. The problem is that when Foden and others were making runs forward Into spaces 2 of the three with the ball were def midfielders. They just could not make the passes that ( unlike when Sterling scored in the first game. If we get through to the last 16 and we should. That formation is going to get tanked big style by one of the better teams.

Either of Phillips or Rice should be dropped. Sterling should be dropped for Grealish and Kane should be rested. He is playing for a move to Burnley at this rate. The England squad is rammed with youthful energy, the problem is even if they do play. Southgate is massively out of his depth in coaching that talent.

But England weren't playing 433

It was either 4141 or 4231

I think we needed to play with a back 3 and push everything forward and have 2 up against the 3 central defenders.

The main problem last night was the complete lack of movement up front. Which against a team playing 541 is essential. Its hard to play forward if there is nothing to play forward to.

 

[pokerjoke]

The ironic thing is though that the Italians who traditionally play a slow solid game, score then shut up shop are playing football taken form the City/Liverpool playbooks and are managed by Mancini whos had time here. If they can play that way, why can't our manager see the benefit of it or is it only the foriegn managers who can see it's an attractive and effective way to play (Guadiola/Klopp/Mancini etc)?
Just because our players are paid so much and are probably the highest earners in Europe doesn't make them the best.

Never said are players are the best.
The most knackered.
I also agree Southgate is more scared to lose than play expansive football.
In the knockout stages it might come down to he has to attack at some stage.

 

[MadAdey]

Never said are players are the best.
The most knackered.
I also agree Southgate is more scared to lose than play expansive football.
In the knockout stages it might come down to he has to attack at some stage.

Me personally would prefer to see England give it a go and loose than what we saw yesterday. Playing like that is not going to get us through the next round. Watching England yesterday reminded me of watching LIverpool at times last year. Would dominate possession, but not able to find a way of breaking the opposition down.

 

[fundy]

But England weren't playing 433

It was either 4141 or 4231

I think we needed to play with a back 3 and push everything forward and have 2 up against the 3 central defenders.

The main problem last night was the complete lack of movement up front. Which against a team playing 541 is essential. Its hard to play forward if there is nothing to play forward to.

More like 631 for large parts! the 2 in midfield are fine if it frees up the full backs to get much further forward but Southgate seems to want a flat back 4 and the 2 holding, cant have both for me, especially as the players appear to have no freedom to operate outside the structure. If the only way to get the width further up the pitch is to play 3 at the back then he should look to go that route in the KO stages imo.

 

[Deleted member 29109]

More like 631 for large parts! the 2 in midfield are fine if it frees up the full backs to get much further forward but Southgate seems to want a flat back 4 and the 2 holding, cant have both for me, especially as the players appear to have no freedom to operate outside the structure. If the only way to get the width further up the pitch is to play 3 at the back then he should look to go that route in the KO stages imo.

That is why we need Walker and Tripper. Even if Trippier plays on the left. Which isn't a problem in my opinion.

 

[chrisd]

IS it that he is not fit, or just fed up with never getting any supply. Together with Son they play quickly and move it fast between them. With England it is just so slow from going from back to front. They win the ball back and do not move it forward giving the other team a chacne to get the defence set, instead of cathing them out of position. Kane is having to drop back into midfield to try and get a touch, instead of being up top recieving the ball for quick inter changes with Sterling. Worse thing is he is dropping into the area Mount plays in, causing it to get crowded.

I agree. We are moving the ball too slowly which give defences time to recover, we would rather pass from the half way line to the goalkeeper rather than try a through ball just in case we give possession away. I get that the opposition can't score if they can't get the ball but we can't score either if we dont attack.i also don't see why Foden was taken off as he was our most lively forward and Stirling was doing nothing.

