The Footie Thread

[Bdill93]

Marinakis is a serious bloke isn't he? He properly wants us to compete.

Haha I think half the prem owners are the same, but it makes a massive difference having an engaged owner who makes good decisions.

If you compare to say Wolves - who seem to make some great recruitment decisions - but then seems happy to take transfer profits and not grow the team - its light and day.

Only way to keep marching upwards is continued investment these days - and even then FFP hurts us all.

 

[Arthur Wedge]

I’m in a WhatsApp group with a dozen golf mates. On Sunday one of the members posted half a dozen memes of seagulls taking a dump on the United badge, along with other similar nonsense. He’s a 55 year old retired police superintendent.

He NEVER posts anything relating to the clubs supported by other group members when their teams are battered, and rarely posts anything relating to his own team. His contributions relate solely to Manchester United. In short, he’s obsessed. And he’s been told as much.

He’s a Liverpool fan.

It’s a rivalry that’s been going on for a long time now - the only other club that a Liverpool fan would be bothered about is Everton

The Man Utd / Liverpool rivalry, banter , back and forth etc has been around for decades

Chelsea have tried to muscle in a little bit , then Arsenal , then City but it will always be Liverpool and Man Utd

The old Ferguson knocking of the perch and both clubs very close in terms of trophies

I have seen United fans celebrating when City were beating Liverpool to the titles in recent years

 

[Don Barzini]

Only way to keep marching upwards is continued investment these days - and even then FFP hurts us all.

It's going to be very interesting to see what happens with City and their 115 charges. I keep hearing whisperings they're going to get away with just a fine. The fact that Haaland has just signed a 9-year contract and that City look to be spunking several hundred gajillion pounds in this window would seem to suggest they aren't worried.

And if that is the case, then surely the whole PSR system is untenable...?

 

[Arthur Wedge]

Haha I think half the prem owners are the same, but it makes a massive difference having an engaged owner who makes good decisions.

If you compare to say Wolves - who seem to make some great recruitment decisions - but then seems happy to take transfer profits and not grow the team - its light and day.

Only way to keep marching upwards is continued investment these days - and even then FFP hurts us all.

When it comes to FFP or PSR etc etc clubs need to find a way to increase the commercial income - CL football will help , that’s worth at least an extra £100mil a season

And then of course it’s all about great recruitment and coaching

A good owner will put the right people in place for those decisions to be made

Half the issues that clubs like Chelsea , United have had in recent years are not having the right people in place above a manager to make the right recruitment and football decisions

Right now Forest have recruited very well and coach who is getting the best out of the players

The next step will be massive for the club - keeping hold of the best players and keeping the club in the CL for more than a season , do that and the club can go places

 

[Arthur Wedge]

It's going to be very interesting to see what happens with City and their 115 charges. I keep hearing whisperings they're going to get away with just a fine. The fact that Haaland has just signed a 9-year contract and that City look to be spunking several hundred gajillion pounds in this window would seem to suggest they aren't worried.

And if that is the case, then surely the whole PSR system is untenable...?

Apparently there will be some level of transfer ban for a significant number of years

These charges are more related to the old FFP rules as opposed to PSR rules

If after all this time it’s just a small fine then it will make a mockery of their FFP rules and could open some floodgates

 

[Swango1980]

It’s a rivalry that’s been going on for a long time now - the only other club that a Liverpool fan would be bothered about is Everton

The Man Utd / Liverpool rivalry, banter , back and forth etc has been around for decades

Chelsea have tried to muscle in a little bit , then Arsenal , then City but it will always be Liverpool and Man Utd

The old Ferguson knocking of the perch and both clubs very close in terms of trophies

I have seen United fans celebrating when City were beating Liverpool to the titles in recent years

I'd like someone to do a comparison of how many Everton related posts you have made in this forum compared to Man Utd related posts.

I don't think anyone needs explaining the rivalry between Man Utd and Liverpool, or that Man Utd fans will give Liverpool fans some banter and enjoy seeing them lose. What was actually being discussed was the pure obsession Liverpool fans in general seem to have with Man Utd, that the banter towards Man Utd actually exceeds the time they give to their own club. And, not just banter. But the very carefully worded, detailed opinions they give on everything to do with Man Utd. Whether it be how they run their club, recruitment, scouting reports from players, review of manager, etc. As much as I'll enjoy a bit of banter against Liverpool every now and then, I won't pretend to have an expert opinion on every detail of Liverpool football club. And I have no interest in researching Liverpool football club, so that I can educate the rest of the world what I (think) I know.

