Tashyboy
Please don’t ask to see my tatts 👍
Not sure there is one OS, it's just a nine hole NQ Stableford for club shop vouchers.
A normal day in the clubhouse
- Thread starter Tashyboy
- Start date
Not sure there is one OS, it's just a nine hole NQ Stableford for club shop vouchers.
D
Deleted member 15344
Guest
Eh ? 🤔
Im struggling to understand- your mate was calling this guy a bandit because he has a new HC ( no real substance behind the reasons ) - and he was whinging because he out drove him with an iron - yet he only got 21 points !!
2blue
Journeyman Pro
No, CDH numbers are for life starting from 2009... when a Club releases a player their CDH remains waiting to be picked up by the new Club.
If this is not done & 3 cards put in & a new CDH allocated then their will be a duplicate that only EG can resolve.
It's not a terribly easy data-base to interrogate & does take time to do so. There's lots of scenarios where many folk are often actually unaware of CDH, especially if they only played in the early years of its introduction...… & some are happy to just get a new, very competitive, handicap so do not declare all that they should..... some H/cap Secs are too pressed to have time to investigate every new golfer, though they both owe it to the membership to be as complete as possible in the process..... & that should include those that sign the new members cards.
Last year we had a 30 year old new member who had been off 12 when in his early teens so no CDH. He submitted 3 cards which suggested H/cap of 23..... he was given 21 ….. had lessons, practised, played regularly & has good course management which meant he came down 10 shots in one year.
I thought that even though some 16 years had passed by it would have been fair to just halve the difference & him start on 16 so that he at least has to work towards his 'level' rather than be 'gifted it'. In 16 years you wouldn't forget how to swim or ride a bike just need to 'brush-up' on things. Initial H/cap allocation will always be a problem
williamalex1
Money List Winner
We run a 9 hole winter comp, but because it's non qualifying, they use some weird system to suit the computer system, not sure exactly what, but i think you receive your full H/C allowance
.
D
Deleted member 1147
Guest
Tashy, what the hell are you moaning at Phil for?
Someone called a guy a bandit because his handicap has risen sharply, but the guy didn’t have an extraordinary score.
I agree with Phil - tarnishing the guy’s reputation isn’t very good etiquette!
Wolf
Well-known member
OK so despite my earlier post about guy needing his handicap looking at going to revise part of my early post based on his score, if he only got 21 points that's hardly suggestive of being off a 4 handicap in the original scenario, if he were in fact a 4 handicap playing off an overly high false one I'd have expected him to be nearer the 30point mark for 9 holes.
Perhaps in this instance someone has got their wires crossed and was a little upset that someone knocked an iron past them damaging their ego this the oldest insult in golf gets applied that said person is a bandit. Plus distance doesn't equate skill level at club level, I play regularly with a guy off 19 that can knock it way past me of the tee and hits shorter irons to par 3s than I do, yet not once has he been better than 34points this year or been anywhere near my scores gross. Its about ability to score not bomb the ball at our level.
Best thing here Tashy is have a game with the fella and see what you think, you'll soon know if matey boy in the bar making the accusations is right or whether he's just a bit like the beer being served a little Bitter...
Perhaps in this instance someone has got their wires crossed and was a little upset that someone knocked an iron past them damaging their ego this the oldest insult in golf gets applied that said person is a bandit. Plus distance doesn't equate skill level at club level, I play regularly with a guy off 19 that can knock it way past me of the tee and hits shorter irons to par 3s than I do, yet not once has he been better than 34points this year or been anywhere near my scores gross. Its about ability to score not bomb the ball at our level.
Best thing here Tashy is have a game with the fella and see what you think, you'll soon know if matey boy in the bar making the accusations is right or whether he's just a bit like the beer being served a little Bitter...
Last edited:
Orikoru
Tour Winner
I'm with Liverpool Phil (for once). 21 points for nine is decent, but it's not the score a genuine 4 hcap would get playing off 23, so not worth the word bandit being fired around.
We still don't know how many years he wasn't playing for, unless I missed it? Or was it unknown?
We still don't know how many years he wasn't playing for, unless I missed it? Or was it unknown?
Wolf
Well-known member
On the point of CDH, maybe someone can advise me on this. When I joined my club and have my playing history I was asked for CDH number. However having been away from the game so long I had no idea what mine would be, was the advised by our Pro who looks after handicaps that due to the amount of time out of the game that there would no longer be a record of my CDH anyway, hence the playing 3 rounds and scorecards being done upon his advice. Should my CDH have been still on record somewhere then or was the pro right no record would any longer exist! This thread and some subsequent replies has made me question my own handicap now.
2blue
Journeyman Pro
PM me your full name & previous Club/clubs & I'll have a look for you, matey. CDH started in 2009 so if earlier there wouldn't be one.
Wolf
Well-known member
Cheers mate ill send you details, based on 2009 then I should have CDH number, so now I'm questioning integrity of my own handicap based on what I was advised.
HomerJSimpson
Hall of Famer
The point is, 21 point for 9 is still three under handicap and without knowing the ins and outs could potentially have been more (if a couple of putts had dropped) or he may have been going for everything and not scored on a hole as it was. So difficult to make accurate assumptions although I do feel the guy in question is wrong for not at least mentioning playing ability and handicap and giving the new handicap secretary all the information to decide on how to proceed
rulefan
Tour Winner
For the first few years old CDH numbers were removed from the CDH after 2 years inactivity. They were then rebranded as a "Lifetime ID" and are now maintained forever on the CDH. Clubs may delete them from their own systems as and when they wish. The old records are available to handicap secretaries providing they have been given the appropriate access by the national union. If a sec has a problem locating a record, EG at Woodhall Spa are very helpful.
