Slow play, arguments, almost a fight...and a dog...but turned out ok

[barrybridges]

Yesterday was one of those days best forgotten. I almost got into a fight and learnt some lessons along the way. You really wouldn't believe it.

I'm currently between jobs so thought it would be good to spend the week playing golf. With that in mind, I phoned up and booked a tee time just for my myself at Seaford Head GC. I specifically asked - given I was a single - to be put in where I wouldn't have any big groups in front of me. I was told it was a 'quiet day'.

When I go to tee off there is a 4 ball on the tee still, a 4 ball ahead of them, a 2 ball ahead of them and a society ahead of that lot.

After 3 holes, 48 minutes had passed and I was - shall we say - pretty pissed off.

On the third, my second shot was overhit and I accidentally (genuinely) sent the ball beyond the green and onto the tee box where the group in front were standing. It was a lucky miss and an honest accident - I never thought I would reach the green from where I was. In any event, it was a par 5 and I would have though they would be long gone.

Anyway, I gave my apologies all round to them...but they were clearly getting a bit worked up and started ranting at me. So, in turn, I suggested to them that they might want to improve THEIR on-course etiquette and stop playing so slowly so that similiar situations might be avoided.

The group in front of them had dropped out on hole 4 so they had clear space ahead of them. Whenever I got to the green though they still hadn't teed off and instead were standing around chatting, choosing their club etc. Even when they did have a group on the green in front of them this was perhaps 340 yards away and there was no chance of them driving that distance - so I suggested they might want to get a wriggle on. At one point they stopped on the tee while one member ran across the road to have a chat with their mate who had pulled over whilst in a car driving past.

Anyway, this didn't go down well and one of the elder members of that group basically tore into me. "Don't you go telling me how I should play...we're allowed to chat...etc". I don't think I was being unreasonable at all...they had space in front of them but were always holding me up.

Anyway, in the end we all apologised and believe it or not I joined their group after about 8 holes when they invited me to play with them. And - after some anxieties - we got on well (although I was so anxious I played like crap from that point on). It was awkward circumstances because we had basically had a massive row before then.

From there it was just more slow play. We caught up in the group in front but there was no point playing through as it was tailbacked all the way. Every time we finished putting the group in front had yet to tee off.

Anyway, to cap it all off on the 18th one of their mates had turned up at the club to walk their dog on the course - and would you believe it - this dog ran onto the fairway and picked up my ball! Cue a farcical chase to grab the dog and retrieve the ball. They then decide to take the dog for a walk on the putting green.

To sum it all up, my day was an absolute joke. It took 4:35hrs to go round. On the 18th tee there were 4 groups waiting to tee off (4, 4, 3, 2). Some of the members were clearly in their twilight years and could barely push a trolley. And I nearly got into a fight, although in the end patched up my differences. We were both in the wrong, but I think I had a valid point. Anyway, lessons learnt.

Not wanting to rant, but I really do think this issue of slow play needs to be addressed from the top-down. It just doesn't make sense as it stands. It shouldn't take over 4.5 hours to play a round - especially when I played half of that as a single!

Surely there could be a better way of arranging tee times? Even when I play as a single, I play to beat my best. Others out there can barely hit the ball 50 yards. I don't want to begrudge very old players their bit of enjoyment, but shouldn't there be a better system to reflect the different needs to different types of golfer? I'm not joking when I say that I just can't keep golf up if each round is taking over 4 hours; like most people I work and have family so there needs to be a better way for people to squeeze faster rounds in.

We all moan about it all the time on here, so why isn't something done if this represents the common will of club golfers? When I go to play golf I'm taking time out to do so - I'm sacrificing the other things that need doing. So, I want to PLAY GOLF, not stand around waiting for others all the time. It's so annoying!

Did I act incorrectly? Am I wrong? Am I right? Do I have any valid points or am I just moaning for the sake of it?

 

[barrybridges]

p.s. it is a fantastic course...but just impossibly busy. Amazing views and a great layout. Quite wide fairways and v.forgiving.

 

[barrybridges]

Incidentally - just an idea - but I don't know how many of you have ever run the London Marathon or a similar event where you're asked to predict your finishing time beforehand? This then determines what pen you're put into at the start.

Maybe in golf there should be a better system for booking intervals in tee times. Does a 4 ball get bigger gaps than a 2 ball for example? What about a system that takes the average handicap of a group and uses that to work out what the gaps should be (e.g. higher handicaps = generally more lost balls, slower play etc)?

