Rick Shiels and Bryson

[MadAdey]

Just wondering who has watched the YouTube video where Bryson hits Rick's tee shots on the front 9 and Rick hits Bryson's on the back 9. I always here players talking about if they could hit their drives further then they would be able to shoot lower scores. This video really pushes home the point that this game is all about your wedges and your putter, within reason. Obviously if your driving is really that bad then your screwed either way. Rick shoots 2 over on the front 9, probably not far off what he would normally shoot and Bryson shoots 3 under, what he would normally shoot. So Rick really did not benefit from Bryson hitting his drives and Bryson was not penalized but having Rick hit his drives.

I think it was Gary Player who one was talking to a 15 handicapper and told him that if he hit his drives for him he would still be a 15 handicapper, but if he was to hit the tee shots for Player then he could still break par.

 

[Slab]

Yeah, providing I hit my average tee shot (short and in play) the good scores will only happen when short game is above average

Played twice at the weekend and hit driver 26 times. 23 fairways and 3 first cut, but none that I'd consider long (for me) That's marginally better than an average driver day

I cant really do anything to have an above average day with driver but I definitely can with approach/wedge/putter

 

[Voyager EMH]

When I go out to play with old clubs I do shoot higher scores in general.
I'm quite sure it is the driver and 3-wood that is to blame for the shorter distances achieved.
With the irons and putter the differences are hardly noticeable.

But going out on any one day, it will always be the shorter shots that bring low scores, because it is unlikely that your average drive increases length significantly just for that day.

Increase in distance can be achieved over time to bring about lower scoring. Getting it close and in the hole brings about low scoring on the day.

In the video above, Shiels plays some poor chips and putts. Much poorer than his average. Thus negating the benefits of having the longer drives from Bryson.

 

[Backache]

The book every shot counts suggests the biggest difference in scoring comes from approach shots. Ie Shots from 100 plus yds that are not tee shots.

DeChambeau was taking all those as well as the short shots when Shiels was driving. The difference was not all in the short game.

 

[stevied]

To be fair it's just a one off video, so doesn't really prove anything. I'd say 2 over for 9 is a fantastic score for him. Take a look at some of his -10 videos. I'm pushing for more yards this year as I know for me it will make a big difference.

 

[Orikoru]

But I would explain that by saying Bryson is much, much better than Rick at irons, wedges, chipping and putting. A better comparison would be Bryson's normal round vs Bryson's round with the Shiels tee shots. What they've done doesn't really prove much, other than you score better if you're better at golf.

 

[harpo_72]

Can debate this to the cows come home but the point is all areas of your game need to be good and you cannot rely on one part.
I learned this early on in my golfing life, tee to green I was immaculate. I would get close to the flag but my putting was woeful. From 20ft out I could easily 3 putt, from 10ft out I was fighting a 3 putt not chasing a 1 putt. I was off a 12 handicap purely because of my putting. Sounds dreadful I know … but I spent 2 weeks and 20minutes a day grooving my putter swing and pace .. next competition round was a 66 gross. I sunk some streaky long putts ( we all get lucky but you have to make a majority of that luck) and 10ft in I was far more efficient plus my distance putts were always well within 10ft improving my chances.
Likewise if the driver is not putting you in places to see or play a shot .. it needs work.

 

[Canary_Yellow]

But I would explain that by saying Bryson is much, much better than Rick at irons, wedges, chipping and putting. A better comparison would be Bryson's normal round vs Bryson's round with the Shiels tee shots. What they've done doesn't really prove much, other than you score better if you're better at golf.

Say there are 14 par 4s or par 5s on a course, it’s blindingly obvious that being brilliant at irons and short game will make more difference to scores than an extra 10 or 15 yards distance off the tee (assuming you hit it ok already and get it on the fairway). It’s 14 shots vs 58 if you’re hitting par, or 14 out of 80/90/100 for a typical handicap golfer. That’s what they’ve demonstrated, but it didn’t really need demonstration because it’s obvious. However, to MadAdey’s point, golfers are obsessed by distance as demonstrated by all the marketing hype from the manufacturers and it’s disproportionate when compared to the number of drives hit per round vs the rest of the game.

You are right, the key to improving your scores is being better at golf, having a better technique brings more distance off the tee anyway and m better struck irons. But if an average golfer is only going to practice one thing and they already hit straight drives, I think wedges and short game would yield much better results from a scoring perspective than practicing driver in the hope an extra 10 yards off the tee will yield vastly improved scores.

 

[Fore Right]

Bryson is doing a LOT of collaborations on You Tube right now.

 

[Orikoru]

Bryson is doing a LOT of collaborations on You Tube right now.

