Clean air zones

[larmen]

What happens if you are driving within the zone, rather than into the zone? Do you actually pass a camera to charge you?


Well, on our local FB group there are now 2 pictures of downed cameras and the people are happy about it and hating on the council (lib) who didn’t actually install them. But they also hate the council. When we have congestion because the M25 is closed, or there is a flower show, …

 

[stefanovic]

ULEZ then, just a disguise or euphemism for P2P (Pay to Pollute) Zone.

What happens if a road is closed forcing you into the zone?

 

[Deleted member 21784]

What happens if you are driving within the zone, rather than into the zone? Do you actually pass a camera to charge you?


Well, on our local FB group there are now 2 pictures of downed cameras and the people are happy about it and hating on the council (lib) who didn’t actually install them. But they also hate the council. When we have congestion because the M25 is closed, or there is a flower show, …

Yes you do, I mean on my drive to work I pass a vast number of cameras


Traffic lights near my house have cameras on them

 

[Fade and Die]

You may have miss understood. I used to be a lighting engineer and as such would have multiple site visits around the capital with up to 20 samples in my book ranging from small domestic downlights, 8ft architectural fitting through to industrial flood lights. How can I be expected to carry that type of stock around London? Visits without samples were perfect by train, but in many cases they were simply no practical.

All that plus the clubs in an electric bike? I’d like to see it.

 

[cliveb]

The area he tested in London was central London no? Where ulez has been in for a few years. Where black cabs are in the main electric, buses are ulez and such

So emissions have dropped no?

We all know the tubes levels are dangerous that's why we spend a lot of the night grinding the rails with a massive rail grinding train to stop the trains kicking up things when they brake etc

Yes, in the first video he tested the air quality inside the central ULEZ area and found it to be very good.
So you are suggesting that because he found good air quality within the ULEZ area, this supports the idea that ULEZ has improved air quality, right?

Now go and watch the second video, where he made the same measurements outside of the central ULEZ area (places like Kingsbury, Wembley, Hendon and Heathrow airport) and found the air quality there to be equally good.
How do you reconcile that with the claim that ULEZ has brought about the improvement in air quality?
Are you assuming that extending ULEZ to the whole of Greater London is going to improve its air quality from "good" to "virtually perfect"?

Nobody is disputing that London's air quality has improved. What some are questioning is the naive assumption that ULEZ has brought it about.

 

[Deleted member 21784]

Yes, in the first video he tested the air quality inside the central ULEZ area and found it to be very good.
So you are suggesting that because he found good air quality within the ULEZ area, this supports the idea that ULEZ has improved air quality, right?

Now go and watch the second video, where he made the same measurements outside of the central ULEZ area (places like Kingsbury, Wembley, Hendon and Heathrow airport) and found the air quality there to be equally good.
How do you reconcile that with the claim that ULEZ has brought about the improvement in air quality?
Are you assuming that extending ULEZ to the whole of Greater London is going to improve its air quality from "good" to "virtually perfect"?

Nobody is disputing that London's air quality has improved. What some are questioning is the naive assumption that ULEZ has brought it about.

The evidence is clear: low-emission zones like London’s Ulez work

Looking at the health problems caused by air pollution, poorer communities have most to gain

www.theguardian.com

 

[cliveb]

The evidence is clear: low-emission zones like London’s Ulez work

Looking at the health problems caused by air pollution, poorer communities have most to gain

www.theguardian.com

That article simply reports the data that air quality has improved, and assumes that this improvement is due to ULEZ.
This is a classic example of the logical fallacy that correlation implies causation.

And as far as the source is concerned: we all know that The Guardian is about as impartial in these matters as The Telegraph. They have an axe to grind, like any media.

The fact that air quality outside the ULEZ area has improved equally should ring alarm bells to anyone with an open mind.

You still haven't addressed the issue I posed: how do you explain that air quality outside ULEZ is as good as it is inside?

 

[Deleted member 21784]

That article simply reports the data that air quality has improved, and assumes that this improvement is due to ULEZ.
This is a classic example of the logical fallacy that correlation implies causation.

And as far as the source is concerned: we all know that The Guardian is about as impartial in these matters as The Telegraph. They have an axe to grind, like any media.

The fact that air quality outside the ULEZ area has improved equally should ring alarm bells to anyone with an open mind.

You still haven't addressed the issue I posed: how do you explain that air quality outside ULEZ is as good as it is inside?

