Amateur Status

[barrielay]

I am a member of the Seniors section at my local club. On a weekly basis we run a competition with an entry fee of £2, typically for about 40 members. Most of this is then paid out in prize money with 4 prizes in each of 2 sections determined by handicap.
At best you can get back £15.
Are we really breaking the rules of Amateur Status?

To make things even worse we adjust our non standard senior's handicap , down if you win money, up if you play and don't win.

You really can get rich on this basis.

How many other club sections do similar things?

 

[ScienceBoy]

Limit is £500 (total value of prize) per competition, any higher is breaking the rules and you would have to turn pro to accept it.

Read the rule book for full explanation as it has a whole section on amateur status.

It also defines the rules on sponsorship, event fees and expenses.

For an example I won over £300 in a short space of time in pro shop vouchers and prizes thanks to some top 5 finishes and a top two placing in two honours board competitions (one was club champs).

 

[chrisd]

Hi Barrie and welcome to the forum

No, you are not in any way infringing amateur status with what you do. Most clubs run these sort of competitions in some form or another and I guess would come under the heading of gambling under the rules - you put up a stake with the winers taking the pot. As an amateur you cannot accept a prize valued at over £500, except for a hole in one prize.

 

[Colin L]

We play at our thrice weekly seniors' roll-up for 25p. Maximum winnings in a 3 ball therefore 50p.

I think my amateur status is secure.

 

[sydney greenstreet]

I am a member of the Seniors section at my local club. On a weekly basis we run a competition with an entry fee of £2, typically for about 40 members. Most of this is then paid out in prize money with 4 prizes in each of 2 sections determined by handicap.
At best you can get back £15.
Are we really breaking the rules of Amateur Status?

To make things even worse we adjust our non standard senior's handicap , down if you win money, up if you play and don't win.

You really can get rich on this basis.

How many other club sections do similar things?

If it would make you feel better in yourself you can pass any money won onto me ?

 

[Paul_Stewart]

Ask Derek Lawrenson of the Mail about this subject and then stand back. He won a Ferrari for a hole-in-one and had to turn in his amateur status to take it. Not a big sacrifice you might think but he has spent the last few years slagging off the R&A at every opportunity in his columns for the Daily Fascist.

 

[6inchcup]

the rules have recently been changed and you don't have to loose your amatuer status for winning a car or similar prize also the prize money has been raised to account for foreign holidays etc,ask bobby charlton he won a car and turned pro!!!!! then took him 5 years to get his amatuer status back.

 

[Foxholer]

The rule for hole-in-one prizes(only) has been rescinded.

The Ferrrari was won at my club many years ago - before I'd even taken up golf even!

 

[FairwayDodger]

Yeah, it's fine for small prizes and new rules this year regarding exceptional prizes for a hole in one.

I'm currently sitting on £335 from vouchers won in opens so far this year.... not planning on turning pro!

:thup:

 

[duncan mackie]

I am a member of the Seniors section at my local club. On a weekly basis we run a competition with an entry fee of £2, typically for about 40 members. Most of this is then paid out in prize money with 4 prizes in each of 2 sections determined by handicap.
At best you can get back £15.
Are we really breaking the rules of Amateur Status?

As Chrisd suggested this comes under the acceptable gambling policy in the Appendix to the Rules on Amateur Status.

It could even have been written as an example!

The wording of the rule is

"Acceptable Forms of Gambling
There is no objection to informal gambling or wagering among individual golfers or teams of golfers when it is incidental to the game. It is not practicable to define informal gambling or wagering precisely, but features that would be consistent with such gambling or wagering include:
the players in general know each other;
participation in the gambling or wagering is optional and is limited to the players;
the sole source of all money won by the players is advanced by the players; and
the amount of money involved is not generally considered to be excessive. "

 

[barrielay]

As Chrisd suggested this comes under the acceptable gambling policy in the Appendix to the Rules on Amateur Status.

It could even have been written as an example!

The wording of the rule is

"Acceptable Forms of Gambling
There is no objection to informal gambling or wagering among individual golfers or teams of golfers when it is incidental to the game. It is not practicable to define informal gambling or wagering precisely, but features that would be consistent with such gambling or wagering include:
the players in general know each other;
participation in the gambling or wagering is optional and is limited to the players;
the sole source of all money won by the players is advanced by the players; and
the amount of money involved is not generally considered to be excessive. "

We have also tried to run qualifying comps for our seniors group on the same share the pot basis, and our DOG has insisted that this is against "the rules" and reclassifed them as non qualifiers.
Can he do this?

 

[rosecott]

We have also tried to run qualifying comps for our seniors group on the same share the pot basis, and our DOG has insisted that this is against "the rules" and reclassifed them as non qualifiers.
Can he do this?

Surely the committee has the reponsibility for administering handicaps and deciding on the qualifying status of competitions. I assume your DOG is a professional golfer - the CONGU handicap system is for amateur golfers.

 

[duncan mackie]

We have also tried to run qualifying comps for our seniors group on the same share the pot basis, and our DOG has insisted that this is against "the rules" and reclassifed them as non qualifiers.
Can he do this?

as rosecott says, the question is 'which rule or rules?'

the rules governing qualifying comps are governed by the CONGU manual, and generally these focus on the principle that any competition that can be a Q comp should be.