Marking & lifting on Green

[bobmac]

You said "I thought" which suggests to me you weren't sure.
Because I raised the question about touching the ball may have been a penalty but with the question mark after it, I knew someone would quote the rule, therefor removing your doubt, therefor clearing up the myth.

You can because its OK to do so.

See post no.11

Now, do me a favour and go and stalk someone else please
Thanks

 

[guest100718]

You said "I thought" which suggests to me you weren't sure.
Because I raised the question about touching the ball may have been a penalty but with the question mark after it, I knew someone would quote the rule, therefor removing your doubt, therefor clearing up the myth.



See post no.11

Now, do me a favour and go and stalk someone else please
Thanks

Like I said you are getting confused.

 

[Colin L]

I know that and so do you but how many people dont know that rule. As Foxholer said, an opportunity for conflict

Wouldn't it have been simpler, more helpful to those who don't know and more considerate of someone who spends time needlessly answering you, just to have explained it rather than presenting a question that read as if you you didn't know either?

 

[bobmac]

Wouldn't it have been simpler, more helpful to those who don't know and more considerate of someone who spends time needlessly answering you, just to have explained it rather than presenting a question that read as if you you didn't know either?

I could have downloaded the R&A app for my phone then looked up the exact ruling and quoted the numbers but I knew one of the rules experts would be along soon and would enjoy doing that.
In the meantime, those who weren't sure might have looked it up for themselves.

Sometimes, the best way to learn is to think things through yourself.

 

[Colin L]

I could have downloaded the R&A app for my phone then looked up the exact ruling and quoted the numbers but I knew one of the rules experts would be along soon and would enjoy doing that.
In the meantime, those who weren't sure might have looked it up for themselves.

Sometimes, the best way to learn is to think things through yourself.

I assume that the main reason people ask questions here is that they haven't managed to think it through for themselves and are asking for help and I, for one, wouldn't get much enjoyment from taking time to explain something to someone who doesn't need the explanation.

By the way, how are we going to tell the difference when you ask a question that you don't know the answer to and would like some help with?

 

[Region3]

Don't think so.

Rule 20-1 says

If a ball or ball-marker is accidentally moved in the process of lifting the ball under a Rule or marking its position, the ball or ball-marker must be replaced. There is no penalty, provided the movement of the ball or ball-marker is directly attributable to the specific act of marking the position of or lifting the ball.

And Decision 20-1/15 Meaning of “Directly Attributable” in Rules 20-1 and 20-3a says

Q. What is meant by the phrase “directly attributable to the specific act” in Rules 20-1 and 20-3a?

A. In Rule 20-1 the phrase means the specific act of placing a ball-marker behind the ball, placing a club to the side of the ball, or lifting the ball such that the player's hand, the placement of the ball-marker or the club, or the lifting of the ball causes the ball or the ball-marker to move.

On the more general point I have seen people mark first then measure and measure first then mark, and I have done both. Both are OK as Colin has confirmed as long as you use the same process in reverse to replace the ball. Again, in case it helps, Decision 20-1/16 Method Used to Mark Position of Ball says (inter alia)

When moving a ball or ball-marker to the side to prevent it from interfering with another player's stance or stroke, the player may measure from the side of the ball or ball-marker. In order to accurately replace the ball on the spot from which it was lifted, the steps used to move the ball or ball-marker to the side should be reversed.

Just an add-on to this that cropped up at our place a while back.

If you drop your marker on the ball and it moves (or drop the ball on the marker), even though you are on your way down (or up) to mark the ball, it is not classed as directly attributable to the marking process, and is a penalty.

 

[bladeplayer]

Just an add-on to this that cropped up at our place a while back.

If you drop your marker on the ball and it moves (or drop the ball on the marker), even though you are on your way down (or up) to mark the ball, it is not classed as directly attributable to the marking process, and is a penalty.

Yep this was a rule i found hard to understand Gar, especially when you add in ,
if you mark & lift your ball then push down the marker with your putter & it sticks to the putter & gets moved its not a penalty , surely what u state is more in the act of marking than pushing down ur marker

 

[rulefan]

Yep this was a rule i found hard to understand Gar, especially when you add in ,
if you mark & lift your ball then push down the marker with your putter & it sticks to the putter & gets moved its not a penalty , surely what u state is more in the act of marking than pushing down ur marker

Pushing down (ie stabilising or getting it level with the grass)) a marker is considered to be part of the act of marking. Bending down with your hand 6" from the ball is not. It is just bending down.

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

Just an add-on to this that cropped up at our place a while back.

If you drop your marker on the ball and it moves (or drop the ball on the marker), even though you are on your way down (or up) to mark the ball, it is not classed as directly attributable to the marking process, and is a penalty.

Has to be one heck of a ball marker to cause your ball to move if marker is dropped on it - however - with these 'poker-chip' things I suppose it's possible.

 

[North Mimms]

Has to be one heck of a ball marker to cause your ball to move if marker is dropped on it - however - with these 'poker-chip' things I suppose it's possible.

Didn't Poulter do just that?

 

[Imurg]

Didn't Poulter do just that?

Indeed he did..

 

[Region3]

Didn't Poulter do just that?

He did it the other way round, dropped his ball on his marker.

It lead to Westwood 'sympathising' on Twitter that although he didn't win the comp in Dubai he could always enter the world tiddlywinks championships!

 

[ShankyBoy]

If you replace your ball, pick your marker up...and then move the ball again (say to properly line up the ball) is that allowed, without a marker being in place. So not picking it up, just rotating it?

 

[rulefan]

If you replace your ball, pick your marker up...and then move the ball again (say to properly line up the ball) is that allowed, without a marker being in place. So not picking it up, just rotating it?

No. The ball may not be moved or touched whilst it is not marked (except that it may be touched with the club when addressing it).

 

[ShankyBoy]

Crikey...better stop that then