Maybe I'm wrong. In a (hypothetical) world where Man Utd overtake Liverpool and are consistently better than them, maybe the Man Utd fans in here will come in here almost daily to banter Liverpool fans, whilst also sharing their in depth, detailed views in how Liverpool run their club, all their players, their manager, etc. I very much doubt it, but maybe we see one day (although probably not anytime soon)

 

[Don Barzini]

Apparently there will be some level of transfer ban for a significant number of years

Was chatting to a mate the other day and he suggested this would be the best form of punishment. They won't have the balls to relegate them down the chain. But banning them from making any signings for a few years will properly hurt.

I'm an old cynic, but I am bracing myself for a massive farce.

 

[Bdill93]

It's going to be very interesting to see what happens with City and their 115 charges. I keep hearing whisperings they're going to get away with just a fine. The fact that Haaland has just signed a 9-year contract and that City look to be spunking several hundred gajillion pounds in this window would seem to suggest they aren't worried.

And if that is the case, then surely the whole PSR system is untenable...?

I don't think PSR is going anywhere, Villa were part of a small number of teams trying to get the cap moved or scrapped all together earlier this season - but the majority of teams still voted for it to remain the same.

Like Phil's said, the only way for clubs like Villa, Newcastle and Forest to keep going in the right direction is to keep recruiting well and maintain league position around the top 6 to get European football.

One bad window/ big money signing hurts a lot!

That being said - if you can flog one player for massive profit it gives you some decent headroom for a number of years - we rode on the Grealish money for 3 years.

 

[Arthur Wedge]

Was chatting to a mate the other day and he suggested this would be the best form of punishment. They won't have the balls to relegate them down the chain. But banning them from making any signings for a few years will properly hurt.

I'm an old cynic, but I am bracing myself for a massive farce.

I think that’s why Haaland has signed a long contract and why they are splashing out now getting players in before it happens

 

[Beezerk]

Re the Man City charges and people saying they will get away with a fine, do we know exactly what the charges are, the actual fine details? Surely the punishment will match the crime, it makes me laugh when fans of opposing teams get their knicker in a twist because they want relegation or worse when they don't even know the full facts

 

[Arthur Wedge]

I'd like someone to do a comparison of how many Everton related posts you have made in this forum compared to Man Utd related posts.

I don't think anyone needs explaining the rivalry between Man Utd and Liverpool, or that Man Utd fans will give Liverpool fans some banter and enjoy seeing them lose. What was actually being discussed was the pure obsession Liverpool fans in general seem to have with Man Utd, that the banter towards Man Utd actually exceeds the time they give to their own club. And, not just banter. But the very carefully worded, detailed opinions they give on everything to do with Man Utd. Whether it be how they run their club, recruitment, scouting reports from players, review of manager, etc. As much as I'll enjoy a bit of banter against Liverpool every now and then, I won't pretend to have an expert opinion on every detail of Liverpool football club. And I have no interest in researching Liverpool football club, so that I can educate the rest of the world what I (think) I know.

Maybe I'm wrong. In a (hypothetical) world where Man Utd overtake Liverpool and are consistently better than them, maybe the Man Utd fans in here will come in here almost daily to banter Liverpool fans, whilst also sharing their in depth, detailed views in how Liverpool run their club, all their players, their manager, etc. I very much doubt it, but maybe we see one day (although probably not anytime soon)

Are you making all these judgments based on just those forum and a very very small level of fans ?

Have you ever been to Red Cafe

Might be eye opening for you

 

[Aztecs27]

Marinakis is a serious bloke isn't he? He properly wants us to compete and not just to be a feeder club to the Protected Six.

I've been critical of some of decisions in the past, especially the first season back when he was hiring and firing board level and recruitment staff and it was all a bit amateurish. But fair play, he's learned, swallowed some pride and got Syrianos back to head the recruitment team (after firing him earlier in the year) and steadied the ship.

