WHS doesn't work

[Backsticks]

From England Golf's original explanatory faqs before WHS came in :

Q: Do I have to record all scores?
A: Players should submit all singles competition scores and have the ability to pre-register and submit scores from social games played in accordance with the rules of golf. Accuracy of a player’s Handicap Index will be improved the greater the number of scorecards submitted.

 

[Orikoru]

You are equally saying that your handicap is lower than WHS is designed to have it. So you are disadvantaging yourself in hc competition (or flattering yourself with your HI as it is ?). I think it was bachache made the same observation, that his handicap would rise by submitting more rounds.
I think the problem arises where people take different attitudes to what they think the system should be. And so consistency is lost. Rather than playing it as written, whether agreeing or not with its basis, or disagreeing with what was a different basis in the past. A lot of clever people did a lot of statistics to come up with the WHS I would guess. Best to at least play it as written.

I'm not at all. I'm saying I don't play every round like it actually matters, nor would I want to. If I put every card in, I'd probably be one of the guys everyone else moans about for winning comps with 44 points off of 17 or something! I have put some non-comp cards in, but only when I feel like taking it seriously. Sometimes you just want to hack it round and not care. Once we get into winter I don't enter comps or submit any cards at all either, otherwise I'd just go up about 3 shots in time to clean up at the start of next summer - I don't really want to do it that way.

 

[IanM]

From England Golf's original explanatory faqs before WHS came in :

Q: Do I have to record all scores?
A: Players should submit all singles competition scores and have the ability to pre-register and submit scores from social games played in accordance with the rules of golf. Accuracy of a player’s Handicap Index will be improved the greater the number of scorecards submitted.

Change and Comms Bloke says, "Factual about process and contains no clear instruction about behaviour change!"

 

[Bdill93]

I'm not at all. I'm saying I don't play every round like it actually matters, nor would I want to. If I put every card in, I'd probably be one of the guys everyone else moans about for winning comps with 44 points off of 17 or something! I have put some non-comp cards in, but only when I feel like taking it seriously. Sometimes you just want to hack it round and not care. Once we get into winter I don't enter comps or submit any cards at all either, otherwise I'd just go up about 3 shots in time to clean up at the start of next summer - I don't really want to do it that way.

I'm basically the same mate - but ill let mine come up over winter - no way I play to 12 consistently when things get boggy!

 

[Orikoru]

I'm basically the same mate - but ill let mine come up over winter - no way I play to 12 consistently when things get boggy!

No, but if I'm also not entering comps then it doesn't really matter what the handicap is. Last winter I didn't put a card in from 4th Sept until 19th March. I am playing a comp this Saturday I think, if it's too wet after that that'll be it again probably.

 

[Bdill93]

No, but if I'm also not entering comps then it doesn't really matter what the handicap is. Last winter I didn't put a card in from 4th Sept until 19th March. I am playing a comp this Saturday I think, if it's too wet after that that'll be it again probably.

My mates would still gladly take the shots off me in matchplay so the only solution is submitting cards!

 

[jim8flog]

One of the points about handicapping in general (even pre WHS) is that you should only record an NR on the holes where you actually have one and in a general play card round that is the point where you would score zero points on a hole in a stableford comp with 100% allowance. The system will then give a nett double bogey for any such hole.

 

[rulefan]

When I’m king no adult will be allowed more than one shot per hole in any kind of competition.

And that will double the annual subs of the players that remain.

 

[jim8flog]

Following a question about PCC from a member I was checking how many players submitted General play cards on a couple of weekdays this month and both days had 40-50 players doing so.

 

[jim8flog]

So the handicap system is only supposed to work in divisions then?

We have always had divisions and there has always been (even pre WHS) a big difference between the winning scores in Div 3 compared to Div 1 in a stableford comp. So it could be argued that handicaps do not truly level up the field unless a players handicap is totally reflective of their ability which is easier to achieve under the WHS than it was under the UHC.
However as has already been said you will find many more improving golfers in the higher handicap divisions then in Div 1.