 

[Smiffy]

I'd have nipped 5 minutes up the road and played the other Seaford course....Blatchington.
You would have got around there in about 2 hours as it's usually quiet, and it's a better course too.
http://www.seafordgolfclub.co.uk/

 

[john0]

Barry did you break your initial post down into 3 sections so it wasnt too long

 

[barrybridges]

I'd have nipped 5 minutes up the road and played the other Seaford course....Blatchington.
You would have got around there in about 2 hours as it's usually quiet, and it's a better course too.
http://www.seafordgolfclub.co.uk/

I nearly did as I got lost driving there.

To be honest, I nearly walked off the course after 3 holes. I didn't know whether I could legitimately go back to the clubhouse and ask for my money back. That's how ridiculous it was.

 

[barrybridges]

Barry did you break your initial post down into 3 sections so it wasnt too long

I just needed to get it off my chest. I was in the wrong as well - I underestimated how far I'd hit my shots and nearly hit the group in front - but if I'd have waited then the group behind me would have thought I was being overcautious and slow myself (especially if I then duffed my shot).

 

[USER1999]

Tough one this.

I think at Burnham Beeches, the first hour of the day (weekends only maybe) is reserved for speedy players, who have to be round in 3 1/2 hours tops. Even in the comps.
They are timed by the pro, and are not allowed to book an early time for the rest of the year if they don't make it.

Other than that, people really need to be prepared to be paired up into fours at busy times. It'll still be slow though.

Speed just isn't handicap related, it is a state of mind, so banding on h/caps is unfair.

As long as the pro's are allowed to plod round at the speed of a dying snail, then slow play will filter down through the amateur game.

It isn't just golf, tennis now takes longer for a set, and the over rate in pro cricket is getting slower too.

 

[bobmac]

Think of it as someone driving an Aston Martin DB9S on a bank holiday Monday around Trafalgar Square, He's going nowhere fast and it's really no one's fault.
If you want to go round in 3 hours, get there when there's no one else there. 7am would be a good time or 7 in the evening.

 

[heronsghyll]

[/QUOTE]I just needed to get it off my chest. I was in the wrong as well - I underestimated how far I'd hit my shots and nearly hit the group in front - but if I'd have waited then the group behind me would have thought I was being overcautious and slow myself (especially if I then duffed my shot).

[/QUOTE]

You have my deepest sympathy, I fuly understand your issues. I recently left after 15 years as a member one of GM top 100 courses (Gold medal winner many times) because of slow play. I got sick and tired of 4.5-5.5 hour rounds on a saturday morning despite getting 8am tee times. Truly my whole game and outlook was destroyed by people with no idea of how frustrating it is to play slowly and the management of the club refusing to acknowlege there was a problem or doing anything about it. These were not beginner golfers, in many cases the slow play was caused by ex-captains etc.

I have now joined another course with my best mate and we are both REALLY happy. The whole environment is better, the people are very nice and pleased to have us as members, the golf is quicker and more fun. The club is far more relaxed and less stuffy and we both have our enthusiasm for the game back. My mate has even got his handicap down to his lowest ever - now playing off an 11 handicap (instead of 15!!!). How cool is that. I am now down to 7.5 and trying very hard to go lower.

You can do it - find somewhere where the pace of play is important, these clubs do exist.

 

[Smiffy]

If you want to go round in 3 hours, get there when there's no one else there. 7am would be a good time .

Not at Seaford Head Bob.
It's a muni mate, and they are queueing up from 5am this time of year

 

[Mick47]

Don't think there are any easy answers to slow play,My mate andI usually take 3 to 3 1/2 hrs if not held up but we frequently are held up by 4 balls. Sometimes they are painfully slow for no apparent reason, sometimes it's because they are obviously very new to the game and sometimes it's because they are getting on a bit and just can't move like they used to. I take the view that they are as entitled as us to play the course and if held up I fill the time with practice swings or smoke a fag. No point in getting het up, it won't make the arthetic old guys in front play quicker, they can't, same goes for the beginners. Just chill out or find a quieter time/course.

 

[Parmo]

Could be worse mate, on our goat track of a muni it takes 4hr+ to do two loops of 9 on a track the size of 5300!!!

