Rugby Thread

[Captainron]

If you're going to kick for territory that late then the kick has to be contestable which it wasn't. Crazy play.

Exactly. Do it once and there isn’t a chase? Don’t do it again! Spin it and have a go! Just ridiculously stupid play when you need to win. The French forwards were well on top towards the end and they didn’t utilise that at all either.

 

[ColchesterFC]

A question for those that follow both codes. Lots of talk about head injuries and early onset dementia etc but most of it seems to be with regards to Rugby Union rather than Rugby League. Admittedly I don't know much about Rugby League, I enjoy watching it but don't claim to be an expert, but is there a reason that Union seems to have more talk around these issues than League?

 

[Captainron]

A question for those that follow both codes. Lots of talk about head injuries and early onset dementia etc but most of it seems to be with regards to Rugby Union rather than Rugby League. Admittedly I don't know much about Rugby League, I enjoy watching it but don't claim to be an expert, but is there a reason that Union seems to have more talk around these issues than League?

Don’t know why League would ever lag behind. Their hits are massive and they tend to go higher to attempt to wrap the ball and prevent a pass.

Maybe it’s just because Union is a more mainstream sport and gets far more coverage?

It’s a huge problem in all forms of rugby and I even think about it for my 14 year old lad.

 

[Lord Tyrion]

A question for those that follow both codes. Lots of talk about head injuries and early onset dementia etc but most of it seems to be with regards to Rugby Union rather than Rugby League. Admittedly I don't know much about Rugby League, I enjoy watching it but don't claim to be an expert, but is there a reason that Union seems to have more talk around these issues than League?

Different hits, different styles of tackling. No rucks, mauls or scrums of note where hits to the head can occur. The tackles also tend to be more chest to chest, keeping the heads out of the way.

The above doesn't mean there aren't head hits in league but they are reduced compared to union.

 

[Val]

Different hits, different styles of tackling. No rucks, mauls or scrums of note where hits to the head can occur. The tackles also tend to be more chest to chest, keeping the heads out of the way.

The above doesn't mean there aren't head hits in league but they are reduced compared to union.

This is spot on for me particularly tackle zone where hits tend to be higher in an attempt to smother whereas union they tackler and tackled player often drop their head into tackles.

 

[Captainron]

Wasps gone now. Massive club with a decent history. Real pity.

Rugby here now has to reorganise itself to ensure that it’s sustainable.

 

[Val]

Wasps gone now. Massive club with a decent history. Real pity.

Rugby here now has to reorganise itself to ensure that it’s sustainable.

I firmly believe we are seeing the fallout from the Sarries scenario however they had an owner who backed them financially without fail. Even with a salary cap it's shocking clubs allowed themselves to get into this state. Feel for the fans and those now without jobs.

As much as I have plenty of criticism to aim at the SRU in their running of the game up here, I can be greatful they own our clubs and this type of thing is unlikely to happen.

 

[GB72]

I firmly believe we are seeing the fallout from the Sarries scenario however they had an owner who backed them financially without fail. Even with a salary cap it's shocking clubs allowed themselves to get into this state. Feel for the fans and those now without jobs.

As much as I have plenty of criticism to aim at the SRU in their running of the game up here, I can be greatful they own our clubs and this type of thing is unlikely to happen.

Whilst it may prove inevitable, I do not know how I would feel if they massively trimmed the number of teams in England and put them under RFU control. You would be looking at a potential amalgamation of Tigers and Saints and I just cannot see either fan base getting behind the one that remains or a composite team of both. Can see a similar issue wiht Bristol/Bath/Exeter and Gloucester. Much talk at the moment about central contracts but I can only see that sending English rugby down the same path as county cricket. Part of the issue is that we have the top name players available too little and to centrally contract would make that worse. Also not sure that the RFU could afford 25-30 central contracts. Not sure what the answer is but somehting need to be done.

 

[fundy]

I firmly believe we are seeing the fallout from the Sarries scenario however they had an owner who backed them financially without fail. Even with a salary cap it's shocking clubs allowed themselves to get into this state. Feel for the fans and those now without jobs.

As much as I have plenty of criticism to aim at the SRU in their running of the game up here, I can be greatful they own our clubs and this type of thing is unlikely to happen.

I did wonder how long it would be until Sarries got the blame lol

 

[GB72]

I did wonder how long it would be until Sarries got the blame lol

Actually agree for once, Wasps have been on borrowed time for a number of years now and the high stakes, all or nothing gamble of the move to Coventry failed massively. Worcester were just shafted by the owners and I suspect that there is a lot more to come out of that when people look for where all fo the money has gone.

All the clubs were responsible for player wage inflation. The irony is that the players deserve so much more in the pay packets for what they put themselves through but the clubs cannot even afford what they pay now. Clubs got invoived in a football stule player arms race but without the money to back it up. The crowds have also simply not grown and the TV money has shrunk. Sadly, always going to be the case when the media and the TV companies are only interested in football or rugby at international levels.

