The Footie Thread

[Billysboots]

And that Urgate just isn’t good enough on the ball

But he doesn’t need to be Pele. That’s not what United bought him for. They bought him to sit in front of the back four, or three as it is now, and snuff out attacks. Saying he isn’t good on the ball, given his role, is akin to criticising a lumbering centre half because he can’t put a cross in.

And as it happens, I don’t think he’s anywhere near as bad on the ball as you’re making out, Phil.

 

[Arthur Wedge]

But he doesn’t need to be Pele. That’s not what United bought him for. They bought him to sit in front of the back four, or three as it is now, and snuff out attacks. Saying he isn’t good on the ball, given his role, is akin to criticising a lumbering centre half because he can’t put a cross in.

And as it happens, I don’t think he’s anywhere near as bad on the ball as you’re making out, Phil.

We will see through the season - i don’t think you can just be there to snuff out attacks anymore , players in that role have moved on now , managers seem to want them to also be good on the ball as well - look at the likes of Rodri , Rice and it’s why Endo isn’t playing for us

Need more from players in the middle of the park and it’s why imo PSG let him go and got Neves in

Maybe a player that’s there to help a deep battling against top teams etc

 

[Billysboots]

We will see through the season - i don’t think you can just be there to snuff out attacks anymore , players in that role have moved on now , managers seem to want them to also be good on the ball as well - look at the likes of Rodri , Rice and it’s why Endo isn’t playing for us

Need more from players in the middle of the park and it’s why imo PSG let him go and got Neves in

Maybe a player that’s there to help a deep battling against top teams etc

Said it many times, PSG let him go because he didn’t suit their playing style. Not every player is suited to every club, or even every league.

The classic example of that for me was Veron. Supremely talented player, but patently unsuited to English football, evidenced by his failure at United and then Chelsea.

Ugarte is just the player United needed to shore up a midfield leakier than my wallet when the wife gets near it. As you say, time will tell, but a football team is a jigsaw - you need the right pieces in the right place.

 

[Arthur Wedge]

Said it many times, PSG let him go because he didn’t suit their playing style. Not every player is suited to every club, or even every league.

The classic example of that for me was Veron. Supremely talented player, but patently unsuited to English football, evidenced by his failure at United and then Chelsea.

Ugarte is just the player United needed to shore up a midfield leakier than my wallet when the wife gets near it. As you say, time will tell, but a football team is a jigsaw - you need the right pieces in the right place.

Which is exactly my point in regards De Ligt and Urgate - the list is endless of players that are very good in other leagues struggle in the prem

Time will indeed tell Urgate maybe the sort of player that comes in against a top team - the ideal player is a Casemiro 5 years ago

 

[Aztecs27]

Question of the day (I'm just intrigued to get people's opinions, not here to start anything or get all defensive if you don't agree )

Lad in my office (18 YO, united fan, thinks Antony is actually a good footballer), is convinced that NONE of Forest's Starting Squad gets into the United Squad....so I'm interested to hear opinions of others (united fans and otherwise)

Personally, I'd say our CB's would deserve a shout (Milenkovic in particular) as would CHO and Chris Wood (in current form).

Midfield is tricky as we have some decent quality, but although he's the most punchable bloke going, Bruno is very talented...As are the likes of Mainoo etc but Gibbs White OR Anderson would be in the conversation in Midfield for me (more so Anderson at this point as he's been absolutely unreal since the start of the season)

 

[Arthur Wedge]

Question of the day (I'm just intrigued to get people's opinions, not here to start anything or get all defensive if you don't agree )

Lad in my office (18 YO, united fan, thinks Antony is actually a good footballer), is convinced that NONE of Forest's Starting Squad gets into the United Squad....so I'm interested to hear opinions of others (united fans and otherwise)

Personally, I'd say our CB's would deserve a shout (Milenkovic in particular) as would CHO and Chris Wood (in current form).

Midfield is tricky as we have some decent quality, but although he's the most punchable bloke going, Bruno is very talented...As are the likes of Mainoo etc but Gibbs White OR Anderson would be in the conversation in Midfield for me (more so Anderson at this point as he's been absolutely unreal since the start of the season)

IMO

Both CBs definitely

Anderson gets in

CHO

Tough choice between Fernandes and MGW

Hojlund would score as much as wood if he had the service

 

[RichA]

Question of the day (I'm just intrigued to get people's opinions, not here to start anything or get all defensive if you don't agree )

Lad in my office (18 YO, united fan, thinks Antony is actually a good footballer), is convinced that NONE of Forest's Starting Squad gets into the United Squad....so I'm interested to hear opinions of others (united fans and otherwise)

Personally, I'd say our CB's would deserve a shout (Milenkovic in particular) as would CHO and Chris Wood (in current form).

Midfield is tricky as we have some decent quality, but although he's the most punchable bloke going, Bruno is very talented...As are the likes of Mainoo etc but Gibbs White OR Anderson would be in the conversation in Midfield for me (more so Anderson at this point as he's been absolutely unreal since the start of the season)

Ffs. Don't give them ideas, unless it's JWP.

