World Handicap System - FAQ’s

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

Yes to you last point.

Generally no to your first, because currently most operating that system run to a fixed adjustment point, either 2 weekly or monthly, so any change could incorporate a lot of scores!

I sort of understand where you are coming from with your subsequent post but would point out that in the first instance people won't all be changing courses, secondly this already exists to a degree when playing from different tees at the same course (and will even more going forward) and finally, you are correct that it won't actually make any difference!
In practice I anticipate things the other way round - the easy courses will be favoured because people will have their lowest playing handicap when playing them.

Not a comment on your observation - but that this will be what is going to happen is - in my opinion - just rubbish and not what handicap golf is about. I have a handicap means I have a handicap - and that handicap goes with me wherever I play. That's just how it is. From what I am starting to understand I am just hating the sound of the WHS...

 

[duncan mackie]

Not a comment on your observation - but that this will be what is going to happen is - in my opinion - just rubbish and not what handicap golf is about. I have a handicap means I have a handicap - and that handicap goes with me wherever I play. That's just how it is. From what I am starting to understand I am just hating the sound of the WHS...

It's the price of playing to par.

You will have a handicap index. What you actually play off will be a function of the course you are playing and the tees you are playing from.

Apart from rounding elements it's arguably a numbers exercise for a scratch golfer e.g. for a par 72 SSS 74 course he would play off 0 currently, and have his handicap adjusted relative to 74. Under the WGS he would play of 2 and have his handicap adjusted relative to 72 (I'm simplifying aspects but that's the fundamental difference. For an 18 handicap things are more complicated in order to make things fairer - if the course and tees had a lot of hazards that will threaten the average 18nhandicapper but be largely irrelevant to a scr golfer he may get more than 18 shots relative to the scr guy, and vice versa.

It will make a lot more sense when it all gets real - examples such as the above need a level of understanding to make them real!

 

[jusme]

Why all the concern. No great change in reality will take place. I tested 5 players to date and the biggest variance was a change of 0.4.

Hit the bleeding ball towards the hole

 

[mikejohnchapman]

It would be interesting to know if people using the new system have a clear grasp of it and if they know what their new handicap will be when they finish their round.

i.e. do you keep track of what your 'worst' score out of your best 8 are? Basically shoot better than this to lower your handicap.

Also do you know what your 20th oldest score is? Shoot the same as this to stay the same.

(these two could be the same)

It seems unlikely you would know these unless you were particularly diligent at keeping records.

also note the following from the R&A siite;

• An average-based calculation of a handicap, taken from the best eight out of the last 20 scores and factoring in memory of previous demonstrated ability for better responsiveness and control of p

​So in theory two players could have the same scores over the past 20 rounds, but if one had started out as an 8 handicapper, he/she could stay lower than someone who started out at 18 when they started the 20 rounds?

To your first point - you will never know when you complete your round as there may be an Adverse Weather Adjustment applied.

Speaking to people that use similar systems they usually say they don't bother to calculate their handicap index they just look it up on a relevant website or when they are signing in at their club.

 

[Grant85]

To your first point - you will never know when you complete your round as there may be an Adverse Weather Adjustment applied.

Speaking to people that use similar systems they usually say they don't bother to calculate their handicap index they just look it up on a relevant website or when they are signing in at their club.

Maybe we are a bit over obsessed with handicap.

 

[USER1999]

Maybe we are a bit over obsessed with handicap.

Exactly. It is just a number.

Unless you define your golfing happiness by this number, or, unless you use this number as an entry criteria to qualify for opens you want to play in.

 

[Orikoru]

Exactly. It is just a number.

Unless you define your golfing happiness by this number, or, unless you use this number as an entry criteria to qualify for opens you want to play in.

I think it's just nice to kind of understand what's going on with it. But largely I agree - playing the last few holes a certain way to guarantee this that and the other happens to your handicap seems like overthinking it to me. You just try and get it in in the fewest shots don't you?

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

I think it's just nice to kind of understand what's going on with it. But largely I agree - playing the last few holes a certain way to guarantee this that and the other happens to your handicap seems like overthinking it to me. You just try and get it in in the fewest shots don't you?