 

[fundy]

That is why we need Walker and Tripper. Even if Trippier plays on the left. Which isn't a problem in my opinion.

think its an instruction problem too rather than just personnel tbh! would give chilwell a go on the left and trippier on the right if it was me

 

[Deleted member 15344]

It’s amusing the level of excuses across social media today but it’s time the media should say it how it is

England who are supposed to be one of the favourites and ranked 4th in the World played against the 3rd lowest in the competition and it was on home soil and they were set up to not lose - pathetic really

Once again all hype and no substance

The squad they have should be playing so much better with so many bright attacking flair players - the sort of players that have helped the likes of France , Holland etc do well over the years , the sort of players England havent ever had but now they arrive they employ a manager who hasnt the first clue what to do with them

He plays a flat back four with 2 defensive midfielders sat in front - fine but then the fullbacks who should have a license to go forward because of the two sitting players very rarely venture past the halfway line, the “attacking mid” drops into the centre more because the centre forward spends all game dropping deep - that ends up leaving two “wider” players isolate and they then start to drop deeper as well. It’s shocking tactics and set up - as well as playing players who have struggled a lot recently whilst the form players sit and bench warm , glad TAA isn’t there , he would be so frustrated to have the ball and then look and see no England player in the box to deliver the ball too.

And then during the actual game the players just play on the defensive , allow Scotland to dictate the game and a young CM who still doesn’t play regualry is allowed to dominate the middle of the park. There was a stat that a player for Slovakia has more shots on target than England - he has also only played as a substitute ?. Also when looking to make a change early he brings off one of the brighter players and then puts on someone who should be allowed to roam is then put out wide - only an excellent performance from Pickford saved England being embarrassed . Look at the way Adams played - why was Kane not showing the same level of passion and desire , he should also give up the armband - awful currently

England have done enough to qualify but they are going to get a battering from a top team when they face them

Against Czech Rep it should be time to unleash the players

Pickford

James
Mings
Stones
Chilwell

Rice/Henderson
Mount
Grealish

Foden
DCL
Sancho

Stop playing to ensure they don’t concede and take the game to the opposition. The recent World Cup masked how poor Southgate is as a top level manager. Seen Howe mentioned- at least he plays attacking football and has done well at the top level - Southgate was poor as a Prem manager as well and got very lucky to get the England job. Behind all the hype of “coming home” and waistcoat - it’s the same old overhyped England when they should really be dangerous in this competition because of the players they have.

 

[Doon frae Troon]

It was painful to watch. I would love to know how many passes were made made in a backwards direction. Finally when Grealish came on we had someone who was at least trying to get at the Scottish defence and give it a go. HOw the hell did we have 60% possesion and only mange 9 attempts on goal and one on target? Scotland had 40% and managed 11 shots and 2 on target.

That is the way Clarke sets up his teams.
Very effective way of playing, worked well at Kilmarnock in the SPL.

 

[Deleted member 16999]

One rubbish performance against a Team that stepped up their game does not mean the end of the world.

We’ve seen World Cup Winners lose group matches on the way to winning the comp.

We’re still in it, possibly the best time to have our worst performance if we were going to have one.

We will get better and on “our” day we can compete with anyone, let’s hope we do.

On the other side, if we don’t get out the group I believe Southgate will walk.

 

[Bunkermagnet]

I cant help but feel we have so many players that look "World class" playing for their clubs that are full of foriegn talent that look bang average when playing with a full team of English. Perhaps we need to accept it's the foriegn talent that makes our overpaid average joes look so good and stop thinking we can beat the World.
Stirling is a prime example, looks nothing without Suerez or De Bruyne to feed him.

 

[pendodave]

Plenty of times we've started terribly and been forced by injury or necessity to change things up and get better. The maradonna defeat and crying gazza tournaments were both awful to start with. The Rossi Italians had 3 draws in the group iirc.
Not to say we won't still be sh*#@ going forward, but it's definitely possible that we'll improve...

 

[MadAdey]

That is the way Clarke sets up his teams.
Very effective way of playing, worked well at Kilmarnock in the SPL.

I’m not criticizing them, they had a game plan and it worked.

 

[Beezerk]

Alle Hungary

 

[Swinglowandslow]

Plenty of times we've started terribly and been forced by injury or necessity to change things up and get better. The maradonna defeat and crying gazza tournaments were both awful to start with. The Rossi Italians had 3 draws in the group iirc.
Not to say we won't still be sh*#@ going forward, but it's definitely possible that we'll improve...

Too many letters in that last sentence....remove ' ly..possible'
Cos we can't get worse?

