9 hole qualifiers - Is getting cut easier?

[Coffey]

9 hole qualifying events have became very popular in NI over the last few years for mid week competitions. We actually run 2 per week across both our courses.

One thing I cannot understand is how the shots are allocated. I get that it is based on stroke indexes of the holes which are played yet in our 9 hole event. Playing off 10.1 I was getting 7 shots over the 9 holes!!

Add to this, the competition is played off the green markers (we play off the whites on Saturday comps)

Why is this? Why is it not played off the whites and why do you get so many shots?

I played in another clubs comp yesterday and got 6 shots over the 9 holes.

Is it making it easier for people to get cut?

It seems to be a shorter course with a good deal of shots.

I know of a few people who have went from 13/14 handicap down to 10 from just playing 9 hole events. Every 18 holer they play they struggle to make buffer. And not to say its not possible, but their swings arent exactly that of a 10 handicapper.

 

[Siolag]

Maybe they can focus better for 9 and therefore play better.

Less chance of a card wrecker?

 

[Wolf]

Interesting topic as we also run weekly 9 hole qualifier (Tuesday thrash).

Each week the 9s are alternated between front & back. Managed a little 0.4 cut myself yesterday.

I think it depends on how the course is set up and the allocation of handicaps. I played with a guy yesterday off 9, going by S. I he should have had 5 shots but his card said allocation for the comp was 4 so he missed out a shot on the first hole where he'd normally get one. Not sure how this calculation was done but it's how the card was printed.

Also our front 9 generally plays a lot harder than the back 9 so winning scores on front half is normally around 18pts. Whereas on the back it's normally around 21/22pts. Ironically yesterday was front 9 week, I had 21pts & came 3rd only gaining a 0.4 cut. I think the reason for their introduction is to help people play more social golf in the week without taking up to much time.

 

[garyinderry]

Over all i would say yes its easier to get cut as it's a bit of sprint and doesn't require the player to hang on over the full 18 holes to post a score.

It doesn't carry the same mental pressure as keeping it going for a full round.


I played in a 9 hole comp at my place unintentionally or unbeknownst to me or my playing partners. It was a Saturday afternoon game. We signed in and played without checking what comp it was. Seeing it was stableford but missing the vital info that said 9 hole Q.
I played my best round of the year for 3 over. Posting something like 19 front and 22back.
Only got cut 0.2 and I seriously had to work hard on the back 9 to post that score.
Ther was a 18 hole non q running in conjunction. I ended up 4th and the 3 that lead the 9 hole comp were down the pack in the 18 hole comp.

 

[Lord Tyrion]

I'm a huge fan of 9 hole golf. I tried to get it introduced at my place but was soundly rejected. It is a big winner for people who have time pressures.

In terms of is it easier to get cut, yes if it is set up that way. Certainly I can concentrate better for 9 holes than 18 so the chance of a mid range cock up is reduced. However, surely there is a way to balance that?

 

[Grant85]

I'd say for higher handicappers it will probably be more of a chance of getting cut as they don't need to keep concentration for as long.

For lower guys, who are hoping to make 1 or 2 birdies a round to make up for a few bogeys - they would probably prefer 18 holers as it also gives them a chance to come back from a double bogey.

 

[Garush34]

In my experience no. We have just started these this year and I have played in a couple of them. I think for me I've went in expecting to score well because its only 9 holes, which is obviously the wrong thinking.

A few guys at the club always seem to be in the top 3 and have been getting a few cuts in the 9 hole format. So maybe it works for them. I like the general idea of 9 hole golf as its easy to get out and if you are lacking for time an easy way to get your cards in for handicap.

 

[Coffey]

Another interesting point is that it is not affected by any sort of CSS or difficulty of the day.

Ours is played over the front 8 holes and then up the 16th. If the wind blows a certain way you basically play 7 of the 9 holes into the wind and the scoring becomes around 2/3 shots worse. Basically 18 points would win if the wind blows that way and you need 21 or so if blowing the other way.

