Slab
Occasional Tour Caddy
Yeah I have reservations about course rating but I'm very much treating that separately to WHS
POLL: How do you feel about WHS?
- Thread starter RichA
- Start date
Yeah I have reservations about course rating but I'm very much treating that separately to WHS
rulefan
Tour Winner
The USGA Course Rating was implement well before WHS
Voyager EMH
Slipper Wearing Plucker of Pheasants
I used to get a bit anxious when I knew that my best score was dropping off.Agreed, even more annoying is when you put in a decent round and you get an increase because a better 20th score (from many months or even a year ago) drops off.
When that happened this year I went up by 0.5 but won the seniors comp I played in - only just over 30 entrants - windy and drizzly conditions.
A bit weird, but I knew I was going up as soon as I finished my round. I did not know that I had won the comp until much later.
I'm over the irritation of those upwards movements. I know they are going to happen - I can predict it and I can accept it.
Its no weirder than shooting a nett 66 one day and winning and then shooting a nett 64 another day and coming 4th.
Orikoru
Tour Winner
But surely it was in readiness for WHS since we never used them for anything before. If we were still on the old handicap system, it wouldn't matter a toss what the course and slope ratings were.
Golfnut1957
Newbie
I think this is the key to accepting WHS. You mentioned in an earlier post that too many people can't/won't understand how key differential is and still rely on "36 points". I play regularly with two of them and every time they indicate a confusion with how or why their handicap has altered, their reluctance to accept the explanation is demonstrated by their eyes glazing over. "I'm just here to play golf and have a beer", until the next handicap change!
I have accepted the new system and am generally positive. I don't get upset about manipulation upwards, those people have always been around and always will be. As it is for me getting my handicap down a lot quicker, it is for them going in the opposite direction.
I find some of the course rating to be ridiculous, and while the rating of a course is not an actual function of WHS the rating produced has a massive (in some cases) impact on differential and consequently handicap.
As you alluded to, one of lifes great frustrations is watching your best score slowly creep towards oblivion and not having the game to replace it. On the other hand, knowing that tomorrows round may be the one more than makes up for it.
Arthur Wedge
Well-known member
I think the idea of WHS was good
But there are issues imo
1. It’s not a “world” HS - multiple countries have different ways of working
2. The implementation of it was poor , the disconnect between the golfing bodies and the ISV was clear as well as the disconnect between the governing bodies
3. It’s wide open to abuse
4. The ridiculous HC allowances created for some team competitions
But there are issues imo
1. It’s not a “world” HS - multiple countries have different ways of working
2. The implementation of it was poor , the disconnect between the golfing bodies and the ISV was clear as well as the disconnect between the governing bodies
3. It’s wide open to abuse
4. The ridiculous HC allowances created for some team competitions
Springveldt
Well-known member
Mostly positive for me. I like the slope rating system even if I do have my doubts about some of the ratings and how you can use score differential to judge how well you have played
Like most though I feel it's open to abuse so much. I don't have a problem with how easy it is to enter GP scores, I actually think that's a plus for the system but I guess I just don't like how reactive it is to upward movements of your handicap. I'm just not a fan of how you can stick in a few bad rounds and suddenly you are getting a bunch of shots for next weeks comp. You're current "form" shouldn't fluctuate by 2 shots just because you entered a poor GP round for 5 days in a row.
Like most though I feel it's open to abuse so much. I don't have a problem with how easy it is to enter GP scores, I actually think that's a plus for the system but I guess I just don't like how reactive it is to upward movements of your handicap. I'm just not a fan of how you can stick in a few bad rounds and suddenly you are getting a bunch of shots for next weeks comp. You're current "form" shouldn't fluctuate by 2 shots just because you entered a poor GP round for 5 days in a row.
harpo_72
Journeyman Pro
I worked out what my hcp would be under the old system 95% and course HCp and to be fair it doesn’t fluctuate massively. I used the slope rating as well.
At 95% my Hcp would 9.6, at course it’s 9.1 and my whs HI is 9.2 ..
so I can conclude that I have level performances and it’s pretty reasonable.
The weakness and there will always be people who will seek to find a loophole or short cut method to abuse is the number of counting rounds and how they are entered.
May be GP rounds give a full cut but only a 0.1 additional…
At 95% my Hcp would 9.6, at course it’s 9.1 and my whs HI is 9.2 ..
so I can conclude that I have level performances and it’s pretty reasonable.
The weakness and there will always be people who will seek to find a loophole or short cut method to abuse is the number of counting rounds and how they are entered.
May be GP rounds give a full cut but only a 0.1 additional…
jim8flog
Journeyman Pro
In a Bristolean accent
"What!! Not another one"
"What!! Not another one"
clubchamp98
Journeyman Pro
On the whole it hasn’t changed golf that much as a sport.
But world system it is not.
But the abuse of GP cards at both ends of the game is very worrying .
It’s created a culture of manipulation that’s sort of accepted as” you need a few more shots to compete”
I have heard that far to many times!
The app has just created a cheats charter imo.
But world system it is not.