 

[PaulMdj]

Question of the day (I'm just intrigued to get people's opinions, not here to start anything or get all defensive if you don't agree )

Lad in my office (18 YO, united fan, thinks Antony is actually a good footballer), is convinced that NONE of Forest's Starting Squad gets into the United Squad....so I'm interested to hear opinions of others (united fans and otherwise)

Personally, I'd say our CB's would deserve a shout (Milenkovic in particular) as would CHO and Chris Wood (in current form).

Midfield is tricky as we have some decent quality, but although he's the most punchable bloke going, Bruno is very talented...As are the likes of Mainoo etc but Gibbs White OR Anderson would be in the conversation in Midfield for me (more so Anderson at this point as he's been absolutely unreal since the start of the season)

Form or ability? Many a time a player will struggle with one team and shine with another.

I’ve never rated Wood, but he fits in really well with yous.

Sometimes it’s our age or the Team that we support that clouds the view.

I live in the NE and 2 lads(mid to late 40’s) at the Golf Club are season ticket holders at Man Utd, travel together and when you chat too them you’d think they’d been to different games, one believes Rashford is the answer and has been mismanaged, the other doesn’t rate him.

There’s no doubt Forest are having a great season so far and Utd have stuttered, but the table at the end of the season doesn’t lie.

 

[Billysboots]

Question of the day (I'm just intrigued to get people's opinions, not here to start anything or get all defensive if you don't agree )

Lad in my office (18 YO, united fan, thinks Antony is actually a good footballer), is convinced that NONE of Forest's Starting Squad gets into the United Squad....so I'm interested to hear opinions of others (united fans and otherwise)

Personally, I'd say our CB's would deserve a shout (Milenkovic in particular) as would CHO and Chris Wood (in current form).

Midfield is tricky as we have some decent quality, but although he's the most punchable bloke going, Bruno is very talented...As are the likes of Mainoo etc but Gibbs White OR Anderson would be in the conversation in Midfield for me (more so Anderson at this point as he's been absolutely unreal since the start of the season)

The first part is easy. Antony is absolutely awful. There really is no debate.

As for the rest? Difficult one. Their comparative league positions would suggest that some of the Forest squad MUST be good enough to get in the current United squad. But, and it’s a huge but, would any of those Forest players actually perform better than the current crop of United players in this United side? Really very difficult to say.

The easiest comparison to make would perhaps be Wood and Hojlund. Would Wood score more than Hojlund in this United side? Probably not. Put Hojlund in a Forest shirt and I actually think he scores more goals for you than Wood.

So direct comparison is really tricky. I’m not avoiding the question, just don’t think it’s as straightforward as it comes across.

 

[PJ87]

Question of the day (I'm just intrigued to get people's opinions, not here to start anything or get all defensive if you don't agree )

Lad in my office (18 YO, united fan, thinks Antony is actually a good footballer), is convinced that NONE of Forest's Starting Squad gets into the United Squad....so I'm interested to hear opinions of others (united fans and otherwise)

Personally, I'd say our CB's would deserve a shout (Milenkovic in particular) as would CHO and Chris Wood (in current form).

Midfield is tricky as we have some decent quality, but although he's the most punchable bloke going, Bruno is very talented...As are the likes of Mainoo etc but Gibbs White OR Anderson would be in the conversation in Midfield for me (more so Anderson at this point as he's been absolutely unreal since the start of the season)

I think that elanga would walk into the team over Antony, they should have kept him

Gibbs white would be a better player long term than Fernandez for me.

 

[Aztecs27]

Form or ability? Many a time a player will struggle with one team and shine with another.

I’ve never rated Wood, but he fits in really well with yous.

Sometimes it’s our age or the Team that we support that clouds the view.

I live in the NE and 2 lads(mid to late 40’s) at the Golf Club are season ticket holders at Man Utd, travel together and when you chat too them you’d think they’d been to different games, one believes Rashford is the answer and has been mismanaged, the other doesn’t rate him.

There’s no doubt Forest are having a great season so far and Utd have stuttered, but the table at the end of the season doesn’t lie.

I suppose ability is the correct way to do it...and if we're doing that, you'd have to take Chris Wood out. He's clearly a decent player, but isn't a dynamic current day forward, very old school and relies on service a lot of the time.

Even based on ability, I'd still put up a handful of our measly £350m squad vs. the billion pounds United have spent over the last few years.

I've got a bet on with the lad as he doesn't think we'll finish in the top half. I was a bit wary of agreeing as I a.) wasn't expecting us to be this high and b.) would be happy with 12-14th finish this season...but given the performances back to back vs United and (particularly) Villa - I see no reason why we couldn't finish in the top half now (barring a serious number of injuries)...We've played a lot of the "difficult" away games already and this December spell was looking like a bleak run of games and I'd have been happy with 4 points from 6 games If I'm perfectly honest. But looking at the next 3; Brentford, Spurs and Everton - no reason we can't get 4-6 points from those three (we'll end up with 3 losses on the bounce now )

 

[Billysboots]

I think that elanga would walk into the team over Antony, they should have kept him

But Antony doesn’t really feature now. I agree Elanga is a better player, but does he oust Amad on current form?

