EU Referendum

[Doon frae Troon]

Not often Mr Troon but you are indeed wrong on that assessment!

Agree that HS2 is a collosal waste of £50bn or however much it is now which could be much better spent on regional services. I hear up north they've still got busses running on train lines.

I'd very entertain thoughts of a move to Scotland (or elsewhere), the biggest stumbling block personally is family. If I could move all of my and my partner's family with us, it's a no-brainer.

Speaking of Scottish trains.
Thanks to a EU grant, in the Borders we actually have the first new rail line in the UK since the Beeching cuts.
It was delivered on time, on budget [thanks Mr Swinney] and it is proving to be a huge success.
Hopefully they will extend it to Carlisle in the future.
Getting a third Forth bridge soon too, thanks to EU money.

 

[Doon frae Troon]

Tell that to the 170,000 unemployed in Scotland.

Is that all, gone down again, they are the natives who do not want to work.
I am CERTAIN that you know that every country has them.

 

[Hobbit]

Speaking of Scottish trains.
Thanks to a EU grant, in the Borders we actually have the first new rail line in the UK since the Beeching cuts.
It was delivered on time, on budget [thanks Mr Swinney] and it is proving to be a huge success.
Hopefully they will extend it to Carlisle in the future.
Getting a third Forth bridge soon too, thanks to EU money.

and the UK is still a nett contributor. It's very good of the EU to give us OUR money back. Pity they don't let us have the othe £9billion...

 

[ColchesterFC]

and the UK is still a nett contributor. It's very good of the EU to give us OUR money back. Pity they don't let us have the othe £9billion...

If we'd had that other £9 billion DfT could've had a golden train pulled by flying unicorns and think how happy he would've been then.

 

[JohnnyDee]

If I was the collective that is the rest of Europe I'd be happily asking for Britain to resign its membership immediately. I'd be totally fed up with our posturing and delusional self-important nonsense, in particular our continual whining on about how we're special and must be treated as being above the rest of the pack.

I don't doubt that Britain outside Europe would still trade and be sought after by the other countries, but what narks me is this arrogant 'we're better than them' ignorant self-aggrandising nonsense.

Murdoch's right-wing media bile, and Farage's UKIP ignorant drivel are nothing but risible jingoistic jokes for moronic Daily Fail readers, and none of it cuts any ice with me whatsoever. Unless, of course, I want to buy a bendy banana but can only get hold of a Brussels-sanctioned straight one, in which case I'm happy to become Angry of Tunbridge Wells and do a bit of enraged foaming at the mouth.

If there is a vote in June then I'll be putting my X against remaining in.

 

[User20205]

As it stands I would vote to stay in.
I don't begrudge polish kids their family allowance on a micro scale but to me it seems a nonsense to give benefits and free use of a already stretched NHS to someone from another country, on a general scale.

However it's the fear of the unknown that would keep me in. No one can categorically say for certain what would happen if we left, & that worries me.

 

[Doon frae Troon]

If we'd had that other £9 billion DfT could've had a golden train pulled by flying unicorns and think how happy he would've been then.

Naw, I prefer engines pulling my trains.

 

[Doon frae Troon]

and the UK is still a nett contributor. It's very good of the EU to give us OUR money back. Pity they don't let us have the othe £9billion...

Do you think those two projects would have gone ahead if Westminster had controlled that £9m.....call me an old cynic but I doubt it.

 

[delc]

Please correct me if I am wrong in your assessment....... you are all right jack with a hugely overpriced house which means the rUK outside of SE England have to leave the EU against their wishes.
The megabucks of wealth that is being spent on the transport system around London IMO is a huge waste of the UK's wealth.
What is the point of getting on a train from Birmingham to London 20 minutes quicker if it is only going to increase congestion.

If you cannot afford to buy a house in SE England tough, do as the Scots have done since the 16th century move to better yourself.

I wasn't aware of that much being spent on the transport infrastructure around London, particularly the roads, which are now completely gridlocked in the morning and evening rush hours. They haven't kept pace with the ever increasing population around here!

 

[CheltenhamHacker]

I wasn't aware of that much being spent on the transport infrastructure around London!

Now i know you're on the wind up!

 

[SocketRocket]

From my perspective the only part of the EU worth while is the free trade agreement but that has been over regulated to a degree that it's now more of a manacle than a benefit. The rest of the EU is of no use to us and has become a form of suffocating comfort blanket that we can do without. This Nation is more than capable of governing ourselves and it would be like a breath of fresh air to do so.

 

[Hacker Khan]

I wasn't aware of that much being spent on the transport infrastructure around London, particularly the roads, which are now completely gridlocked in the morning and evening rush hours. They haven't kept pace with the ever increasing population around here!

I think if you are expecting the roads in London not to be gridlocked at peak commuter times than you are living in la la land. They are in any city due to the massive amount of people that are trying to use a road system that more often than not laid out many decades, even centuries ago when the population and car ownership was a fraction of what it is now.

 

[Hacker Khan]

Which car plants are these?
The same ones that were to disappear if we failed to join the Eurozone?
Well, we didn't join [and a good job too] and those plants have flourished despite the warnings...
The same harbingers of doom then, are saying the same about 'Brexit'...
They were wrong then and I fancy they are wrong now...
I won't be listening to them...