He also stuck nearly £100m of his own money into the club to write off the debt and turn them into shares so that it's not counted against PSR. Can't fault the man really.

 

[Lord Tyrion]

Was chatting to a mate the other day and he suggested this would be the best form of punishment. They won't have the balls to relegate them down the chain. But banning them from making any signings for a few years will properly hurt.

I'm an old cynic, but I am bracing myself for a massive farce.

With their size of squad, the youngsters they have coming through, and the flurry of signings happening in January......the impact will be annoying for them but not much more.

The system is pathetic anyway, as has been shown by teams selling their own property to themselves to balance the books. That's before you look at how loaded it is to the existing rich teams. I hope City get away with the lot.

 

[Neilds]

Re the Man City charges and people saying they will get away with a fine, do we know exactly what the charges are, the actual fine details? Surely the punishment will match the crime, it .axes me laugh when fans of opposing teams get their knicker in a twist because they want relegation or worse when they don't even know the full facts

Stop with your logical, reasoned views - won't wash on here

 

[Arthur Wedge]

Re the Man City charges and people saying they will get away with a fine, do we know exactly what the charges are, the actual fine details? Surely the punishment will match the crime, it .axes me laugh when fans of opposing teams get their knicker in a twist because they want relegation or worse when they don't even know the full facts

Man City 115 charges hearing Q&A: What is latest on PSR & FFP case?

Manchester City's hearing into 115 Premier League charges should be heard this season - BBC Sport looks at the latest on the case.

www.bbc.com

That’s the full list

Some are not just about the money , there are a good number about failing to comply etc - same as what UEFA charged them with and were found guilty off

The punishments for the charges range vastly from points , fines , transfer bans , even expulsion

 

[Bdill93]

Re the Man City charges and people saying they will get away with a fine, do we know exactly what the charges are, the actual fine details? Surely the punishment will match the crime, it .axes me laugh when fans of opposing teams get their knicker in a twist because they want relegation or worse when they don't even know the full facts

I remember reading/ hearing that the majority of charges are linked to non-compliance with the investigation. Approx 80 or so.

So really, there's only substance in about 25% of the actual charges, the rest are just additional bits thrown their way each time they didn't cooperate.

Edit - see Phils post for info on charges I was a tad out but it was a few years ago!

 

[Bdill93]

Man City 115 charges hearing Q&A: What is latest on PSR & FFP case?

Manchester City's hearing into 115 Premier League charges should be heard this season - BBC Sport looks at the latest on the case.

www.bbc.com

That’s the full list

Some are not just about the money , there are a good number about failing to comply etc - same as what UEFA charged them with and were found guilty off

The punishments for the charges range vastly from points , fines , transfer bans , even expulsion

Great breakdown that - knew id read it all somewhere at some stage!

 

[Beezerk]

Man City 115 charges hearing Q&A: What is latest on PSR & FFP case?

Manchester City's hearing into 115 Premier League charges should be heard this season - BBC Sport looks at the latest on the case.

www.bbc.com

That’s the full list

Some are not just about the money , there are a good number about failing to comply etc - same as what UEFA charged them with and were found guilty off

The punishments for the charges range vastly from points , fines , transfer bans , even expulsion

No, those are the general outlines of the charges, what are the exact finer details of the charges, they ordered too many Domino's one week and forgot to put it on the tax returns? Yes slightly glib reply but you get my drift surely?

 

[Bdill93]

No, those are the general outlines of the charges, what are the exact finer details of the charges, they ordered too many Domino's one week and forgot to put it on the tax returns? Yes slightly glib reply but you get my drift surely?

Bits I've read that are unconfirmed:

Failure to disclose manager salary - rumored to be paying directly from owners rather than through the club.
Overinflated sponsorship from linked companies
Fictitious sponsorship
Part payment of player salaries from non-club related sources.

 

[Arthur Wedge]

No, those are the general outlines of the charges, what are the exact finer details of the charges, they ordered too many Domino's one week and forgot to put it on the tax returns? Yes slightly glib reply but you get my drift surely?

A good number of it is the way some players and manager have alleged to have been paid - outside the books and direct from the ownership

A good deal of it is the over inflated value of sponsership

Number of alleged deals from company’s that have links to the ownership , some having no offices etc