Sports_Fanatic
Assistant Pro
But again, I don't think anywhere its confirmed that the guy hasn't told the handicap committee everything (just a presumption not) and they've come to that conclusion. Perhaps the three cards were woeful and below a 23 handicap, perhaps serious illness as mentioned, or he was never a 4 handicap as people exagerate (either player or playing partner). We just don't know.
All we've got is someone hitting an 8 iron past someone who's driving distance we don't know, coming third or worse in a competition of 21 points (which may have room for improvement or could be his best ever (recent) 9), and we're going straight in as a bandit.
Personally, when playing in a handicap comp, some times golfers just need to accept that others played better on the day relative to their handicap. That's not directed at the OP, but far to often people come away moaning about "bandits", "handicap protection" when they should say well done, great playing etc. Perhaps the individual has worked really hard at their game and being rewarded - that should be encouraged not questioned.
rudebhoy
Q-School Graduate
Did the guy actually say that he used to be off 4, or is it just hearsay?
Sports_Fanatic
Assistant Pro
To also add I play off 14 (but don't play masses), and was playing with a 6 handicap the other day. Uncanny how often we were in the same place of drives (or I had driven slightly further/better position) or even second shots. I seemed to be able to hit all the shots he could hit, but he easily outscored me as I'd throw in a bad shot here or there, or be slightly off on my chip so down in 3 rather than 2.
People not watching closely could easily have thought we were close in scoring but we weren't thanks to his consistency.
People not watching closely could easily have thought we were close in scoring but we weren't thanks to his consistency.
rudebhoy
Q-School Graduate
One of my regular PPs has improved out of all recognition over the winter. He has been playing for 3 years, was given an initial handicap of 24 which went up to 26 as he was struggling to play anywhere near it.
Like I say, it's now clicked over the winter, and he is regularly shooting in the low 40s. There have not been any qualifying tournaments since October, but when they start up next week, I'm expecting him to clean up until he gets a cut which reflects his proper mark.
No doubt there will be a few cries of "bandit' if he posts a 42 or 43 and wins a comp off 26. Is that fair? I don't think so - he's just like a racehorse who is ahead of the handicapper, he hasn't fiddled to get his current mark, and the handicapper will catch up with him soon enough.
Like I say, it's now clicked over the winter, and he is regularly shooting in the low 40s. There have not been any qualifying tournaments since October, but when they start up next week, I'm expecting him to clean up until he gets a cut which reflects his proper mark.
No doubt there will be a few cries of "bandit' if he posts a 42 or 43 and wins a comp off 26. Is that fair? I don't think so - he's just like a racehorse who is ahead of the handicapper, he hasn't fiddled to get his current mark, and the handicapper will catch up with him soon enough.
HomerJSimpson
Hall of Famer
I totally get that and I've acknowledge that at the moment a lot of its conjecture and hearsay. I just find the correlation between clearly playing a decent standard (whether that was actually 4 or not) and then suddenly going up so much difficult to understand when they then put a sub-handicap 9 hole score together straight after getting the new mark. Every dog and all that and maybe the guy has worked hard on his game since. Again we don't know. As a short hitter I have no interest or think it bears too much relevance into who it what into which hole and how far past me or a PP anyone is and I wouldn't call anyone a bandit on that basis. However you can see when someone is a capable player, especially on and around the greens and I just find it strange why "allegedly" he hasn't told the committee about his previous handicap history. I thought that was a CONGU requirement? I have seen a number of high handicappers win events, especially over the winter off the yellow tees and would never question them as bandits. Conversely, I know one or two that really pick and choose when to enter competitions and seem to do all they can to protect their handicap mark. Again, as long as they put the mandatory cards in to keep an active handicap there's not much that can be done and nothing that says they have to play all of the time. Doesn't stop one or two asking the odd question though.
Either way I don't really care overly. If he has been ill and really play to 23 at the time and is now improving then fair play. The only stumbling block that would remain is why it wasn't mentioned about the lower mark and give the handicap secretary enough information to make a rational decision that isn't penal to the player but protects the field. Isn't that the idea of mentioning previous history?
rksquire
Head Pro
2 guys recently returned to golf at our club after a long lay off (previously at a different club but have moved). One was off 12 and the other 18. Marked their cards one week, didn't look like either one could play to that old handicap. They played in front of us in their first comp after receiving their handicap. They were given 12 and 21 respectively. Neither one looks like they can play to it, although the 12 played the odd shot (that we seen) that shows potential, but he's a long way off 12. To be honest, don't expect them to feature for a long time.
D
Deleted member 21258
Guest
Sometimes people do not return to their previous standard for no particular reason, I had a period just before giving up golf of playing to low single figures on a social level, but just cant find that form since returning to the game.
Cant get my gimme chipping back. One day Rodney one day.....
Cant get my gimme chipping back. One day Rodney one day.....
Tashyboy
Please don’t ask to see my tatts 👍
If I go back to the very start, I never said anything from my point of view that he is a bandit. I said someone else who played 18 holes with him said it. Phil then said he scored 21 points in a nine holer and he is tarnished a bandit. I don't think the score was important. Coz let's call a spade a spade. No ones ever shot 10 under on 14 holes and missed a few easy ones or blobbed an hole or two on purpose have they. And I am not saying he has.Probably what was important was what Maggot saw. And listening to Maggot over the last X number of years I have never heard him say owt like that before.
I will tell you what I am moaning at Phil for, because any post I put on he dissects it for one word which he can pick up on and quiet frankly it gets on my tits.
Anyway having played a few holes today, guess who I saw, Maggot. I asked him re said persons hcap and he confirmed it again. He also added that said golfer is in his late twenties, said golfer got down to four in his early twenties, but he has not played for 7 years. His main focus was cricket. Apparantly he was very very good, but now his knees are knackered and he has taken up golf again.