Yet this does not impact how many shots etc you get as this seems to be determined up front rather than seeing what scores are posted.

 

[Coffey]

I'd say for higher handicappers it will probably be more of a chance of getting cut as they don't need to keep concentration for as long.

For lower guys, who are hoping to make 1 or 2 birdies a round to make up for a few bogeys - they would probably prefer 18 holers as it also gives them a chance to come back from a double bogey.

But on the other side, my mate who plays off 3, gets all 3 shots over the 9 hole comp. He can easily knock it round in level par or even 1 or 2 over for the 9 holes and gets a good cut for his level.

Just needs 17 points to hit buffer playing off the shorter green tees.

 

[rosecott]

9 hole qualifying events have became very popular in NI over the last few years for mid week competitions. We actually run 2 per week across both our courses.

One thing I cannot understand is how the shots are allocated. I get that it is based on stroke indexes of the holes which are played yet in our 9 hole event. Playing off 10.1 I was getting 7 shots over the 9 holes!!

Add to this, the competition is played off the green markers (we play off the whites on Saturday comps)

Why is this? Why is it not played off the whites and why do you get so many shots?

I played in another clubs comp yesterday and got 6 shots over the 9 holes.

Is it making it easier for people to get cut?

It seems to be a shorter course with a good deal of shots.

I know of a few people who have went from 13/14 handicap down to 10 from just playing 9 hole events. Every 18 holer they play they struggle to make buffer. And not to say its not possible, but their swings arent exactly that of a 10 handicapper.

I'm starting to think that your competition/handicapping system is not properly set up. Our approved 9-hole SSSs are 2 less than the 18-hole SSS for the front 9 (shorter 9) and 1 less for the back 9. Using the conversion charts provided by England Golf, that means - for a handicap of 18.0 (exact handicap is used) - the player receives 8 strokes for a front 9 comp and 9 strokes for a back 9 comp. I would expect that to apply to any situation where the courses used are simply front 9 and back 9 - that you will get 1 less than half your handicap on the shorter 9 and exactly half your handicap on the longer 9.

I assume your green tees are shorter than your whites and they should have their own 9-hole SSSs. If players are getting more than half their handicap, there's something seriously wrong.

 

[Capella]

I would expect it to be a little bit easier from a statistical standpoint. At least int he EGA system (but I guess it is true for the Congu system as well) you are less likely to score 18+ points on 9 holes than you are to score 17 or less. So the fact that you basically get awarded 18 point for 9 holes you don't have to play should make things slightly easier.

Other things have already been mentioned: you don't need to concentrate for such a long time, fatigue might be less of a factor etc.

On the other hand a blobbed hole is more damaging if you only have 8 other holes to make up for it. If you tend to have a bit of a nervous start into a comp and generally struggle on the first one or two holes, you will find 9 hole comps a bit frustrating.

 

[Coffey]

I'm starting to think that your competition/handicapping system is not properly set up. Our approved 9-hole SSSs are 2 less than the 18-hole SSS for the front 9 (shorter 9) and 1 less for the back 9. Using the conversion charts provided by England Golf, that means - for a handicap of 18.0 (exact handicap is used) - the player receives 8 strokes for a front 9 comp and 9 strokes for a back 9 comp. I would expect that to apply to any situation where the courses used are simply front 9 and back 9 - that you will get 1 less than half your handicap on the shorter 9 and exactly half your handicap on the longer 9.

I assume your green tees are shorter than your whites and they should have their own 9-hole SSSs. If players are getting more than half their handicap, there's something seriously wrong.

That is interesting.

