Screw club manufacturers!

[Hacker Khan]

You could argue both sides are at fault. The average punter for mostly prioritising distance and being obsessed with which 7 iron will go the furthest and using that as the main buying criteria. And because of that the manufacturers have created the situation where they can quite legitimately prove that their 7 iron goes further than a previous version, mostly through reducing the loft. Although they also have to do other things as you just don't crank the lofts.

 

[Hacker Khan]

Thank you for your support. ;-)

I do indeed feel like I was tricked (by Benross) and that I'd essentially wasted my time. Fortunately I didn't buy the clubs, as I had spotted the stronger loft while I was trying out the club, and so was put off by it.



Bingo! (See above)

Benross may not have intended to trick me, but that is the net effect. They're not actually game improvement clubs if all they're doing is making a 7 iron in to a 6 iron with a different name. I could achieve the same thing by clubbing up when I'm playing a round without buying new clubs.

Golf is complicated (and hard) enough without having to also be an equipment geek. I have enough in my head already!



Indeed. I am actually at least as interested in the forgiveness (and from that the less dispersion) offered by the clubs, but it's more difficult, I think, to tell that with a 40 range balls divided between three 7 irons as I was doing yesterday, due to the small sample.

There are some club manufacturers who are at least trying to be a bit more honest about it:
http://www.oobgolf.com/content/the+...547-Have_You_Noticed_What_They_Are_Doing.html

But that is not just all they are doing. They are also mostly making the ball launch higher with more foregiveness, so the average punter will have more chance of getting say a 32 degree club to hit the ball in the air. So yes there is an argument to say a 4 iron is the same as a 3 iron a few years ago in terms of pure loft. But the average punter will have more chance of hitting the new 4 iron well than the old 3 iron due to the increased forgiveness and the way the COG is placed lower and deeper in the head.

 

[One Planer]

I'm sure Delc will be along in a minute......

 

[Lord Tyrion]

You only need to ask or check on the manufacturers website to see the lofts of each club. Don't need to be an expert

Yes but most people don't want to do lots of research checking lofts. When you buy trousers do you check each manufacturer to see if one is a little tighter? No, you expect a 34/31 to be just that. When they emerge at 33/30 you are entitled to feel a little miffed. What a faff to go into a golf shop, look at 4-5 different mfrs irons and then spend however long checking the lofts online before you go any further. Standardise the lofts to an iron number and give a 1° tolerance either way.

That is even easier.

 

[Deleted member 15344]

Yes but most people don't want to do lots of research checking lofts. When you buy trousers do you check each manufacturer to see if one is a little tighter? No, you expect a 34/31 to be just that. When they emerge at 33/30 you are entitled to feel a little miffed. What a faff to go into a golf shop, look at 4-5 different mfrs irons and then spend however long checking the lofts online before you go any further. Standardise the lofts to an iron number and give a 1° tolerance either way.

That is even easier.

Actually yes I do check - same with shoes and shirts

I think it's common sense that nothing is uniform across all sorts of platforms

So will always check the size of clothing and always a quick check on lofts etc

To me that's nothing but common sense to do so

Why is it a faff - all you need to do is ask the person or pro or use the smart phone

 

[garyinderry]

Cloths are anything but uniform. Poor example. they can even get shoe size right.

 

[Hacker Khan]

Cloths are anything but uniform. Poor example. they can even get shoe size right.

Actually that is a very good point. But a pair of 34 inch trousers from the US and they are at least a 36. Buy them from some posh designer and they are closer to 32s. And I am convinced that they do that in the US as there are so many fatties who feel better as they can fit into say a 35 inch trouser, so they will buy them. When in fact they are closer to 38 inches.

Exactly the same, they want you to feel good as you can hit your 8 iron 160 yards and feel good as you can fit into some 34 inch trousers.

And yes I do stock up on trousers when I go to the US

 

[garyinderry]

Cloths are anything but uniform apart from when they are literally a uniform.

 

[Lord Tyrion]

Okay, let's try this with a loaf of bread instead of trousers. If I buy a white sliced loaf I expect it be a white sliced loaf, not a wholemeal sliced loaf because that is healthier for me. I want it to do what is says on the packet. Does that one work better? People on here forget that most golfers don't follow forums, read magazines etc and so genuinely believe that all 7 irons, for example, are the same loft. You can't blame them either when each one stamps a 7 on the club.

Back to trousers, for those who want to feel good about trousers I recommend Fat Face where I need to wear a belt with 34" trousers unlike other shops where a 34 is starting to feel a little cosy.