Bottom line is, why DC is in charge, we are [sadly] going nowhere...

I was around for the first vote, and for me, none of the promises made for the ordinary working man have been met...
Might be on bits of paper floating around but majority of small businesses pay little heed to them...

Boss of Ford UK was on radio 5 this morning. Who said that they employ 14,000 people in the UK and the easy access to the EU free market was essential for Ford in the UK. Think he made it pretty clear where they, and I am pretty sure every other car manufacturer in the UK stand.

 

[Hacker Khan]

From my perspective the only part of the EU worth while is the free trade agreement but that has been over regulated to a degree that it's now more of a manacle than a benefit. The rest of the EU is of no use to us and has become a form of suffocating comfort blanket that we can do without. This Nation is more than capable of governing ourselves and it would be like a breath of fresh air to do so.

I am sure we are more than capable of governing ourselves. Germany for instance seems to manage it very well. But to me the big question is will 'going it alone' in a world of increasing economic globalisation ensure the long term social, economic and environmental future of this nation. Or will it be a doomed attempt by people to go back to a by gone age that will never actually return.

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

So what is the answer. Do you suggest that we have open borders and unlimited immigration? If not then what?

Why is it selfish for us to want to protect the benefits and life we and our forefathers have worked to create. It is possible to take a great deal of control over your borders but as members of the EU we will not be able to do that. As the EU continues it's lemming like policy of taking in more lame duck economies and some with large populations then we are open to immigration on a scale we have not seen the likes of yet. No matter how much our hearts bleed we will not be able to create suitable infrastructures to cope and the result will be a downward trend on standards of living and quality of life plus a surge of support for the far right.

Because the world has changed and the pressures on Europe have changed. And in the same way that some see it as our 'duty' to join with the US, France and the coalition countries in fighting Daesh/ISIS - I see it that we have a duty to work with all other European countries to manage the migration from the Middle east and elsewhere. After all do these other European countries not also have 'benefits of life' that they and their forefathers have worked for? Of course they do. We are no different but many of us like to think that we are.

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

As it stands I would vote to stay in.
I don't begrudge polish kids their family allowance on a micro scale but to me it seems a nonsense to give benefits and free use of a already stretched NHS to someone from another country, on a general scale.

However it's the fear of the unknown that would keep me in. No one can categorically say for certain what would happen if we left, & that worries me.

I haven't seen even the basic outline of any plan to establish a UK that has left the EU in European and global trading and economic bodies (that LEAVE tell us we'll be able to join); nor any costs and criteria to be met associated with joining and being members of such bodies; nor the costs or timescales of untangling the UK from EU legislation. Nothing.

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

and the UK is still a nett contributor. It's very good of the EU to give us OUR money back. Pity they don't let us have the othe £9billion...

Perhaps we forget the 'off-balance sheet' benefits the UK and we who live here get from the UK being in the EU - environmental, freedom of travel and work etc.

 

[Hobbit]

Perhaps we forget the 'off-balance sheet' benefits the UK and we who live here get from the UK being in the EU - environmental, freedom of travel and work etc.

Seem to be that many UK citizens travel the world for work and play. Yes, there are local laws on immigration in those countries but we seem to get by.

Environmental; I can remember the clean ups that were done in the 60's and 70's in an area of heavy industry. We weren't in the EU in the 60's, and it was a Common Market in the 70's, not a federal state.

It isn't what we originally signed up for. If it returned to being a Common Market/trading bloc, I would have no problem being part of it. But not a federal state with them making laws. There are cultural and political differences across Europe. I don't want, e.g. a eastern/western European bloc determining laws that suit them but not us.

 

[Ethan]

Seem to be that many UK citizens travel the world for work and play. Yes, there are local laws on immigration in those countries but we seem to get by.

Environmental; I can remember the clean ups that were done in the 60's and 70's in an area of heavy industry. We weren't in the EU in the 60's, and it was a Common Market in the 70's, not a federal state.

It isn't what we originally signed up for. If it returned to being a Common Market/trading bloc, I would have no problem being part of it. But not a federal state with them making laws. There are cultural and political differences across Europe. I don't want, e.g. a eastern/western European bloc determining laws that suit them but not us.

It isn't what we signed up for?. That is a pretty weak argument, isn't it? How many people who voted for or against the EU understand the complexity of international agreements, trade or laws? Even in this debate, most of those opposing the EU seem to think it is only about trade and all these laws made in Brussels. They don't seem to even know that the EU is responsible for a huge range of things including the approval and safety of medicines, air traffic control, anti-discrimination, consumer rights, regulating internet security not to mention keeping peace in a Europe which had 2 huge wars in the preceding half century.

 

[Hacker Khan]

It isn't what we signed up for?. That is a pretty weak argument, isn't it? How many people who voted for or against the EU understand the complexity of international agreements, trade or laws? Even in this debate, most of those opposing the EU seem to think it is only about trade and all these laws made in Brussels. They don't seem to even know that the EU is responsible for a huge range of things including the approval and safety of medicines, air traffic control, anti-discrimination, consumer rights, regulating internet security not to mention keeping peace in a Europe which had 2 huge wars in the preceding half century.

You telling me they do more than make us straighten our bananas??