Body Found, now I want answers!!

[doublebogey7]

There are areas of this country that don't have much crime, but manage it without paramilitary death squads patrolling the street or whatever Utopian existence they have.

This

 

[JamPal]

This guy has not been found guilty of the crime yet so we cannot say categorically he did it.

We have become scared to do or say anything about issues that offend us now incase we are accused of being racist, homophobic, right wing, bigoted and so on and so forth. We run scared of the European Court of Human Rights, the EU and Liberal elite that have taken away our freedom of speech and long held right to stand up for what we believe in.

We need to grasp the opportunity to break away and snap the shackles that are holding us back so we can take control of justice and common sense.

Liberal Elite? You mean intelligent people... surely you are not referring to the Tory government?

This case has nothing at all to do with any of the points you mentioned. To try and politicise it is shameful. I take it from your comments you are worried about being referred to as "right wing, Racist or homophobic", that being the case, your problem lies closer to home than Brussels.

A young girl has been murdered. This happens all too often. The place of birth of the chief suspect is not relevant to anything at all.

 

[JCW]

The area you talk about has crime - the death squads doing the unauthorised paramilitary killing

a young girl is dead and the law over here is too weak , the police rather hide round corners and catch you speeding , the business with the IS State is another , far too weak over here and respect the human rights of crooks more then those of us that obey the law , time to get real and get very tough , anyway more important things to do and i am off to the Algarve golfing for a week , 8 of us from the club

 

[Deleted member 15344]

a young girl is dead and the law over here is too weak , the police rather hide round corners and catch you speeding , the business with the IS State is another , far too weak over here and respect the human rights of crooks more then those of us that obey the law , time to get real and get very tough , anyway more important things to do and i am off to the Algarve golfing for a week , 8 of us from the club

So you would like an unauthorised death squad to go after this suspect and kill him ?

What business with IS state ? What does that have to do with this young girl and the police ?

 

[PhilTheFragger]

Can we keep the thread on track please

This IS angle is way off track

Thanks

 

[bluewolf]

Can we keep the thread on track please

This IS angle is way off track

Thanks

TBF Phil, the IS angle is not way off track if the point he's trying to make is that we are avoiding tackling extremism at home due to being "too soft". This then leading to British born Jihadists travelling abroad to fight..

Not saying that I agree with him, but you can't stifle the debate by cherry picking which points will be allowed...

 

[PhilTheFragger]

TBF Phil, the IS angle is not way off track if the point he's trying to make is that we are avoiding tackling extremism at home due to being "too soft". This then leading to British born Jihadists travelling abroad to fight..

Not saying that I agree with him, but you can't stifle the debate by cherry picking which points will be allowed...

As far as im aware, British born jihadists are not being sought in relation to the Alice Gross case, neither are IS extremists.

suspected criminals from other european countries is a different matter and is what this thread is about, feel free to start another one on a wider topic

 

[Foxholer]

@JCW

You are confusing 'the Law' and 'the Police'. Or are you opting for a 'Police State'!

Certain Human Rights are really only tested through the commission of a crime. You seem to be advocating that one of the fundamental ones - a fair trial - be removed!

 

[bluewolf]

As far as im aware, British born jihadists are not being sought in relation to the Alice Gross case, neither are IS extremists.

suspected criminals from other european countries is a different matter and is what this thread is about, feel free to start another one on a wider topic

I think it's fair to say that the thread had already evolved beyond its original topic.. Stifle away though...

 

[c1973]

There aren't any, but instead there are a few reprehensible, mostly unforgivable but ultimately extremely isolated incidents that get a disproportionate amount of coverage by certain sections of the media in order to forward their particular agenda.

Correct.

Reminds me of a song lyric by Blitz. 'I can't see many reds underneath my bed, but the fascists in the letterbox are messing up my head, propaganda you scare me to death.......'


Having said that, questions do need to be asked and answered here.

 

[Hacker Khan]

As far as im aware, British born jihadists are not being sought in relation to the Alice Gross case, neither are IS extremists.

suspected criminals from other european countries is a different matter and is what this thread is about, feel free to start another one on a wider topic

You really want a thread on here discussing IS and Jihadists ?

Your funeral...

 

[PhilTheFragger]

You really want a thread on here discussing IS and Jihadists ?

Your funeral...

TBH id prefer that all extremist topics were avoided as they always go wrong and require much more Mod intervention than other threads, part of the reason for keeping this particular thread on track before someone escalates their comments to DEFCON 1

 

[garyinderry]

I think it's fair to say that the thread had already evolved beyond its original topic.. Stifle away though...

I've never understood why it is preferable to start a new thread when a topic detours from the original topic. who cares!

 

[SocketRocket]

Liberal Elite? You mean intelligent people... surely you are not referring to the Tory government?

This case has nothing at all to do with any of the points you mentioned. To try and politicise it is shameful. I take it from your comments you are worried about being referred to as "right wing, Racist or homophobic", that being the case, your problem lies closer to home than Brussels.

A young girl has been murdered. This happens all too often. The place of birth of the chief suspect is not relevant to anything at all.

By Liberal Elite I mean people who think they are so intelligent that only their opinions count and those of the 'ordinary people' should be ignored as ignorant. And I am certainly including the likes of Tony Blair, Gordon Brown, Nick Clegg and Ed Miliband in that elitist group.

