Provisional picked up but wrong ball had been played.

[upsidedown]

Happened today to PP.

He drove off on 1st, hit tree high up but none of saw it after that.

Played provisional off tee and off we went, identified our three balls on fairway and guy infront of us who had played wrong ball came back to play another one, asked if we wanted to play through but told him no worries as we had to look for PP first ball.

Was about to give it up when he spotted it on 2nd fairway, yup Titleist 2 ,good to go. He played into green and I picked his provisional up .
All holed out and waiting to tee off on second to see much wandering around in front of us and yes it transpired he had hit wrong ball off the second fairway ( guy in group ahead had teed off to save time whilst his PP came back to play after hitting wrong ball )

So what was the correct procedure? I suggested replacing his provisional and playing from there having played 5 .

He decided not to bother and NR'd .

 

[Maninblack4612]

I would say 2 stroke penalty for playing wrong ball plus 1 shot under rule 18 2 for moving ball so he replaces provisional, which he's allowed to do under rule 15 3b. Playing 7 with next shot.

If he'd played his tee shot off the 2nd it would have been DQ.

 

[rulefan]

I would say 2 stroke penalty for playing wrong ball plus 1 shot under rule 18 2 for moving ball so he replaces provisional, which he's allowed to do under rule 15 3b. Playing 7 with next shot.

If he'd played his tee shot off the 2nd it would have been DQ.

He didn't move his ball.

 

[HawkeyeMS]

Titleist 2 you say, absolutely no doubt it was his then, no one else plays those.


Your FC should be DQ'd for failing to mark up his ball so that he can identify it

 

[williamalex1]

I would say he should drop a replacement ball as near as possible to the spot his provisional was .

Therefore lying 3, plus 2 stroke penalty for playing wrong ball so he would be playing his 5th stroke. ???

 

[Maninblack4612]

He didn't move his ball.

He moved the provisional, he picked it up.

 

[williamalex1]

He moved the provisional, he picked it up.

He didn't lift it his FC did.

 

[Maninblack4612]

I would say he should drop a replacement ball as near as possible to the spot his provisional was .

Therefore lying 3, plus 2 stroke penalty for playing wrong ball so he would be playing his 5th stroke. ???

Definitely not this. The player moved the ball so a 1 stroke penalty must apply if this ball was, under the rules, in play. Thinking about it again, I think, when the provisional was picked up it ceased to be the ball in play. The player must then go back to the 1st tee & play 5 off the tee, 2 stroke penalty for lost ball & 2 more for playing the wrong one.

 

[upsidedown]

He moved the provisional, he picked it up.

No as mentioned in OP I picked his provisional up.

 

[louise_a]

Surely he would have to go back to the tee and play a 3rd ball which would presumably be his 7th shot. (5 of the tee plus 2 penalty shots.

 

[Colin L]

Definitely not this. The player moved the ball so a 1 stroke penalty must apply if this ball was, under the rules, in play. Thinking about it again, I think, when the provisional was picked up it ceased to be the ball in play. The player must then go back to the 1st tee & play 5 off the tee, 2 stroke penalty for lost ball & 2 more for playing the wrong one.

It's already been pointed out twice that the player did not move his ball. His fellow competitor did i.e. the OP. The OP wrote:

Was about to give it up when he spotted it on 2nd fairway, yup Titleist 2 ,good to go. He played into green and I picked his provisional up

His fellow competitor was an outside agency and so the player could replace the ball without penalty (Rule 18-1).
When the player came back to rectify his wrong ball error, he could have used anything that was left of his 5 minute search time to have a further look for his original ball. Once the 5 minutes was up, the provisional ball became the ball in play even though the OP had picked it up. He could replace it without penalty - or drop it if the spot was not determinable - and carry on to play his 6th shot. (Provisional ball lying 3; plus 2 penalty strokes for wrong ball)

 

[Maninblack4612]

Surely he would have to go back to the tee and play a 3rd ball which would presumably be his 7th shot. (5 of the tee plus 2 penalty shots.

No, because he played the wrong ball in preference to the provisional. The provisional should therefore be treated exactly the same as if he'd played his first ball, supposing he found it.

 

[Maninblack4612]

No as mentioned in OP I picked his provisional up.

Irrelevant, I've changed my mind!

 

[Colin L]

No, because he played the wrong ball in preference to the provisional. The provisional should therefore be treated exactly the same as if he'd played his first ball, supposing he found it.

I've no idea what that means, least of all since in post #8 you said he would have to go back to the tee.

Judging what the OP said, the original ball was still in play when his FC played the wrong ball. That means it is still in play when he comes back to rectify the wrong ball error. As I said above, he could use whatever was left of his 5 minutes to carry on searching. If he can't find it, he moves on to play his provisional. Think of a wrong ball as something that didn't happen in the sense that it does not change anything of the situation that pertained at the time of playing the wrong ball.

 

[Crow]

But did the player agree to his provisional ball being picked up by his FC?

And if so, what then?

 

[williamalex1]

Immaterial I think but on a side note, I can't recall a player ever being penalised 3 strokes for the same offence.

 

[upsidedown]

But did the player agree to his provisional ball being picked up by his FC?

And if so, what then?

Yes having played what he thought was his original ball he asked me to pick it up.

 

[upsidedown]

I've no idea what that means, least of all since in post #8 you said he would have to go back to the tee.

Judging what the OP said, the original ball was still in play when his FC played the wrong ball. That means it is still in play when he comes back to rectify the wrong ball error. As I said above, he could use whatever was left of his 5 minutes to carry on searching. If he can't find it, he moves on to play his provisional. Think of a wrong ball as something that didn't happen in the sense that it does not change anything of the situation that pertained at the time of playing the wrong ball.

As the error wasn't noticed till we'd completed the hole could we have gone back and used what was left of the five minutes to search for original ball then ?

 

[louise_a]

if the FC picked up the provisional, would it be allowed for it to be replaced, could the point it was picked up from be established accurately?

 

[Maninblack4612]

I've no idea what that means, least of all since in post #8 you said he would have to go back to the tee.

Judging what the OP said, the original ball was still in play when his FC played the wrong ball. That means it is still in play when he comes back to rectify the wrong ball error. As I said above, he could use whatever was left of his 5 minutes to carry on searching. If he can't find it, he moves on to play his provisional. Think of a wrong ball as something that didn't happen in the sense that it does not change anything of the situation that pertained at the time of playing the wrong ball.

Yes, he has to return to the tee because the provisional ball ceases to be a provisional once the player makes another stroke. It's irrelavent whether the stroke is made at the correct ball or not. This is only an opinion, there may or may not be a decision to cover this situation, it's something that is likely to have happened before.