WHS doesn't work

[Swango1980]

That’s true but everyone knows the game is different with that card in your hand!
so the PCC should only affect those playing in the comp and should not be affected by someone just playing with their mates ,!
imo of course.

So, if you go out with your mates on a horrible windy day, shoot a decent score, you don't want the PCC to account for the fact your score is even better than it looks, due to the conditions?

 

[Deleted member 30522]

Maybe my first question was too vague but I'm genuinely interested in how multiple PCCs work. Is it :
a) It needs to be requested in advance of an event or
b) It needs to be requested once clear a PCC is not reflective of scores or
c) It's in the rules but there is not a mechanism to make it work or
d) Something else.

If a) then nobody knows how PCC works so a pre-emptive request is unlikely to happen. If b) then handicaps may change without people playing. If c) then it's a pointless rule.

In any event I fail to see how this works and is surely the best example of the thread title unless d) exists. I would really like to know how multiple PCCs work.

Thanks

You can't get separate PCCs, it's worked out from all scores that day, and the club can't do anything as it's worked out centrally, at least in Scotland, and as we're now using the same system as England then presumably same with you?

 

[nickjdavis]

That’s true but everyone knows the game is different with that card in your hand!
so the PCC should only affect those playing in the comp and should not be affected by someone just playing with their mates ,!
imo of course.

But the golfing authorities, starting from the idealistic point of view that all rounds should be submitted for handicap, would argue that all rounds under the new system are effectively "played with a card in your hand"...so there is no difference in "pressure"....so no need for separate GP/Comp PCC's.

 

[woofers]

That’s true but everyone knows the game is different with that card in your hand!
so the PCC should only affect those playing in the comp and should not be affected by someone just playing with their mates ,!
imo of course.

Errr, the PCC will only kick in if you submit the “playing with your mates” card as a General Play score, and in making that decision you’re playing to the same rules and regs as a competition….aren’t you?

 

[Deleted member 29109]

That’s true but everyone knows the game is different with that card in your hand!
so the PCC should only affect those playing in the comp and should not be affected by someone just playing with their mates ,!
imo of course.

Other than in people’s head because they think their monthly medal or captains day is a serious competition, it’s really not.

 

[clubchamp98]

Other than in people’s head because they think their monthly medal or captains day is a serious competition, it’s really not.

It is to them.
we can’t all be tour pros.

 

[clubchamp98]

So, if you go out with your mates on a horrible windy day, shoot a decent score, you don't want the PCC to account for the fact your score is even better than it looks, due to the conditions?

In a comp yes as your score counts in the comp.
just putting your card in means it’s just one of twenty?
that’s the difference for me

 

[clubchamp98]

Errr, the PCC will only kick in if you submit the “playing with your mates” card as a General Play score, and in making that decision you’re playing to the same rules and regs as a competition….aren’t you?

No.
in a comp your score counts.
GP card it’s just one of twenty.

 

[Imurg]

The comp, for handicapping purposes, is also 1 of your 20.
The only difference between a comp card and a GP card is that you might win something in the comp.....

 

[Swango1980]

In a comp yes as your score counts in the comp.
just putting your card in means it’s just one of twenty?
that’s the difference for me

Imurg pretty much said the same thing. But, your score in a competition counts towards your handicap just as much as the general round you submit when out with mates.

Let us say that you go out on a pretty poor day (weather wise), just after the last group in a competition, and shoot a good score. You are looking forward to a handicap cut. However, the cut is not as good as you hoped because PCC=0. Yet, the guys just in front of you, in the comp have a PCC=3. I suspect you might be might be complaining that the PCC=0 for you, even though you played in the same tough conditions. And, you'd be right to be irked.

 

[clubchamp98]

The comp, for handicapping purposes, is also 1 of your 20.
The only difference between a comp card and a GP card is that you might win something in the comp.....