In the end yes - but how I go about it depends upon the competition, context and circumstances.

And so when I stand on our 16th tee I decide how I want to try and play the last three holes to meet that objective - and that, more often than not, will not require me to go for every shot - to go for par or birdie on each of the last three holes.

They are, in their own ways, three tough holes. Sometimes it is best to play them all conservatively, sometimes I need to play them all aggressively - and all points in between. And in a medal comp I always take into account where I am relative to what my buffer allows in respect of playing to my handicap - and I decide my strategy accordingly. A bit like playing bogey (against the course).

And in the context of the WHS I am just wondering how I'll make that same sort of assessment.

 

[Orikoru]

In the end yes - but how I go about it depends upon the competition, context and circumstances.

And so when I stand on our 16th tee I decide how I want to try and play the last three holes to meet that objective - and that, more often than not, will not require me to go for every shot - to go for par or birdie on each of the last three holes.

They are, in their own ways, three tough holes. Sometimes it is best to play them all conservatively, sometimes I need to play them all aggressively - and all points in between. And in a medal comp I always take into account where I am relative to what my buffer allows in respect of playing to my handicap - and I decide my strategy accordingly. A bit like playing bogey (against the course).

And in the context of the WHS I am just wondering how I'll make that same sort of assessment.

Yeah, you said, haha. But yeah it seems like it won't be easy to know what you need to do for your handicap to go up/down or stay the same.

Lucky for me I play our last few holes the same no matter what. i.e. try and get it on the fairway - try and get it on the green - try and get it in the hole.

 

[Grant85]

Exactly. It is just a number.

Unless you define your golfing happiness by this number, or, unless you use this number as an entry criteria to qualify for opens you want to play in.

It did actually for me.

I was previously embarrassed standing on the tee for a fourball and having to give out my handicap as 23+. I got down to 17 and was genuinely happier playing off a lower handicap, but it was a real struggle getting down to that level.

And obviously it didn't help me to win or play better as a 17 (and quickly an 18) handicapper.

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

Yeah, you said, haha. But yeah it seems like it won't be easy to know what you need to do for your handicap to go up/down or stay the same.

Lucky for me I play our last few holes the same no matter what. i.e. try and get it on the fairway - try and get it on the green - try and get it in the hole.

This is the impression that I am getting.

Given 95% of my golf is 'at home' all I need to do is know my 8th best qualifying round (or 9th if the 8th is last in the 20 round moving window) and as I approach end of a round at home I'll know what to do. What happens away from home I'll just let sort itself out.

 

[r0wly86]

Not a comment on your observation - but that this will be what is going to happen is - in my opinion - just rubbish and not what handicap golf is about. I have a handicap means I have a handicap - and that handicap goes with me wherever I play. That's just how it is. From what I am starting to understand I am just hating the sound of the WHS...

Isn't that the point as I understand it.

You have a handicap that is based primarily or solely for some at one course. Really all that tells us is your ability to play at that course.

Are all 5 handicappers equal? If you have a handicap of 5 and your home course is Carnoustie are you the same level golfer as the guy who has a 5 handicap at the very easy municipal around the corner.

The way I read is the WHS means that at whatever course you play you will get a number of shots that should be correct for that course off of those tees.

When I play St Mellion Nicklaus off the blacks I think I would need a couple more shots than when I'm playing a really easy course

 

[Slab]

Not a comment on your observation - but that this will be what is going to happen is - in my opinion - just rubbish and not what handicap golf is about. I have a handicap means I have a handicap - and that handicap goes with me wherever I play. That's just how it is. From what I am starting to understand I am just hating the sound of the WHS...

But don't you only need a handicap in golf (currently) because you're playing in a comp of some kind (otherwise what's the point of it, just record your gross score for any personal records)

And if its a comp why would you play a final three holes based on your performance to handicap over 15 holes, when the reality is you need to play them to the best of your ability that day against an opponent or field (could be three under or three over)
And if going for it/playing for par hasn't worked so far in the round why would it suddenly start working on 16

 

[duncan mackie]

Isn't that the point as I understand it.

You have a handicap that is based primarily or solely for some at one course. Really all that tells us is your ability to play at that course.