That is really my question, I cannot understand how it is done. Our 9 hole course is a separate course as it is 8 of the front 9 and 1 of the back 9. Albeit it is slightly more difficult based on stroke index. But as I said before, there is no sss or css. The par is 18 points. If you get 19 you get cut. If you get 17 you hit buffer, anything beneath that is .1 back. Even if everyone had 16 points, they would all get .1 back (buffer may change depending on handicap category but not sure as we are all cat 1 & 2)
On our other course, the comp was won with 14 points and everyone got .1 back

 

[Coffey]

I would expect it to be a little bit easier from a statistical standpoint. At least int he EGA system (but I guess it is true for the Congu system as well) you are less likely to score 18+ points on 9 holes than you are to score 17 or less. So the fact that you basically get awarded 18 point for 9 holes you don't have to play should make things slightly easier.

Other things have already been mentioned: you don't need to concentrate for such a long time, fatigue might be less of a factor etc.

On the other hand a blobbed hole is more damaging if you only have 8 other holes to make up for it. If you tend to have a bit of a nervous start into a comp and generally struggle on the first one or two holes, you will find 9 hole comps a bit frustrating.

Yeah I know what you mean.

I have started double double before and the round is basically over.

But then again, I am only 4 over through 2 and have 7 shots to play with. So it is recoverable

I have played about 5 times this year and only had a .1 once. Got cut 3 times and buffered once. I am sure if I only played 9 hole comps with the right wind I would be a lot lower

 

[jim8flog]

I am interested in those that say different 9s are used on different days.

To be a qualifier is has to be on designated officially rated 9 hole course.

Do the clubs that do this have two designated 9 hole courses?

Even when the comp is an 18 hole comp on our 9 hole course I would not be happy to have my handicap based upon the course because of how much easier the course is compared to our 18 course and their is only one shot difference in the SSS compared to par between the 9 and the 18 off yellows.

It is noticeable that when members transfer from the 9 to the 18 they struggle to play to their handicaps.

 

[rulefan]

That is interesting.

Our 9 hole course is a separate course as it is 8 of the front 9 and 1 of the back 9.

This should have been given a rating (SSS in old money) by EG for a "Designated 9 hole course" based on the rating data for the specific 9 holes used. Do you know if this has been done?

 

[Chris1980]

Our 9 hole qualifier (lisburn) you choose to play off greens or whites. If off Greens you take 3 off your handicap then half for your shots for the 9 (always front 9). If off the whites it's take 2 off your handicap then half. So at the moment I'm off 10.0 so i get 4 off both. I enjoy the 9 hole qualifiers as on a Friday can nip away for 2 hours.

 

[rulefan]

This extract from the CONGU manual may be helpful.

A ‘neutral’ 18 points for the nine holes not played is added to the nine-hole Stableford score to determine whether players have played within, or better than, their Buffer Zones.
For handicap purposes, when a player fails to return a score within their Buffer Zone the points accumulated over the nine holes played is doubled. This
provides a more realistic indication of ability for handicap review than the former practice of adding 18 points to the outside of Buffer Zone scores.

But see Clause 22 for a lot more detailed information re 9 hole competitions

 

[Coffey]

This should have been given a rating (SSS in old money) by EG for a "Designated 9 hole course" based on the rating data for the specific 9 holes used. Do you know if this has been done?

Ah this makes sense. I have just done some digging and see that the Par is set to 70 and SSS is set to 73. It then states that there is no CSS as it is a 9 hole comp.

It does say that handicapping is following CONGU 9 hole handicapping.

So I guess the course has been rated and is just rated 3 above par which would explain why we get so many shots.

Still find it strange that the SSS is so high considering it is off the greens

 

[rulefan]

Is the 18 hole green course rated for men? 73 sounds more like a ladies rating.

 

[Coffey]

Is the 18 hole green course rated for men? 73 sounds more like a ladies rating.

Yes it is, I believe SSS for the greens is 70, 71 off the whites. We have blues as well which i think is 73/74

Ladies tees are red and then we have yellow tees as well which match the distance of our smaller course. No idea what the SSS is for these