Only solutions I can see at the moment is that clubs spending is set at a percentage of income (which would trash Sale and Newcastle) or club rugby rights are sold in conjunction with international rights to extort a higher premium and more coverage. Sadly, the final option is that the RFU centrally contract and clubs become semi pro feeder stations for England and head down the county cricket route.

 

[Val]

I did wonder how long it would be until Sarries got the blame lol

Not blaming at all, I've no axe to grind with Sarries whatsoever as you know, just calling it as I see it. Sarries got their house in order, others haven't or can't.

 

[Val]

Central funding is a minefield, Wales do it with star players to keep them on Wales for International time management as do the IRFU. Scotland internationals playing in Scotland are contracted 100% to the SRU, yes they get less money than can be paid elsewhere but they get time managed and the risk of club failure is zero.

Clubs just need to cut their cloth accordingly and accept where they are in terms of ambition and finance.

 

[GB72]

Would never happen but I am actually coming round to the idea of moving the season to the Summer. That would mean less competition from football and I can see people watching rugby as a summer sport outside of the football season. It would also allow the southern hemisphere internationals and the 6 Nations to be playerd pre and post season so the clubs would have their international players available a lot more. Still not an ideal situation but I just simply cannot see how club rugby can grow when it is being playeed in the massive shadow of the football season.

 

[Lord Tyrion]

Would never happen but I am actually coming round to the idea of moving the season to the Summer. That would mean less competition from football and I can see people watching rugby as a summer sport outside of the football season. It would also allow the southern hemisphere internationals and the 6 Nations to be playerd pre and post season so the clubs would have their international players available a lot more. Still not an ideal situation but I just simply cannot see how club rugby can grow when it is being playeed in the massive shadow of the football season.

It seems to have worked for league. The harder ground is more of an issue for union than league, do you think that would be a major problem?

 

[GB72]

It seems to have worked for league. The harder ground is more of an issue for union than league, do you think that would be a major problem?

Not with modern pitches and sprinkler systems, I am sure that it can be kept to the requisite standard.

 

[stefanovic]

Wasps have been on borrowed time for a number of years now and the high stakes, all or nothing gamble of the move to Coventry failed massively.

Quite a gamble to move Wasps from London to Coventry on the basis it was a big untapped area for rugby.
The West Midlands as a whole has relatively little interest for the game.
I was also very surprised they opened an expensive looking elite performance centre at far away Henley in Arden.

 

[GB72]

Quite a gamble to move Wasps from London to Coventry on the basis it was a big untapped area for rugby.
The West Midlands as a whole has relatively little interest for the game.
I was also very surprised they opened an expensive looking elite performance centre at far away Henley in Arden.

Not sure how it is a big, untapped area for the game. Coventry itself has a league one club and you have Northampon and Leicester on the doorstep, two of the biggest clubs in the country (OK moving into the Midlands there but an easy commute and one that is done by many West Midlands Tigers fans to Welford Road every week.). The problem was that the area was already tapped and success would have meant converting existing fans over other clubs to follow Wasps. falling out with the football club only helped turn the locals against them.

Henley is more traditional Wasps territory and if the gamble on the gorund had paid off in relatoin to other revenue streams that it had, i could have seen them moving back to their traditional territories.

 

[stefanovic]

Not sure how it is a big, untapped area for the game. Coventry itself has a league one club and you have Northampon and Leicester on the doorstep, two of the biggest clubs in the country (OK moving into the Midlands there but an easy commute and one that is done by many West Midlands Tigers fans to Welford Road every week.). The problem was that the area was already tapped and success would have meant converting existing fans over other clubs to follow Wasps. falling out with the football club only helped turn the locals against them.

Don't get this. Who are Northampon? Who are West Midlands Tigers, other than in the Safari Park? Coventry RFC play at the Butts Park Arena.

Henley is more traditional Wasps territory and if the gamble on the gorund had paid off in relatoin to other revenue streams that it had, i could have seen them moving back to their traditional territories.

Not Henley on Thames, but Henley in Arden. I've just passed it and the administrators appear to be there.

 

[GB72]

Don't get this. Who are Northampon? Who are West Midlands Tigers, other than in the Safari Park? Coventry RFC play at the Butts Park Arena.


Not Henley on Thames, but Henley in Arden. I've just passed it and the administrators appear to be there.

I am saying that Northampton and Tigers already have an established fan base in the West Midlands that have been supporters for decades. Coventry are a well establised league one club with decent support who made the decision at the start of the professional era that they could not attract fans from their establised tier one club support and so set their aspirations at a lower level. The idea of moving a top level club into an area where there was no historical support and no call for them to move in whilst also trying to bribe fans away from their existing clubs with free tickets was never going to work.

When mention was made of a Heney training ground, I always wrongly assume it was on Thames. I understand that is bein kept open for the time being for players to train at.

 

[Val]

It seems to have worked for league. The harder ground is more of an issue for union than league, do you think that would be a major problem?

Those with artificial pitches would have serious issues in the summer