Are all 5 handicappers equal? If you have a handicap of 5 and your home course is Carnoustie are you the same level golfer as the guy who has a 5 handicap at the very easy municipal around the corner.

The way I read is the WHS means that at whatever course you play you will get a number of shots that should be correct for that course off of those tees.

When I play St Mellion Nicklaus off the blacks I think I would need a couple more shots than when I'm playing a really easy course

You are mixing things a little with the reference to are all 5 handicappers equal.

Under both systems the answer is the same - they should be.

Where the real difference comes in is, as you go on to say, when those 5 handicappers head off and play other golfers of different handicaps (with therefore different playing charecteristics). In very very simple terms it's more likely that any handicap difference will be increased as the course/tees have a higher rating.

The should be element has to exist because there is no escaping the fact that someone who regularily plays a course with any extreme of design will develop capability around that. Those capabilities may, or may not, have added value on any course visited over and above the course rating.

 

[cliveb]

Let's face it, we're probably all guilty of being aware of how the round we're playing is going to affect our handicap and possibly modifying our play accordingly.

If the WHS means we will no longer be able to do that, then perhaps we'll relax a bit and just play the way we ought to. Which IMHO is a good thing.

 

[patricks148]

You are mixing things a little with the reference to are all 5 handicappers equal.

Under both systems the answer is the same - they should be.

Where the real difference comes in is, as you go on to say, when those 5 handicappers head off and play other golfers of different handicaps (with therefore different playing charecteristics). In very very simple terms it's more likely that any handicap difference will be increased as the course/tees have a higher rating.

The should be element has to exist because there is no escaping the fact that someone who regularily plays a course with any extreme of design will develop capability around that. Those capabilities may, or may not, have added value on any course visited over and above the course rating.

Duncan, no one else has replied to this including the person who added the link, i presume as they don't know or don't get it.

the US link showed a conversion for handicap Vs slope and what your handicap would be on that slope.

I put in 3 different handicaps from my course slope, which is 134, current SSS is 73, par 71

Cat 1 get in more shot, which is suppose would be the same as buffer and before someone post there won't be a buffer, thats not what i'm asking its merely a comparison.
so a 5 handicap will play off 6

a cat 2 player will say off say off 8 will be off 9

a cat 3, say 13 off 15

both cat 2 and 3 are losing a shot compared to the current buffer to handicap.

so i'm reading this to play to their new handicap the are effectively losing a shot under the new system.


why is this?

 

[User 99]

Will this new handicap system make me a better player ? Thought not, oh well.

 

[rulefan]

Also unintended consequences...

Courses that are given a slope rating making it an 'easy' course could quickly fall out of favour as people may feel that is less deisreable to have that as their home course.

Slope does not tell you how easy or hard a course is. The Course Rating (CR - equivalent to SSS) does that.

Slope tells you the relative difficulty of the course for a bogey play as opposed to a scratch player.

It does not indicate actual difficulty

 

[mikejohnchapman]

Will this new handicap system make me a better player ? Thought not, oh well.

No but what it will do is give you a handicap that reflects the way you are currently playing rather than when you played well some time ago.

 

[duncan mackie]

Duncan, no one else has replied to this including the person who added the link, i presume as they don't know or don't get it.

the US link showed a conversion for handicap Vs slope and what your handicap would be on that slope.

I put in 3 different handicaps from my course slope, which is 134, current SSS is 73, par 71

Cat 1 get in more shot, which is suppose would be the same as buffer and before someone post there won't be a buffer, thats not what i'm asking its merely a comparison.
so a 5 handicap will play off 6

a cat 2 player will say off say off 8 will be off 9

a cat 3, say 13 off 15

both cat 2 and 3 are losing a shot compared to the current buffer to handicap.

so i'm reading this to play to their new handicap the are effectively losing a shot under the new system.


why is this?

I think my answer to the question you are asking is that the conclusion you are drawing is flawed.

I know you said earlier in the post that you were only using buffer as a comparison but all the arithmetic of buffer has been included in the new aversge calculation.

So the practical issue remains that as slope increases the higher handicap index players will get relatively more strokes.

If I've missed the point please explain and I will try harder!