It's clearly a big part of why he went to LIV. He obviously had plans to move into YouTube in a big way, and now he has the time to do it. I've subscribed and watched a few of his vids, I think he comes across really well. But then I've always quite liked him when others didn't.

 

[BiMGuy]

Say there are 14 par 4s or par 5s on a course, it’s blindingly obvious that being brilliant at irons and short game will make more difference to scores than an extra 10 or 15 yards distance off the tee (assuming you hit it ok already and get it on the fairway). It’s 14 shots vs 58 if you’re hitting par, or 14 out of 80/90/100 for a typical handicap golfer. That’s what they’ve demonstrated, but it didn’t really need demonstration because it’s obvious. However, to MadAdey’s point, golfers are obsessed by distance as demonstrated by all the marketing hype from the manufacturers and it’s disproportionate when compared to the number of drives hit per round vs the rest of the game.

You are right, the key to improving your scores is being better at golf, having a better technique brings more distance off the tee anyway and m better struck irons. But if an average golfer is only going to practice one thing and they already hit straight drives, I think wedges and short game would yield much better results from a scoring perspective than practicing driver in the hope an extra 10 yards off the tee will yield vastly improved scores.

At elite ball striking level, an extra 10 yards might not make much difference. But it will make a difference.

But 10 to 15 yards extra distance off the tee would make a massive difference to most handicap golfers.

Approach play is generally the biggest differentiator between skill levels. Hitting it better off the tee makes approach play easier. A good short game is an insurance policy.

 

[Deleted member 1147]

Bryson is doing a LOT of collaborations on You Tube right now.

#growingthegame

 

[SteveW86]

Rick's short game in his latest video with Fleetwood should be enough to show anyone how important that part of the game is.

 

[SteveW86]

#growingthegame

Whilst I dont think it is growing the game, I do like to see a bit more of the top players personalities (as long as they arent complete bells). Even enjoyed the video Rory did with Micah Morris (and Micah is very hard to watch).

 

[Canary_Yellow]

At elite ball striking level, an extra 10 yards might not make much difference. But it will make a difference.

But 10 to 15 yards extra distance off the tee would make a massive difference to most handicap golfers.

Approach play is generally the biggest differentiator between skill levels. Hitting it better off the tee makes approach play easier. A good short game is an insurance policy.

Agree with this, my point is that distance with driver is a disproportionate focus among handicap golfers when there is plenty of low hanging fruit available from practicing approach play and short game generally.

Overall though, it’s a nuanced issue and you can’t separate out the variables - being a longer hitter off the tee means you hit approach shots from closer to the green and also strike the ball better so only need a PW v a 7 iron for a short hitter. Clearly a big advantage.

Really, the better your technique, the better your strike, the further you hit with all clubs, the better you’ll be at golf - there aren’t any short cuts on that. Pitching, chipping and putting is a different beast, in theory there’s no reason why a high handicappper couldn’t get as good at that as a much lower handicapper - technique important too, of course, but feels like it should be easier to get good at with practice than the full swing. Not many players practice that enough, myself included, I’m guilty of bashing range balls because I enjoy it more than practicing chipping and putting

 

[Orikoru]

Rick's short game in his latest video with Fleetwood should be enough to show anyone how important that part of the game is.

He seemed to improve a little after his lesson with Dan Grieve, but now he's dropped the ball again. He might as well just buy a chipper at this point. Crossfield did it for a while but Shiels refuses.

 

[SteveW86]

He seemed to improve a little after his lesson with Dan Grieve, but now he's dropped the ball again. He might as well just buy a chipper at this point. Crossfield did it for a while but Shiels refuses.

His swing is looking in a much better place. I would say his short game problems are 80% mental right now.

Comes down to time again, I just doubt he puts the hours in that are needed to improve his short game.

 

[BiMGuy]

His swing is looking in a much better place. I would say his short game problems are 80% mental right now.

Comes down to time again, I just doubt he puts the hours in that are needed to improve his short game.

It can’t help that he talks a load of nonsense on every shot. I know he kind of has to in order to make the videos half interesting and so it sounds like he knows what he’s doing.

But to then fat or thin it like a 20 capper

His choice of club is often completely wrong too. Again I think there is a lot of ego involved that he just can’t back up.

Every time I hear. “Right I’ve got 173 so I’m going to hit a trappy draw with a 9 iron.” You just know he’s either hitting it fat or coming up 30 yards short.

 

[cunnini]

i didn't use to be a fan of Bryson, but in his YouTube (I've only watched 2) he comes across very well and also likeable - i'm challenging my own opinions of him

 

[LincolnShep]

i didn't use to be a fan of Bryson, but in his YouTube (I've only watched 2) he comes across very well and also likeable - i'm challenging my own opinions of him

Agree, I've warmed a bit to Bryson after watching his collaborations with Shiels.