 

[IanM]

Our Phil is 56. Has played for 30 years. Handicap was 16 for years under the old system. He won the odd comp, had the odd disaster. Typical 16 Handicapper, could birdie every hole on the course, or could never see his drive again.

Well his course handicap is now 23. Hasnt done much in comps but has folk refusing to play him in Seniors Matches! He won one match on 10th green. His opponent got straight in the car after the walk back! There have been several 8&7s too. I'm certain he's trying his best in singles comps too.

That's golf. Now!

 

[Swinglowandslow]

Have to say I have a lot of sympathy with them . I really cannot be bothered with playing provisionals and holing everything out in a fun round of golf, just makes the round longer than necessary. I enjoy comps and am happy to play in them and enjoy causal golf much of which is matchplay. Just have zero interest in registering and putting in and messing around with cards for a quick casual game. Delighted that casual cards are allowed for those who wish but the idea that there is an obligation to do them is an anathema to me.

Excellently put. I play golf for fun. I also "try things" except in competitions.

 

[Swinglowandslow]

Our Phil is 56. Has played for 30 years. Handicap was 16 for years under the old system. He won the odd comp, had the odd disaster. Typical 16 Handicapper, could birdie every hole on the course, or could never see his drive again.

Well his course handicap is now 23. Hasnt done much in comps but has folk refusing to play him in Seniors Matches! He won one match on 10th green. His opponent got straight in the car after the walk back! There have been several 8&7s too. I'm certain he's trying his best in singles comps too.

That's golf. Now!

I know exactly what you mean. I play in the same way.

 

[sweaty sock]

Its crap. It inflates your handicap so quickly that as soon as form turns your on a winning position instantly. The fact divisions are needed to address the inequalities should be evidence enough. There are hc secs up and down the country trying to process hundreds of cards a week, with more encouraged, and a pcc that means difficult conditions are ignored. Its no wonder many have given up. Or are manually over riding the system.

A system so great that it needs teams of volunteers to over ride it every week.

Slow hand clap.

Lets take the handicap system thats used in a country known for its lack of comps and general disregard for handicap accuracy, and apply it to the country with the most comps and most stringently enforced handicapping system. What could possibly go wrong!

 

[IanM]

Your last paragraph is hard to argue with.

 

[jim8flog]

Its crap. It inflates your handicap so quickly that as soon as form turns your on a winning position instantly. The fact divisions are needed to address the inequalities should be evidence enough. There are hc secs up and down the country trying to process hundreds of cards a week, with more encouraged, and a pcc that means difficult conditions are ignored. Its no wonder many have given up. Or are manually over riding the system.

A system so great that it needs teams of volunteers to over ride it every week.

Slow hand clap.

Lets take the handicap system thats used in a country known for its lack of comps and general disregard for handicap accuracy, and apply it to the country with the most comps and most stringently enforced handicapping system. What could possibly go wrong!

The question I would ask is - Why are secretaries processing hundreds of cards a week? There are automatic processes and the advice from County is to only check a random few cards.

The system cannot inflate handicaps quickly as the hard and soft caps slow it down and there is a limit to increases in a calendar year.

 

[Steve Wilkes]

Everyone who doesn't like the WHS moans about what's wrong with it, but ignoring WHS what does everyone want from a handicap system and how do you realistically get to that point.

 

[Deleted member 29109]

Everyone who doesn't like the WHS moans about what's wrong with it, but ignoring WHS what does everyone want from a handicap system and how do you realistically get to that point.

They just want to go back to how things were. Some people just don’t like change.

 

[Backsticks]

The question I would ask is - Why are secretaries processing hundreds of cards a week? There are automatic processes and the advice from County is to only check a random few cards.

The system cannot inflate handicaps quickly as the hard and soft caps slow it down and there is a limit to increases in a calendar year.

It's easier to jump on the bandwagon and ride the hysteria.

More than WHS, I would think the culprit to some of the grievances was the removal of the 28hc cap.

WHS seems to be working perfectly from what I can see.

 

[nickjdavis]

More than WHS, I would think the culprit to some of the grievances was the removal of the 28hc cap.

Which, as we pretty much all know, even if it is often conveniently forgotten, happened well before WHS was introduced.