England

[Deleted member 15344]

Remind me ho we won the world cup in italia 90, or 98? Those risks paid of big style phil?

Everytime this conversation comes up, i choose to prefer Rooney, you choose Barkely. It's not me having an agenda against barkley. If i'm proven wrong i'll hjold my hands up. And i;m not claiming that Rooney is the worlds best. But imo as ive already stated. I think whoever plays in the hole has to have a goals threat. From seeing barkely this year he may well score 1 wonder goal. But will he get 3 or 4? Rooney as you've shown has a poor wc record. But is stil a proven goalscorer and will i think show more of a threat.

Just because i disagree with you doesn't make me wrong, or vice versa. You dont always have to tyry and prove your point is the only point.

Whoever plays i'll wish well, but i dont think that being the next gazza is that special. Gazza would enterain greatly, but 90 aside, i dont remember him lighting a tournament up.

Read your two articles. Basically says Ross is our best prospect (i agree), and he should play his own game (i agree).

Also says that we shouldn't build him up too much either, but he;s being heralded as a saviour.

If woy starts with rooney we're doomed etc, show some courage blah blah.

Gazza played two major tournaments - 90 WC and 96 Euros - check out Englands performances in those tournaments

England in 1990 had their best ever World Cup since 1966 and hasnt been replicated since apart from 96 in the Euros - one player was at the heart of both of those and that is Gazza - That is the sort or potential that Barkley has - Martinez also states that Barkley would be straight into other international teams like Spain and i agree.

We have a wonderful talent on our hands and everytime someone does say something positive about him its dismissed - no one has heralded him a saviour etc etc etc but only one person keeps dismissing him. Barkley may not be a goalscorer but he will create the chances and create something out of nothing - he glides past players - you could see that in the game against Ecuador - went plast players with ease and was at the centre of everything good.

I remember Graham Taylor dropping Gazza in favour of safe players like Gordon Cowans and not taking the risk with someone like Gazza - Woy will do the same with Barkley. You agree with him - but one day there will be a realization that risks will need to be taken. History has already shown that with other teams - England one day will catch up and may actually make another challenge when they do.

 

[Papas1982]

Erm 96?
He was crocked for the rest or we didn't qualify, didn't Taylor also bottle it and didn't pick him against what he thought were "clogger" teams.

You mean the one goal against scotland? And a celebration? That sums gazza up for me, a great enteratiner. But if we're relying on someone to replicate his perfromances then we're waiting on the wrong person.

Shearer and Teddy we far better performers.

 

[Pin-seeker]

Really? On what grounds? A poor display at right back

Not at right back,in his usual position.
Like Phil said he's the safe bet.
Milner isn't a bad player & in a game like the Italy one I reckon he's nailed on to start. Not sure if Welbeck will.

 

[Deleted member 15344]

You mean the one goal against scotland? And a celebration? That sums gazza up for me, a great enteratiner. But if we're relying on someone to replicate his perfromances then we're waiting on the wrong person.

Shearer and Teddy we far better performers.

If you really think that was his sole contribution during that tournament then you would be extremely mistaken beyond belief - Shearer and Sheringham got the goals but someone wa supplying them with the ammunition - Gazza - he lit up the tournament after that Switzerland game and the atmopshere in the stadiums was amazing because of him. It was a great tournament and Gazza was at the heart of it

 

[richart]

I personally think we need to give the younger players a chance. We have all seen what players like Rooney, Lampard, Milner have done at previous World Cups, Euro's, and they are certainly not better players now than a few years back. We might struggle through the qualifying and get knocked out by the first decent team we come up against.

Lallana and Barkley were the two most exciting players last night. Yes they will give the ball away because they are looking to get forward and create chances. Both looked a real threat, and Barkley actually looked better when Honduras had 11 men. After the sending off they sat back and there was less space.

Do we play the same old team, that we all know will struggle through the World Cup, or go with Lallana, Barkley, Sterling, Shaw, etc players the opposition no little about, and give it a real go. I can't see we have much to lose.

I also found it strange we arranged a 'friendly' with Honduras. They were obviously looking to take players out with their style of play, and I hope we have no injuries. Not as if we didn't know how they would play. I suppose it was preparation for Uruquay.