 

[Deleted member 15344]

Alle Hungary

Doing it nice and simple , waiting for France to trip themselves up going forward then just bursting forward at pace , superb from Hungary at the moment with France waiting for Mbappe to do something - this is also the Premier League Pogba playing

 

[Billysboots]

I love it that people are adopting a positive “it’s a marathon, not a sprint” approach to England’s involvement in this tournament, but I can’t help feeling there’s an element of rose tinted glass wearing involved.

I’d love to see England go deep into this tournament, but the realist in me has seen enough in recent years to know that, as soon as we come up against decent opposition, we’ll come unstuck. The run to the WC semis in 2018 was fortuitous at best, where we flattered to deceive and were made to look what we are when we played sides with any class at all - distinctly ordinary.

I’ve seen nothing in the three years since to lift my mood. As per normal, we cruise through qualifying, and this time have been handed a group which, given the attacking talent available in an around the squad, we should be winning at a canter. Instead we huff and puff against a very average Croatia, and were truly awful last night.

Sancho and Bellingham haven’t had a kick, we play two defensive midfielders against a Scotland side struggling to score, our substitutions have been baffling and some key players are horribly out of form, and yet seem to be preferred over those who aren’t.

The FIFA world rankings are codswallop. There is no way on god’s earth we are the 4th best side in the world, and it’s about time we stopped expecting the side to perform as though we are.

I had a few quid at 11/1 on England not getting out of the group. I’m starting to think I may cover all my Euro bets by bedtime on Tuesday.

 

[Deleted member 15344]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1406190875118555138

??

 

[PJ87]

It’s amusing the level of excuses across social media today but it’s time the media should say it how it is

England who are supposed to be one of the favourites and ranked 4th in the World played against the 3rd lowest in the competition and it was on home soil and they were set up to not lose - pathetic really

Once again all hype and no substance

The squad they have should be playing so much better with so many bright attacking flair players - the sort of players that have helped the likes of France , Holland etc do well over the years , the sort of players England havent ever had but now they arrive they employ a manager who hasnt the first clue what to do with them

He plays a flat back four with 2 defensive midfielders sat in front - fine but then the fullbacks who should have a license to go forward because of the two sitting players very rarely venture past the halfway line, the “attacking mid” drops into the centre more because the centre forward spends all game dropping deep - that ends up leaving two “wider” players isolate and they then start to drop deeper as well. It’s shocking tactics and set up - as well as playing players who have struggled a lot recently whilst the form players sit and bench warm , glad TAA isn’t there , he would be so frustrated to have the ball and then look and see no England player in the box to deliver the ball too.

And then during the actual game the players just play on the defensive , allow Scotland to dictate the game and a young CM who still doesn’t play regualry is allowed to dominate the middle of the park. There was a stat that a player for Slovakia has more shots on target than England - he has also only played as a substitute ?. Also when looking to make a change early he brings off one of the brighter players and then puts on someone who should be allowed to roam is then put out wide - only an excellent performance from Pickford saved England being embarrassed . Look at the way Adams played - why was Kane not showing the same level of passion and desire , he should also give up the armband - awful currently

England have done enough to qualify but they are going to get a battering from a top team when they face them

Against Czech Rep it should be time to unleash the players

Pickford

James
Mings
Stones
Chilwell

Rice/Henderson
Mount
Grealish

Foden
DCL
Sancho

Stop playing to ensure they don’t concede and take the game to the opposition. The recent World Cup masked how poor Southgate is as a top level manager. Seen Howe mentioned- at least he plays attacking football and has done well at the top level - Southgate was poor as a Prem manager as well and got very lucky to get the England job. Behind all the hype of “coming home” and waistcoat - it’s the same old overhyped England when they should really be dangerous in this competition because of the players they have.

So what exactly has Phillips (our best player against Croatia) done wrong to be dropped for Henderson? Who's not played in months apart from missing a pen he shouldn't have taken? Wrong shirt?

 

[paddyc]

If England win group they play either France Portugal or Germany?
finish 2nd they play Spain Sweden or Slovakia Poland?
if that's right 2nd looks the better option. Gareth knows what hes doing?