I am worried that national security is being degraded by us not having the ability to check the backgrounds of people coming to this country. If we had been better at this rather than frightened to offending the human rights of criminals and murderers then this terrible thing may not have happened.

If you think that is political gesturing and shameful then so be it. I see this man's nationality very relevant to the issue.

 

[HomerJSimpson]

Back on track it seems the post mortem is inconclusive and they are now conducting further tests to find the cause. Very sad and whether the East European suspect is culpable or indeed involved should be left to the police to discover. To be fair, many of these high profile cases (Soham etc) usually get solved and so I hope the truth comes to light and the murderer is found.

 

[JamPal]

By Liberal Elite I mean people who think they are so intelligent that only their opinions count and those of the 'ordinary people' should be ignored as ignorant. And I am certainly including the likes of Tony Blair, Gordon Brown, Nick Clegg and Ed Miliband in that elitist group.

I am worried that national security is being degraded by us not having the ability to check the backgrounds of people coming to this country. If we had been better at this rather than frightened to offending the human rights of criminals and murderers then this terrible thing may not have happened.

If you think that is political gesturing and shameful then so be it. I see this man's nationality very relevant to the issue.

Not all opinions are equal though are they. As much as people have a right to an opinion, they do not have the right to have their opinions heard or taken into account. Especially if they are demonstrably incorrect. After all, you can have your own opinions, you can't have your own facts.

No one is frightened of offending the human rights of murderers. Where do you get that idea from?

In what way is his nationality relavent to the fact that he may have murdered a girl? Seriously! How?

Are you suggesting that if he had not been here, he wouldn't have killed a girl? How do you know he wouldn't have killed a Latvian girl? Or are you suggesting that the life of an English girl has inherently more value than that of a Latvian girl?

 

[SocketRocket]

Not all opinions are equal though are they. As much as people have a right to an opinion, they do not have the right to have their opinions heard or taken into account. Especially if they are demonstrably incorrect. After all, you can have your own opinions, you can't have your own facts.

No one is frightened of offending the human rights of murderers. Where do you get that idea from?

In what way is his nationality relavent to the fact that he may have murdered a girl? Seriously! How?

Are you suggesting that if he had not been here, he wouldn't have killed a girl? How do you know he wouldn't have killed a Latvian girl? Or are you suggesting that the life of an English girl has inherently more value than that of a Latvian girl?

Opinions and even perceived facts are subjective and not as clear as you suggest.

Regarding the Human Rights of Murders, Rapists and Criminals in general; the Government have great problems with taking action such as expelling them from our shores and their rights to a family life are often used. There is also the accusation of being racist that is overused in these cases.

Whether this man would have murdered a girl in Latvia is not our concern, it's more a concern for the Latvian authorities to manage. Your question regarding the perceived worth of a Latvian girl and a UK girl is very stupid and not worth a reply.

 

[JamPal]

Opinions and even perceived facts are subjective and not as clear as you suggest.

Not true. Facts are objective. Opinions are subjective. There is a very clear divide. Facts can only change with new evidence. Opinions are entirely worthless.

Regarding the Human Rights of Murders, Rapists and Criminals in general; the Government have great problems with taking action such as expelling them from our shores and their rights to a family life are often used. There is also the accusation of being racist that is overused in these cases.

I think the accusations of racism often stem from the inherent racism in these cases. That you can't see it may be the source of your misplaced frustration.

There are problems with expelling people that have right to remain, because they have a right to remain. In the same way that you do.

Whether this man would have murdered a girl in Latvia is not our concern, it's more a concern for the Latvian authorities to manage. Your question regarding the perceived worth of a Latvian girl and a UK girl is very stupid and not worth a reply.

Well, it was your assertation that this girl could possibly still have been alive had he not been allowed in. I merely pointed out that although that could be true, it may have had a similar effect on another girl.

Again, back to my original point, his nationality has no bearing on this case. What is wrong with him (if guilty) is the fact he murdered this young girl. His nationality is not the problem here. Whether he murders girls in this country or in another European country makes no difference at all. Not to me anyway.

Clearly you feel differently. "Latvia's concern"... and therefore not ours?

Lines on a sodding map. The worst thing to afflict this planet.

 

[woody69]

Not true. Facts are objective. Opinions are subjective. There is a very clear divide. Facts can only change with new evidence. Opinions are entirely worthless.



I think the accusations of racism often stem from the inherent racism in these cases. That you can't see it may be the source of your misplaced frustration.

There are problems with expelling people that have right to remain, because they have a right to remain. In the same way that you do.




Well, it was your assertation that this girl could possibly still have been alive had he not been allowed in. I merely pointed out that although that could be true, it may have had a similar effect on another girl.

Again, back to my original point, his nationality has no bearing on this case. What is wrong with him (if guilty) is the fact he murdered this young girl. His nationality is not the problem here. Whether he murders girls in this country or in another European country makes no difference at all. Not to me anyway.

Clearly you feel differently. "Latvia's concern"... and therefore not ours?

Lines on a sodding map. The worst thing to afflict this planet.

Very eloquently put.

 

[Deleted member 15344]

Looks like his body has now also been found