 

[Papas1982]

Gazza played two major tournaments - 90 WC and 96 Euros - check out Englands performances in those tournaments

England in 1990 had their best ever World Cup since 1966 and hasnt been replicated since apart from 96 in the Euros - one player was at the heart of both of those and that is Gazza - That is the sort or potential that Barkley has - Martinez also states that Barkley would be straight into other international teams like Spain and i agree.

We have a wonderful talent on our hands and everytime someone does say something positive about him its dismissed - no one has heralded him a saviour etc etc etc but only one person keeps dismissing him. Barkley may not be a goalscorer but he will create the chances and create something out of nothing - he glides past players - you could see that in the game against Ecuador - went plast players with ease and was at the centre of everything good.

I remember Graham Taylor dropping Gazza in favour of safe players like Gordon Cowans and not taking the risk with someone like Gazza - Woy will do the same with Barkley. You agree with him - but one day there will be a realization that risks will need to be taken. History has already shown that with other teams - England one day will catch up and may actually make another challenge when they do.

Now no phil, lets not put words in my mouth. We know how much you hate that. I haven't said he is no good. Simply that he is being built up too much in my opinion. Just like whenever someone sings rooneys parises you'll jump on him. Or constanly call Roy Woy, we all have our own agendas.

Gazza enteratined at euro 96. I don't think he was our best player then by a long shot.

So barkely would now take Xavi, Fabregas or Inestas spot? Xavi alsosaid Le Tiss would walk into the spain side (literally as he wouldn't run) But i doubt any would agree with that.

I have stated Barkely is a talent, but said i pesonally wouldn't start him. You aren;t gonna change it so just leave it alone already.

I shan't comment on Barkely again as these circles are making me dizzy.

I just hope if Barkely if he plays, plays as well as you seem convinced he will, because you may be a nice supportive fan, but as your opinions on Rooney show. Footy fans are fickle. Owen, Walcott, Rooney have all been built up as the next hero and then get torn to shreds when they don't set the world alight.

 

[richy]

I agree re milner, I don't think he will start though. If he does it may be in place of Hernderson just as someone to stick to pirlo. I think having watched the games and seen his selections.

Sturridge
Rooney
Lallana
Gerrard

are nailed on an then it'll be henderson or milner in middle and sterling/barkley/welbeck as lasat attacking option.

I agree that Rooney will start but going on the 3 warm up games he shouldn't. He has done nothing of note in those games apart from a 1 yard tap in.

The only thing I hope is that Roy isn't affraid to drop players who aren't performing during the tournament no matter who it is.

 

[Papas1982]

If you really think that was his sole contribution during that tournament then you would be extremely mistaken beyond belief - Shearer and Sheringham got the goals but someone wa supplying them with the ammunition - Gazza - he lit up the tournament after that Switzerland game and the atmopshere in the stadiums was amazing because of him. It was a great tournament and Gazza was at the heart of it

You genuinely think the atmosphere was down to Gazza? England during major tournaments are always greatly supported. And it being at home will also contribute to that. As i've said, Gazza was a great entertainer so will have been supported well. As for this supplying of goals, i seem to remember assists being dismissed as a vaild contribution as a player could play a square pass and then the goalscorer dribble round the players and score.

If i recall though, our wing backs conributed quite a lot to as we didnt play through the middle (gazza) all the time.

 

[Papas1982]

I agree that Rooney will start but going on the 3 warm up games he shouldn't. He has done nothing of note in those games apart from a 1 yard tap in.

The only thing I hope is that Roy isn't affraid to drop players who aren't performing during the tournament no matter who it is.

Fully agree with this, I'm not too sure any of the players have come out of the friendlies looking a whole lot better. Ox probably biggest profile rise and johnson most tarnished.

 

[richart]

Taking a chance on new/young players has worked in the past. Lineker and Beardsley 1986, David Platt in 1990, Overshowed by Gascoigne, but that goal against Belgium.:thup:

 

[Pin-seeker]

I agree that Rooney will start but going on the 3 warm up games he shouldn't. He has done nothing of note in those games apart from a 1 yard tap in.

The only thing I hope is that Roy isn't affraid to drop players who aren't performing during the tournament no matter who it is.