But the abuse of GP cards at both ends of the game is very worrying .
It’s created a culture of manipulation that’s sort of accepted as” you need a few more shots to compete”
I have heard that far to many times!
The app has just created a cheats charter imo.
Steve Wilkes
Well-known member
Personally, I think WHS along with the ease of keeping a record through an App has been great. here are a few reasons
When used properly it gives a better reflection of a Golfers current handicap index which I think is more important that what someone could score once in a blue moon.
Great for Golf Societies or regular 4 to 12 ball roll ups etc, no more winner gets a 10% cut, runner up 5% etc, which ends up with players eventually off 10 when they trouble to play bogey golf.
None competition golfers, can also keep an up date index and/or keep track of progress and hopefully encourage them play more or try to improve.
Now the bad side
It doesn't always work for certain clubs or certain club competitions, especially large diverse fields and rules of competitions should be left entirely up to the clubs in how they allocate a playing handicap.
If this means previous comp scores only, or no GP cards. or 90%/80%/65% or divisions, low index etc. then they should be free to do so or vote through membership to do so.
This is mainly because I don't think any system could cover all scenarios, as each regular 4 ball, society, roll up and board competition is different.
When used properly it gives a better reflection of a Golfers current handicap index which I think is more important that what someone could score once in a blue moon.
Great for Golf Societies or regular 4 to 12 ball roll ups etc, no more winner gets a 10% cut, runner up 5% etc, which ends up with players eventually off 10 when they trouble to play bogey golf.
None competition golfers, can also keep an up date index and/or keep track of progress and hopefully encourage them play more or try to improve.
Now the bad side
It doesn't always work for certain clubs or certain club competitions, especially large diverse fields and rules of competitions should be left entirely up to the clubs in how they allocate a playing handicap.
If this means previous comp scores only, or no GP cards. or 90%/80%/65% or divisions, low index etc. then they should be free to do so or vote through membership to do so.
This is mainly because I don't think any system could cover all scenarios, as each regular 4 ball, society, roll up and board competition is different.
RichA
Well-known member
Personally, the only manipulation I've suspected from people I know is the questionable submitting of good rounds to lower their HI and then only for what I presume to be vanity purposes. They weren't people who were looking to qualify for elite comps.
The only criticism I've heard of anyone from the banditry perspective is for not recording their GP rounds - only comps. But that's what I do and I figure I'm maintaining an honest competitive HI that takes care of itself and only playing GP rounds for fun. If I had been recording my GP rounds for the last 12 months my HI would probably be 5 shots higher and I really would be a potential bandit when I play a conservative, attritional round in a comp.
My only reservation with the system is to do with the handicap rules rather than WHS, that suggest I should be recording every round that's played to the RoG.
clubchamp98
Journeyman Pro
I’m very similar I don’t do GP cards.
This system is ok for other countries imo but dosnt suit the UK.
We have so many different variations of courses and weather no system could please everyone.
So why change for the sake of it. Let’s be honest it’s not a world system !
I know some like it but we all have our opinions.
doublebogey7
Head Pro
The CR was SSS before WHS and was used in the calculation of handicaps.
Orikoru
Tour Winner
? But I'm talking about how we get different amounts of shots on different courses and tees depending on those ratings. Never happened before WHS.
doublebogey7
Head Pro
Really you said that the CR was not used when it clearly was. Whilst the WHS rating system was used to create SSS in the years immediately preceeeding WHS, there has for a very long time been a rating system in place.
Banchory Buddha
Well-known member
By "making stuff up" you mean going through a whole years stats, and posting them here, which replicate the previous years?
One of us did that, the other just posted an opinion
I’ve always been one of those golfers who just plays, and my handicap will be what it will be. So I’m not desperately invested in WHS or its predecessor - I just allow the system to do its best/worst.
What I do like is the fact my handicap is “portable” under the WHS and, providing the slope at every course is accurate, then my game now feels as though it travels with me on a far more regular basis.
I used to have real trouble performing well “away”. Now, nowhere near as much. Probably all between my ears, but if I am now able to enjoy playing elsewhere I’m not too concerned why that is.
What I do like is the fact my handicap is “portable” under the WHS and, providing the slope at every course is accurate, then my game now feels as though it travels with me on a far more regular basis.
I used to have real trouble performing well “away”. Now, nowhere near as much. Probably all between my ears, but if I am now able to enjoy playing elsewhere I’m not too concerned why that is.
RichA
Well-known member
The lady doth protest too much, methinks.By "making stuff up" you mean going through a whole years stats, and posting them here, which replicate the previous years?
One of us did that, the other just posted an opinion
People were using phrases like "universally detested", which seemed speculative and made up and, as it turns out, was not accurate.
Golfloveruk
Member
You keep mentioning stats. But all I’ve seen is you post a few Excel screenshots of some scores.By "making stuff up" you mean going through a whole years stats, and posting them here, which replicate the previous years?
One of us did that, the other just posted an opinion
Your credibility is rock bottom after your claim we don’t play individual opens in England was proven wrong. You even tried to swerve that with claims it was more about the cost!