Absolutely not.

 

[Aztecs27]

The first part is easy. Antony is absolutely awful. There really is no debate.

As for the rest? Difficult one. Their comparative league positions would suggest that some of the Forest squad MUST be good enough to get in the current United squad. But, and it’s a huge but, would any of those Forest players actually perform better than the current crop of United players in this United side? Really very difficult to say.

The easiest comparison to make would perhaps be Wood and Hojlund. Would Wood score more than Hojlund in this United side? Probably not. Put Hojlund in a Forest shirt and I actually think he scores more goals for you than Wood.

So direct comparison is really tricky. I’m not avoiding the question, just don’t think it’s as straightforward as it comes across.

This is what I said to him... i.e United like to play with a back 3 vs back 4 and the styles of football/skill sets are very different in that area alone. But I agree with what you're saying. Hojlund would be a great addition to Forest (embarrassing "throat cutting" goal celebration when you draw level aside ).

 

[PJ87]

But Antony doesn’t really feature now. I agree Elanga is a better player, but does he oust Amad on current form?

Absolutely not.

Who's on the other wing? Because amad tore city apart soon as he swapped wings

 

[Aztecs27]

But Antony doesn’t really feature now. I agree Elanga is a better player, but does he oust Amad on current form?

Absolutely not.

Agree with this. Elanga's been out of form, but I'm hoping the goal on Sat sees his confidence boost a bit and we get the Elanga we had for large parts of last season.

But even then, Amad is arguably United's best player currently.

 

[PaulMdj]

I suppose ability is the correct way to do it...and if we're doing that, you'd have to take Chris Wood out. He's clearly a decent player, but isn't a dynamic current day forward, very old school and relies on service a lot of the time.

Even based on ability, I'd still put up a handful of our measly £350m squad vs. the billion pounds United have spent over the last few years.

I've got a bet on with the lad as he doesn't think we'll finish in the top half. I was a bit wary of agreeing as I a.) wasn't expecting us to be this high and b.) would be happy with 12-14th finish this season...but given the performances back to back vs United and (particularly) Villa - I see no reason why we couldn't finish in the top half now (barring a serious number of injuries)...We've played a lot of the "difficult" away games already and this December spell was looking like a bleak run of games and I'd have been happy with 4 points from 6 games If I'm perfectly honest. But looking at the next 3; Brentford, Spurs and Everton - no reason we can't get 4-6 points from those three (we'll end up with 3 losses on the bounce now )

It’s very subjective, regardless of the battle for top 4 you always get a team over performing (no disrespect meant) every season, why shouldn’t it be Forest this season? The difficulty is maintaing that form the next season!

If both Clubs were at the “place” people expect then you might find only 1 or 2 might get interest from Utd.

Sad fact is, given a choice 99% of players would choose Utd, regardless of how they are doing, over the likes of Forest/Everton and 15 other PL clubs based on stature alone.

 

[Lord Tyrion]

@Aztecs27 The lad in your office has been on the loopy juice, he really has. I'd take Murillo, Gibbs-White and Anderson over Utd equivalents without blinking. I suspect there are others that I would also take but I just don't know them well enough. One of Hudson-Odoi or Elanga would be a good shout. Your defence is pretty solid so it is only my lack of Forest knowledge stopping more of them getting picked.

I'd take Hojlund over Wood as I like Hojlund. I also can't shake the memory of him at Newcastle, genuinely the worst striker I have ever seen in the PL during his time there. I saw him live a good few times, absolutely useless in every aspect of his game. Entirely different player for you, fair play to him.

 

[Aztecs27]

It’s very subjective, regardless of the battle for top 4 you always get a team over performing (no disrespect meant) every season, why shouldn’t it be Forest this season? The difficulty is maintaing that form the next season!

If both Clubs were at the “place” people expect then you might find only 1 or 2 might get interest from Utd.

Sad fact is, given a choice 99% of players would choose Utd, regardless of how they are doing, over the likes of Forest/Everton and 15 other PL clubs based on stature alone.

Is this still the case, given the dumpster fire it's become over the last 10 years? Not saying they'd come to Forest or Everton instead, but I don't think United are the draw they once were (but they will be again sooner rather than later, I imagine)

 

[Billysboots]

Who's on the other wing? Because amad tore city apart soon as he swapped wings

Amorim started with a front three of Mount, Hojlund and Amad. And Amad played on the right throughout.

 

[Lord Tyrion]

Is this still the case, given the dumpster fire it's become over the last 10 years? Not saying they'd come to Forest or Everton instead, but I don't think United are the draw they once were (but they will be again sooner rather than later, I imagine)

I don't think they are a draw but the wages they pay are. Players / agents follow the money. The absolute elite can be picky enough but the ones just behind go where the wages are bigger.