I agree,but Roy won't drop Rooney or Gerrard regardless of performances IMO.

 

[Deleted member 15344]

You genuinely think the atmosphere was down to Gazza? England during major tournaments are always greatly supported. And it being at home will also contribute to that. As i've said, Gazza was a great entertainer so will have been supported well. As for this supplying of goals, i seem to remember assists being dismissed as a vaild contribution as a player could play a square pass and then the goalscorer dribble round the players and score.

If i recall though, our wing backs conributed quite a lot to as we didnt play through the middle (gazza) all the time.

Wingbacks ? Maybe in the Germany game when we lost Neville and Platt came in for in and they played Pearce as a Cb

We played 4-4-2 for the majority of that tournament

Seaman

Neville
Southgate
Adams
Pearce

Anderton
Ince
Gazza
McManaman

Shearer
Sheringham

Platt came in for Ince against Spain when he was suspended

I was there for every game at Wembley - the first game was stall very edgy , then it came alive against Scotland with Gazza right at the heart of it. That continued through into the Holland games then Spain and then into the Germany match. Gazza was supreme during 96 - at his best.

 

[Papas1982]

Taking a chance on new/young players has worked in the past. Lineker and Beardsley 1986, David Platt in 1990, Overshowed by Gascoigne, but that goal against Belgium.:thup:

Some of those are a bit before my time lol.

Euro 96 is my first real memories with us mising USA.
I just remember as an impressionable young tean of 13 being more excited by Macca than gazza.

Racking memory and Scotland he scores a decent goal, Holland was great tem performance. Ince was great. Spain was nervy (win won a shoutout!!) Germany, maybe i'd love GAzza more if he was 6 inches taller.

I'm probably just biased. I watched Le Tiss out perform gazza on a weekly basis but as he wasn't a spurs boy get over looked.

Think I'll youtube and catch up with you oldies

 

[Papas1982]

Wingbacks ? Maybe in the Germany game when we lost Neville and Platt came in for in and they played Pearce as a Cb

We played 4-4-2 for the majority of that tournament

Seaman

Neville
Southgate
Adams
Pearce

Anderton
Ince
Gazza
McManaman

Shearer
Sheringham

Platt came in for Ince against Spain when he was suspended

I was there for every game at Wembley - the first game was stall very edgy , then it came alive against Scotland with Gazza right at the heart of it. That continued through into the Holland games then Spain and then into the Germany match. Gazza was supreme during 96 - at his best.

I'd refer to fullbackas these days as wingbacks. Long gone are the days when they'd sit back. I was basically saying that our wide play with fb/wb and wingers being key. All i know is as a youngster, Gazza wasn't the mainmain in my eyes Did some entertaining tricks, was good in a tight space. But wasn't the key to our success imo. But as i've mentioned already, probably jut bitter over Le Tiss.

 

[Deleted member 15344]

Taking a chance on new/young players has worked in the past. Lineker and Beardsley 1986, David Platt in 1990, Overshowed by Gascoigne, but that goal against Belgium.:thup:

96 - Neville and Southgate

98 - Scholes , Owen and even Beckham

Even Rooney in 04

Take the risks - what is there to lose ?

 

[DAVEYBOY]

Haven't read the thread but my thoughts on England... We have no chance of winning but I'll enjoy the World Cup anyway :thup:

 

[Pin-seeker]

Haven't read the thread but my thoughts on England... We have no chance of winning but I'll enjoy the World Cup anyway :thup:

Agreed. My money is on the Argies

 

[Beezerk]

Haven't read the thread but my thoughts on England... We have no chance of winning but I'll enjoy the World Cup anyway :thup:

Indeed, which is exactly why we need to give the young guns a run in the tournament.

 

[Dodger]

Are Engerland home yet?

How does Henderson get in the squad? An awful footballer.

Him and Wellbeck are a waste of 2 plane tickets.

 

[Deleted member 15344]

Are Engerland home yet?

How does Henderson get in the squad? An awful footballer.

Him and Wellbeck are a waste of 2 plane tickets.

England may not do too well but at least they get there - when was the last time for the "Tartan Army " - 98 ?

Henderson gets in the "team" ( not just the squad )because he has had a great season playing to a very good level throughout. Fully deserves his place in the team.