WHS doesn't work

jim8flog

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This course is inland, tree-lined holes, many doglegs, usual amount of bunkers. I'm really struggling to see why the 110 slope rating.
Course rating seems to reflect overall length.

View attachment 46994


What I have noted from the overhead is reatively few bunkers (notably fairway ones ) greenside ones are always short front left and some holes do not have any bunkers.

there is only 0.2 difference between par and CR so it could be just one hole that adds the extra 0.2.
 

jim8flog

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Boring anecdote warning!

I got one of those 1 shot increases for 7 consecutive +0.1. Three scores missing the buffer by one or two shots in September, then 4 weekday nine-hole comps in October.
The 0.7 increase was enough to make me a bit of a bandit for the winter. The 1.7 increase was fantastic.
Won a medal the following April by 4 shots. Had the best gross score as well - next best gross was 6 shots behind. Got a 0.8 cut. Won the club championship later that year.
I had told the chairman of H&C that I would be happy for the 1 shot increase to be not applied. He decided it should and would be applied.


That actually sounds like the H/C committee did not use the flow chart.
 

AussieKB

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What I have noted from the overhead is reatively few bunkers (notably fairway ones ) greenside ones are always short front left and some holes do not have any bunkers.

there is only 0.2 difference between par and CR so it could be just one hole that adds the extra 0.2.
Yes, numerous doglegs and when you miss the fairway you are not on grass but dirt and sand, so normally in a depression and very hard to get good ball contact, quite a few of the greens are raised as well, also the kikuyu grass does not give you much run.
 

jim8flog

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Yes, numerous doglegs and when you miss the fairway you are not on grass but dirt and sand, so normally in a depression and very hard to get good ball contact, quite a few of the greens are raised as well, also the kikuyu grass does not give you much run.

Thanks for the guide.

Sounds a bit better than ours - miss our fairways and you could be in amongst the trees with only a side ways shot or a potential lost ball in the deep grass. Also we only have one hole without any bunkers. Slope rating yellow 124 white 128 CRs are less than par
 

clubchamp98

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These ratings (CR < Par, and Slope marginally above average) do not suggest a particularly tough course.
Could that possibly be part of the problem.
from just three numbers you can come up with a conclusion like that. Without playing the course.
The Raters must be accurate.
But my course suits a draw and a fader of the ball will find it harder.
 

rosecott

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Could that possibly be part of the problem.
from just three numbers you can come up with a conclusion like that. Without playing the course.
The Raters must be accurate.
But my course suits a draw and a fader of the ball will find it harder.

I would anticipate a scratch golfer having the ability to cope with that.
 

clubchamp98

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I would anticipate a scratch golfer having the ability to cope with that.
Yes I would to .
but I would think and would hope you think the same ,we do have courses that suit our eye .
this imo is generally because it suits our general shot shape.

a fader ,long hitter at mine would run out of fairway on a few holes and might have to hit less club.
but a drawer of the ball just bombs it down the apex of the corner.
so just an observation .

genuine question do course raters take shot shape into their calculations?
 

rulefan

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genuine question do course raters take shot shape into their calculations?
The system assumes all players will attempt to put their ball into their optimum 'landing area' with a straight shot regardless of their natural shape. The 'landing area' gets bigger as handicaps go up. It assumes that players do that 2/3 of the time. It does not take account of a player who deliberately plays a shot that he knows is 'not really on'.

It would be difficult to build a rating system which took into account the proportion of left handed slicers or hookers and right handed hookers and slicers of different handicap profiles who actually play the course. If the rating was 'biased' for right handed slicers, what would the rating be for left handed slicers playing the course in a open competition.
If players who have an extreme shape consistently have problems on their 'home' course it will be reflected in their handicap index. But in my experience most manage to adapt.

This may be thought of as a deficiency but I can't think of a workable alternative.
 

AussieKB

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We had a 47 handicapper win today, that really gladdens my heart not, I know we all have to start some where, but to be given this many shots is a joke in my opinion.
 

LincolnShep

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We had a 47 handicapper win today, that really gladdens my heart not, I know we all have to start some where, but to be given this many shots is a joke in my opinion.

What's the complaint? Do you have a problem with the player, or the organisers?

Should players with 17 handicaps be banned from competitions in case they beat someone off +3?

Handicap comps are won by players with handicaps.
 

AussieKB

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No problem then, let's raise handicaps to 100......then everyone will be happy.

just a question though, what was max handicap when you started ?

it was 24 for me....then went to 27 then 36 now 54......

hey don't get lessons we will just give you more handicap so you can win,
sounds like at school now, no winners just medals for competing
 

wjemather

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No problem then, let's raise handicaps to 100......then everyone will be happy.

just a question though, what was max handicap when you started ?

it was 24 for me....then went to 27 then 36 now 54......

hey don't get lessons we will just give you more handicap so you can win,
sounds like at school now, no winners just medals for competing
Handicaps are about inclusivity, and enabling players of different abilities to compete with one another on an equal footing.
Handicaps are not about winning, or favouring better players. If you are entering handicap competitions thinking otherwise, and treating them as anything other than a level-odds sweepstake or just a bit of competitive fun, far more often than not you are going to come away disappointed.
 

LincolnShep

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No problem then, let's raise handicaps to 100......then everyone will be happy.

just a question though, what was max handicap when you started ?

it was 24 for me....then went to 27 then 36 now 54......

hey don't get lessons we will just give you more handicap so you can win,
sounds like at school now, no winners just medals for competing

Do you have a problem with the player, or the organisers? If it's the latter, why did you enter a comp that allows 47 handicappers to enter?
 

Captain_Black.

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We had a 47 handicapper win today, that really gladdens my heart not, I know we all have to start some where, but to be given this many shots is a joke in my opinion.

How about anyone over 18 H/C has their own comp?
It could be called maybe the Choppers Trophy.
1st prize - golf lessons
2nd prize - a ball retriever
3rd prize - a calculator (to add up the huge score)
 
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