Foxholer
Blackballed
Why would it not count? SSS/CSS is there to take care of the difference in difficulty/conditions.
Handicap Adjustment
- Thread starter Crazyface
- Start date
sunshine
Well-known member
Just a guess, but the par 3 mentioned by the OP is probably not 250 yards. Maybe a bit of forum exaggeration.
Also, half par holes such as a long par 3 (call it a par 3.5) can often be interesting strategic holes, as long as the design allows for conservative / aggressive approach.
D
Deleted member 18588
Guest
You may well be right about the hyperbole.
However, a high proportion of leading course architects now question the idea of long i.e. 190 yards and above par 3's on courses primarily intended for the recreational golfer.
Driveable par 4's provide a better opportunity for risk/reward with strategic bunkering, rough closer than normal to the green etc.
Grant85
Head Pro
I played a round with our teaching pro last year. The course has 2 long par 3s... both 200 yards+ and one playing uphill. But other than that, it's not a long course with 2 short par 5s, 2 shorter par 3s and maybe 3 long par 4s... with probably 9 playable par 4s 280 to 360 or so yards.
The pro made the point that for him... the 2 par 3s are the only time the course would force him to have any iron longer than an 8 iron into any greens (apart from going for the par 5s... which is his choice, rather than being forced to by the design.)
So ultimately courses are designed for players of all ability and a few long par 3s are not the end of the world, so long as there is a way for the duffer to play a safe route and not have a 200 yard carry. I'd have a preference for a 220 yard par 3, over a 480 yard par 4.
For me, the only thing that annoys me about layouts are places spending time and money stretching out to Tour length courses for events that probably will never happen and even if they do get a challenge tour event or an elite amatuer event... does it ever recoup the money that members effectively spend to maintain a set of black tees that are used once every decade or so?
Foxholer
Blackballed
Still a rather daft length for a Par 3 imo! Would seem to need some appropriately placed hazard(s) some distance from the green to give short hitters (getting a shot) something to think about!
We have one that is between 185 and 195 (235 off very back ones - which Jamega Tour deemed too far!), slightly uphill and generally into any wind. It's been a long time since I've parred it, or even been putting for the 2nd shot! Though SI (8) goes some way to reflecting difficulty - for me! Guys I play with have a distinct advantage on this hole, compensated for elsewhere, as all significantly longer off the tee and still get shots. I'm 'happy' to lay up off tee, then, hopefully, chip close.
rulefan
Tour Winner
1) The Annual Review which your committee a obliged to do every year
2) All qualifying scores over any measured course are counted. Any difference in difficulty (ie SSS) is taken into account.
rulefan
Tour Winner
More specifically it is the SSS
rulefan
Tour Winner
The WHS (CONGU version) recommends par 3s should be up to 260 yards and par 4s 240 - 490 yards
Currently CONGU is par 3 up to 250 and par 4 220 - 500
D
Deleted member 18588
Guest
That is still no excuse for par 3's that more than 90% of recreational golfers have no hope of reaching with their tee shots.
Wolf
Well-known member
So by same token should all par 4s be reachable in 2 and par 5s in 3.
There will always be people that can't reach holes in regulation that's what handicaps are for.
Imurg
The Grinder Of Pars (Semi Crocked)
If the majority of golfers are going to play it like that all that does is show the hole up as being poorly designed in my opinion.
D
Deleted member 18588
Guest
A hole that is 35 yards longer than the average length of a drive is a poor piece of course design.
The green will be designed to receive a shot from a long iron or wood yet 90%+ will be hitting a very short iron for their second shot.
sunshine
Well-known member
We're all guessing as none of us know what hole it is... could easily be downhill and downwind and play like a 210 yard hole. Also, this is the "tiger" tee.
We'll have to wait for the OP to tell us what hole it is before we all slate it for bad design
Foxholer
Blackballed
jim8flog
Journeyman Pro
garyinderry
Ryder Cup Winner
4 long par3s are not what I call fun.
A single par 3 of over 200yards where par is a great score can be fun, memorable and a stern challenge.
A single par 3 of over 200yards where par is a great score can be fun, memorable and a stern challenge.
rulefan
Tour Winner
The SSS is the measure of a course's difficulty (for the scratch player). The CSS indicates how much the weather and course conditions affected the scores in that competition.
More is a comparative. Most is a superlative.
jim8flog
Journeyman Pro
I am sure we all know that but SSS is not relevant to handicap reviews. We would only be looking at a players net differentials.
rulefan
Tour Winner
You said earlier "It will count as the CSS reflects the fact that the comp was off Yellows. "
Not necessarily.
If the SSS of white is 72 and yellow 71, without other information about the tees a single CSS figure of 69, 70, 71, 72 etc doesn't tell you which tees were in play
fundy
Ryder Cup Winner
id love to know what a well designed par 3 thats 250 yards looks like, because Ive yet to see one!
