Junior Golf

[wrightways]

What are peoples thoughts on junior golf. My two boys recently won a competition at their away club at which they are full members and have allegedly got full playing rights and able to enter all competitions. After their win they were told they could not win a non junior club competition unless the card was marked by a senior club member. They regularly play open junior competitions and mark and submit cards unsupervised. For the record they are aged 16 off Handicap17 and 14 off Handicap22. Both junior team players for their home club. This isn't a "sour grapes post" but genuinely interested in peoples opinions / thoughts.

 

[Deleted member 16999]

I’m our JLO and our current Club rules allow Juniors to enter Senior Comps once they have a handicap of 18 or below.

Nothing in the Club rules about the status of the marker who must mark their cards.

In Junior Comps, obviously they are marked by other Juniors.

Can’t see why you’d need to stipulate who marks the card in Senior Comps, unless their is an element of mistrust.

 

[Deleted member 21258]

When the son was a junior(upto a couple of years ago), I'm fairly certain an adult had to mark the card or an adult had to be in the group, for it to count for an adult competition at both clubs he played(one almost didn't have a junior section, so used to play with us and the other had a large junior section which he joined an adult on the booking sheets if he entered an adult comp).

Never saw a problem with that.

In junior comps, clearly only playing with juniors, so no adult required.

 

[jim8flog]

Juniors must play with adult in normal club competitions where I play. It is written in our handbook.

 

[wrightways]

Thanks for the comments. It seems it is decided at club level. I will need to check the club handbook but nothing was mentioned about it when they joined or even on the website. They have a floundering junior section and we were welcomed with open arms.
So it then begs the question of how do we deal with the senior members who have a "magic pencil" as a lot of the game is based on trust and integrity of the player. Talking to a senior member I know at the club they are aware of certain seniors who play comps and win but always same partners yet rest of the year couldn't hit a barn door from 6ft with a bag of rice. I guess its down to individual clubs to police this type of thing.

 

[wrightways]

I’m our JLO and our current Club rules allow Juniors to enter Senior Comps once they have a handicap of 18 or below.

Nothing in the Club rules about the status of the marker who must mark their cards.

In Junior Comps, obviously they are marked by other Juniors.

Can’t see why you’d need to stipulate who marks the card in Senior Comps, unless their is an element of mistrust.

It seems Juniors are mistrusted at most clubs

 

[Doon frae Troon]

Thanks for the comments. It seems it is decided at club level. I will need to check the club handbook but nothing was mentioned about it when they joined or even on the website. They have a floundering junior section and we were welcomed with open arms.
So it then begs the question of how do we deal with the senior members who have a "magic pencil" as a lot of the game is based on trust and integrity of the player. Talking to a senior member I know at the club they are aware of certain seniors who play comps and win but always same partners yet rest of the year couldn't hit a barn door from 6ft with a bag of rice. I guess its down to individual clubs to police this type of thing.

Yup.
It has been my experience that adults are more likely to cheat than a junior with a club handicap.
Juniors have it drummed into them the perils of cheating.
Adults just join a club and fire away.
New to the game seniors [over 55's] being the worst offenders.
Two sibling juniors marking each others cards is a bit silly though. Imagine the questions asked if they came in 1st and 2nd, no matter how honestly they played.
They should never put themselves in that position.

 

[Lord Tyrion]

My son was at a club with an excellent junior section. Unfortunately they had no interest in integrating juniors into the adult section. Not allowed to play adult comps, not allowed to book tee slots via brs. I talked to the junior coordinator, the golf club manager. Not interested in changing so we left. They couldn't understand why we left, they didn't get it ?

He left along with about 4 others in his age group and just below, 14-15 at the time. The club they all moved to welcomed them with open arms. They had exactly the same playing rights as adults, could play comps, book any time via brs. The club did nicely out of them all as during the holidays the lads would go up there and play, have drinks and snacks days after day.

I think most clubs attitudes towards juniors transitioning through to adulthood is archaic and backwards. The idea of restricting juniors from playing is bonkers to me. If they have an adult handicap, let them play.

 

[GG26]

If I recall correctly Juniors at our club were not permitted to play in adult comps. This was changed last year so that Juniors with a handicap of 8 or less were allowed to play.

This summer none of the competitions have been Board comps and the juniors, and anyone else with a handicap of up to 54, have been welcome to play.