Move to EV is one part, people naturally upgrading cars from non ulez cars to ulez cars

Every little helps

As posted previously, dpd, Tesco amongst just some companies using electric vans to do their drops

Surely you can't deny inside and outside of ulez that will have an affect

 

[D-S]

But aren’t all cars gradually going to become ulez anyway compliant as these older vehicles are gradually going to be scrapped? - that’s why there are only 10% of them now. This % has been gradually reducing and is set to continue to do so. In all likelihood in a few years the only non compliant cars are going to be ‘classic cars’ which some people will pay to keep on the road and they definitely should be charged as the only polluters left. Then you could introduce some extra road tax for all non ulez cars irrespective of where they’re being driven.

 

[Lord Tyrion]

But aren’t all cars gradually going to become ulez anyway compliant as these older vehicles are gradually going to be scrapped? - that’s why there are only 10% of them now. This % has been gradually reducing and is set to continue to do so. In all likelihood in a few years the only non compliant cars are going to be ‘classic cars’ which some people will pay to keep on the road and they definitely should be charged as the only polluters left. Then you could introduce some extra road tax for all non ulez cars irrespective of where they’re being driven.

The irony being that classic cars do not pay VED. My cousin has a classic Bentley from the 1980's. Beautiful car, massive petrol engine, drinks fuel for fun, no VED . That is something that will change over time, it doesn't make sense in this modern era.

 

[Deleted member 21784]

The irony being that classic cars do not pay VED. My cousin has a classic Bentley from the 1980's. Beautiful car, massive petrol engine, drinks fuel for fun, no VED . That is something that will change over time, it doesn't make sense in this modern era.

One thing I'm strongly against is the classic car exception

If anything those heaps should pay more

 

[larmen]

One thing I'm strongly against is the classic car exception

If anything those heaps should pay more

If it is a classic car they don’t drive that often, on the occasion they can pay.

 

[Bunkermagnet]

If it is a classic car they don’t drive that often, on the occasion they can pay.

Except that there are some who are now buying the exempt cars and using them, such as an Austin Allegro.

 

[Bunkermagnet]

Genuine question as I dont know the answer

HMRC recently said ULEZ can be claimed on a tax return

can parking charges be claimed?

No, parking cannot be claimed back as such. It may go down as an expense, if worded correctly, for offsetting purposes.

 

[clubchamp98]

Except that there are some who are now buying the exempt cars and using them, such as an Austin Allegro.

Jeez I’d rather pay than drive an Allegro.

 

[Bunkermagnet]

Jeez I’d rather pay than drive an Allegro.

So would I, but it just shows the absurdity of the whole thing.

 

[cliveb]

Move to EV is one part, people naturally upgrading cars from non ulez cars to ulez cars

Every little helps

As posted previously, dpd, Tesco amongst just some companies using electric vans to do their drops

Surely you can't deny inside and outside of ulez that will have an affect

You are avoiding my question.
If ULEZ is responsible for improving air quality, why is the air quality outside of the ULEZ area as good as that inside it?
It's a simple question that you need to answer.

 

[Deleted member 21784]

You are avoiding my question.
If ULEZ is responsible for improving air quality, why is the air quality outside of the ULEZ area as good as that inside it?
It's a simple question that you need to answer.

Why do I "need" to answer? I'm not bringing in ulez or standing for election? I don't "need to do anything" to be honest ...

I also already have answered the question.

Improvements in cars by upgrading and new tech help improves air quality

Some changed naturally, some changed for ulez .

Also you need to look at traffic density

In a city more cars more pollution

In the country side less cars less pollution

Simple as that.

 

[Oddsocks]

Genuine question as I dont know the answer

HMRC recently said ULEZ can be claimed on a tax return

can parking charges be claimed?


their not for everyone but for example Tesco, DPD are just two companies off top of my head that use electric vans to do their drops , thats a hell of a lot of diesel off the roads

but I do agree that diesel is a biproduct of petrol so needs to be used. however isnt that what long distance HGV and some trains are for?

There’s the hypocrisy of the highest order. Let’s encourage people to get on a diesel train instead of using a diesel car.

 

[Deleted member 21784]

There’s the hypocrisy of the highest order. Let’s encourage people to get on a diesel train instead of using a diesel car.

They are working to electrify all trains but cost in some areas

29% of network rail entire fleet is diesel that's not bad considering