 

[TheJezster]

I think originally the manufacturers did attempt to trick people. It's become so common place now though that no one really thinks that way, it's become accepted. I think anyone claiming that the manufacturers are not tricking people are being, shall we say, very naive! Manufacturers will do anything (within the parameters) to succeed and while there is no standardisation it will continue.

On here I think I'm in the minority but I absolutely think there should be standardisation as to what you can call a 7 iron. Because of the way clubs work, launch angle etc you could have this per type of club. Eg sgi 7iron should be 33-35 gi 34-6 etc (or whatever). That would make sense. And whilst I might be in the minority on here who think this, you can bet your bottom dollar that I'm in the vast majority of normal golfers out there.
To answer one point, yes you can look on your phone at the lofts but the point is you shouldn't have to! Make it easier for people to buy not harder.

 

[Deleted member 15344]

All it takes is for someone to ask

If they have failed to realise that lofts on different manufacturers are different then I'm pretty sure they wouldn't be bothered about it

In this day and age I'm amazed anyone spends a good deal of money without doing some basic research of what you are buying

 

[pokerjoke]

All it takes is for someone to ask

If they have failed to realise that lofts on different manufacturers are different then I'm pretty sure they wouldn't be bothered about it

In this day and age I'm amazed anyone spends a good deal of money without doing some basic research of what you are buying

Spot on
God this place is like a kindergarden sometimes,are people losing the ability to think for themselves.

 

[Maninblack4612]

,
All cranking up the lofts does is create gaps at the bottom of your bag

See post #16

 

[TheJezster]

Ask yourself this, if it doesn't matter what's printed on the bottom of the club, why have them at all?

Because it does matter 😉 and many people who buy clubs (I won't say most because I don't have the data) are sucked into it...

Now let's be clear I'm not trying to change your mind here, it's already made up, and I accept that. No ones opinion an be wrong, but likewise, I think you have to accept that the majority of golf club buyers (probably) think the numbers do mean something and a 7 is a7 is a 7 regardless of manufacturers.

Who knows, maybe there will be some form of standardisation in the future... I won't lose sleep if there isn't but tend to think there should be one.

 

[Slab]

To an extent all the manufactures have done is exploit the vanity of the player

They’ve seen & heard all the talk in clubhouses and forums all over the world about ‘I hit my X iron 175’ and guessed correctly that a large % of listeners who don’t hit their X iron 175 will spend wads of mulla chasing their fellow players distances, when all that really matters is how accurately you hit whatever club you have that goes 175

I’m sure it’s been said on one of these threads but what benefit is there in gaining 10 yards on your new 9 iron that’s now lofted like an 8? The ball flight from the new 9 isn’t even the same as either your old-school 8 or 9, it just isn’t comparable

 

[HickoryShaft]

Damm, I thought the thread was about new clubs with screw heads that you could change the shafts like drivers now




....I'll be off then!

 

[Hacker Khan]

Ask yourself this, if it doesn't matter what's printed on the bottom of the club, why have them at all?

Because it does matter  and many people who buy clubs (I won't say most because I don't have the data) are sucked into it...

Now let's be clear I'm not trying to change your mind here, it's already made up, and I accept that. No ones opinion an be wrong, but likewise, I think you have to accept that the majority of golf club buyers (probably) think the numbers do mean something and a 7 is a7 is a 7 regardless of manufacturers.

Who knows, maybe there will be some form of standardisation in the future... I won't lose sleep if there isn't but tend to think there should be one.

Don't think it will never happen as manufacturers will claim it will hinder innovation. Clubs have evolved for 100s of years. You could ask who are we as the current generation to say that they can't evolve any further and we have to stick with a 5 iron being this specific loft and a 6 iron being this just because a few people are getting suckered in by the adverts?

 

[USER1999]

A 7 iron is a 7 iron because of the weight of the head. That's it. It has nothing to do with loft. That could be anything. It's not specified, and it doesn't need to be, that is left up to the manufacturer.

 

[garyinderry]

A 7 iron is a 7 iron because of the weight of the head. That's it. It has nothing to do with loft. That could be anything. It's not specified, and it doesn't need to be, that is left up to the manufacturer.

Nail on head

 

[srixon 1]

This is why wedges no longer have a 'W' or 'S' on the bottom. In the past there was only one possible loft that a normal pitching wedge could be, hence the 'W'. The other wedge in your bag was usually a sand iron and had an 'S' on it.

With the decreasing of the lofts of the other clubs it has caused a massive gapping issue at the wedge end of the bag. Consequently we need more wedges, and because we now need more than a 'W' or 'S' wedge the majority of new wedges all have the loft in actual numbers stamped on them.

Why not just put the lofts on the whole iron set?