Shot 24 points on the front nine the other weekend, was rolling and then waited 5 minutes for each shot and ended with 40 points

 

[viscount17]

it's not age that determines slow play - it's attitude, exemplified by the 'it's my one one round of the week/month/year and I'll play it at my pace so I get my money's worth and I really don't give two hoots what anyone else is doing'
and the other 'me and my mates will play how we want, gather round every shot to heckle, only look for one lost ball at a time, and, usually, drive buggies across all the fairways and onto the berm around greens and bunkers - oh, and leave a trail of water bottles, beer cans, fruit peel and sweet wrappers for somebody else to clear up'

 

[HomerJSimpson]

I have to say the problem stems from you being a singleton. You are always going to catch other groups up and I'm afraid although you now have standing according the definitions (I think) in the rules of golf you don't have any divine right to play through.

I have to say the club must also take some of the responsibility and seemed to just want to relieve you of your cash and get you out there. A lot of clubs won't let single players out and will try and match them up with other 2 and 3 balls. The thinking is that it will then even the pace of play out better.

Definitely some lessons to be learned by you and the other golfers although I fear they are probably lost causes given your write up.

 

[Durango]

I don't mind slightly slow play because the players aren't of such a good standard. The thing that bugs me however is when people take ages walking from green to next tee, and then they hang around chatting instead of getting on with their shots. Grrr

 

[Pants]

Instead of playing on your own, cultivate 3 friends and have a round with them.

The 4 - 4 1/2 hour round will seem to go far quicker.

You can't expect 2's, 3's and 4's in front of you to run round the course just because you are on your own. Sounds to me like you struck lucky (despite your (ahem) disagreements) that they asked you to join them. Sounds like a decent bunch of lads to me.

 

[golfbluecustard]

Often go out for 18 on my tod, twilight usually - lost count of how many times i've played 6 or so wholes to then meet group after group...... lots of deep breaths and just accept it seems to be the only way.

As someone else has said better with buddies as no slower just the time passes quicker.


GBC

 

[granters]

I always find playing on my own it's worth playing 2 balls , or chucking one down for a 3 iron into the green, having a practice pitch etc. There's nowt you can do to speed things up so it's worth working on the weaker parts of your game whilst waiting

 

[barrybridges]

Thanks for your replies.

I do usually play with my neighbour, and we encounter similiar problems elsewhere.

Yesterday for example I went out at Godstone as a two where it was pretty quiet. The group in front were a husband and wife where the husband claimed he had a handicap of 10 (he disclosed to me in the car park afterwards). Considering he only used his arms and his average drive went around 100 yards, I'm not convinced.

Despite requests, they wouldn't let us play through. Then they got hindered by a father and son (about 10 years old) in front of them, so it all ground to a halt until the dad and kid let us all through.

I guess my point is this: given that it's clearly quite an emotive issue and generates so much complaint - and given it's important enough to be printed on most scorecards in bold letters - surely more should be done to police things.

For example - as you say - clubs shouldn't allow singles out?

You remember that thread last week about the average gaps between tee times? Well, I can't see it being too difficult to create a piece of software that calculates tee times based on different groups.

I've noticed other things slow down play - and equally speed up play - to consider. For example:

Putting tee boxes directly behind a green (a la Seaford Head) causes players to wait in case they overhit their shots. If the tee boxes were located 5m either way players could proceed without as much caution.

Signage on some courses aids players into when to play their shot. E.g. 'please wait until the group in front has reached the halfway bell before playing your shot' does as much to encourage safe play as it does to say 'play your shot when they reach the bell' - some people wait ages thinking they're going to hit the group in front when they can't hit the ball that distance.

Also - and I'm on a bit of a roll here - one thing I do think should be looked at is - especially for people playing a new course for the first time - better signage to help people work out the route to the next tee, thus helping them know where to leave their bag/trolley around the green. Frequently when I've played in a group we've reached the green and left our trolley where we think we can access it easily, only to then learn when we've putting out that we've got to walk round the green again with our trolleys, taking up 30 - 45 seconds each time. Knowing where to dump your trolley so you can make a quick getaway to the next hole is key.

Finally, on courses which are 2 x 9 (like Godstone) it's a pain because if you're playing 18 holes they don't take into consideration the later tee times. So, when you've putted on 9 and walk back to the first tee to play #10, you're then entering a tailback or else you're interrupting a tee slot and cutting the gap between groups.

Part of it I would suggest is also having the courage to ASK to be played through, rather than inviting it. I think the emphasis is wrong. Surely the rule should be: if the group behind you is on the green (putting) when your group is standing on the next tee, you should play them through unless you yourself are waiting for the group ahead.

Sorry to rant, but it does wind me up.