 

[The Fader]

Any club prohibiting juniors to play in competitions based on their handicap not being low enough are badly misguided IMO

That it's OK for older golfers who can't break 100 to play but an up and coming junior can't regardless of ability beggars belief.

Nonsense spouted about not paying full fees carries no sway with me - does any player receiving an age based discount get excluded - No, seemingly
just U18's These youngsters are the future lifeblood, club champions and committee members of a good club.

Encourage them every step of the way.

 

[Deleted member 18588]

Any club prohibiting juniors to play in competitions based on their handicap not being low enough are badly misguided IMO

That it's OK for older golfers who can't break 100 to play but an up and coming junior can't regardless of ability beggars belief.

Nonsense spouted about not paying full fees carries no sway with me - does any player receiving an age based discount get excluded - No, seemingly
just U18's These youngsters are the future lifeblood, club champions and committee members of a good club.

Encourage them every step of the way.

That is a myth I am afraid.

The vast majority of juniors disappear from around age 18-21. Either through work uni or being asked by the Club and their parents to pay a larger membership fee.

How else do you explain the dearth of members aged 21-35?

Obviously some stay at their clubs but the majority don't and tend to only return to the game in their late thirties or early forties.

As for the OP my Club has handicap restrictions for juniors competing in the more important comps. Personally I am all in favour of allowing more of them to enter.

 

[Bermuda]

Juniors......particularly in a private members club are a clubs best asset, as without them the only way is down, so embrace them and encourage them

 

[fundy]

Any club prohibiting juniors to play in competitions based on their handicap not being low enough are badly misguided IMO

That it's OK for older golfers who can't break 100 to play but an up and coming junior can't regardless of ability beggars belief.

Nonsense spouted about not paying full fees carries no sway with me - does any player receiving an age based discount get excluded - No, seemingly
just U18's These youngsters are the future lifeblood, club champions and committee members of a good club.

Encourage them every step of the way.

think in a lot of cases its more about an improving junior with a higher handicap is likely to be ahead of the handicapper and thus more likely to win a net comp

not saying I agree with it but its why a lot of clubs have the rule, they dont want massively improving juniors cleaning up all the prizes

 

[The Fader]

think in a lot of cases its more about an improving junior with a higher handicap is likely to be ahead of the handicapper and thus more likely to win a net comp

not saying I agree with it but its why a lot of clubs have the rule, they dont want massively improving juniors cleaning up all the prizes

I

Fair comment - but they can generally only do it once.

A bit like an improving beginner or returning golfer - do we exclude them as well until their handicaps are a bit lower so they can't take the money from
the more established members?

 

[fundy]

I

Fair comment - but they can generally only do it once.

A bit like an improving beginner or returning golfer - do we exclude them as well until their handicaps are a bit lower so they can't take the money from
the more established members?

there are clubs that stop new members/returning members winning comps esp board comps until theyve played a certain number of rounds. again im not a fan

either the handicap system works or it doesnt

 

[Deleted member 3432]

I remember going as a kid to play an open with my dad. They wouldn't let me play as I was a junior. There was nothing on the entry form that suggested I wasn't allowed to play.

I was probably better than about 70% of the hackers playing that day......

Despised clubs and individuals with an anti junior golfer attitude ever since.

 

[wrightways]

How could they enter a comp and play together without this getting picked up in advance?
Isn't there a start sheet?

Tee times booked and comp entered in advance only told when collecting score cards to start the round.

 

[jim8flog]

Tee times booked and comp entered in advance only told when collecting score cards to start the round.

The question I would ask is have you read your club's rules for juniors?

It is very clearly stated in ours.

I have not checked but I am sure a copy of the appropriate section of ours is also posted in the junior room. (must check tomorrow).

Sad fact of life - a lot of people only check the rules when they fall foul of them.

 

[Deleted member 16999]

The question I would ask is have you read your club's rules for juniors?

It is very clearly stated in ours.

I have not checked but I am sure a copy of the appropriate section of ours is also posted in the junior room. (must check tomorrow).

Sad fact of life - a lot of people only check the rules when they fall foul of them.

Agree, but I’d also ask why clubs have/need such rules?

 

[Lord Tyrion]

Agree, but I’d also ask why clubs have/need such rules?

This with knobs on.

Anyone from outside the world of golf would not contemplate that separate rules would exist. Having played adult club cricket and hockey from the age of 12-13 onwards the restricted world of junior golf came as quite a shock to me. Even as a golfer now for a few years I find the attitude of some, note some, golf clubs as bewildering compared to just about all other sports.