Yes and there in lies the difference.
your three under par going down the last to win a major !
No pressure then? It’s just like playing with your mates , Not

 

[clubchamp98]

Imurg pretty much said the same thing. But, your score in a competition counts towards your handicap just as much as the general round you submit when out with mates.

Let us say that you go out on a pretty poor day (weather wise), just after the last group in a competition, and shoot a good score. You are looking forward to a handicap cut. However, the cut is not as good as you hoped because PCC=0. Yet, the guys just in front of you, in the comp have a PCC=3. I suspect you might be might be complaining that the PCC=0 for you, even though you played in the same tough conditions. And, you'd be right to be irked.

Not really as I think there is more pressure on you in a comp than just putting a card in for Hcap with your mates.


Just my opinion. But there is a difference!

 

[Imurg]

Yes and there in lies the difference.
your three under par going down the last to win a major !
No pressure then?

The pressure is what you make it..I play every round the same..I'm out to shoot the best score I can and it doesn't matter if it's a comp or a GP
3 under going down the last on a GP round and you'll be feeling some pressure to keep it under par..
Maybe not as much as if there's a big prize at stake but the pressure is still there.
I'd feel the same pressure going up the 18th at 3 under in a comp or in a GP.
It's Golf.

 

[Deleted member 15717]

Not really as I think there is more pressure on you in a comp than just putting a card in for Hcap with your mates.


Just my opinion. But there is a difference!

Only if that pressure comes from within. Competitions at clubs are effectively worth diddly squat and people big them up to be big. They aren't...they are just another round of golf.
It always made me chuckle when, for club champs, people would turn up an hour beforehand and have a full practice, which is completely different to their normal routine. You aren't going to find 'it' in that little bit of extra time.

They are all just a round of golf, writing 18 pretty random numbers down on a piece of paper.

 

[Swango1980]

Not really as I think there is more pressure on you in a comp than just putting a card in for Hcap with your mates.


Just my opinion. But there is a difference!

Pressure is just subjective.

Does that mean PCC should apply to the Club Champs but not the mid week Stableford? Does it depend on who we are talking about? One of the clubs best players may be under huge pressure in the Club Champs (or anyone competing for the Club Champs nett prize if applicable), whereas they'll have no concerns at all about a midweek Stableford, where you can just arrange to go out in your own groups

 

[Deleted member 29109]

Not really as I think there is more pressure on you in a comp than just putting a card in for Hcap with your mates.


Just my opinion. But there is a difference!

To you maybe. But materially there is no difference.

I know plenty of players who fall apart when playing in a medal. Why? Because most of the time they are playing stablefords with gimmies or they think that it’s a super important comp and they think they have some control over winning it or not.

Like some of the others have said. It makes no difference to me whether I’m playing 9 with the boy, the club champs of the knockout last Wednesday against last years winner. I treat them all the same.

 

[D-S]

Pressure is all created internally, however this doesn't mean that it can be just put aside.
If someone, for whatever reason takes a competition 'more seriously' they may well create more pressure on themselves.
For all the 'its just another round of golf' or 'I just go out and play' talk, if it is just so easy to treat every round the same, how come the Pros don't? The last round of a Major is exactly just another round but some Pros create more internal pressure than others.

 

[Swango1980]

Pressure is all created internally, however this doesn't mean that it can be just put aside.
If someone, for whatever reason takes a competition 'more seriously' they may well create more pressure on themselves.
For all the 'its just another round of golf' or 'I just go out and play' talk, if it is just so easy to treat every round the same, how come the Pros don't? The last round of a Major is exactly just another round but some Pros create more internal pressure than others.

This is all true.

But, in relation to handicaps, how do we account for pressure?

Perhaps the Score Differential will include the players heart rate (against their average heart rate) in the future. Then each competition will have a "pressure rating", which has an impact on the players course handicap.

Brainstorming here

 

[Deleted member 29109]

Pressure is all created internally, however this doesn't mean that it can be just put aside.
If someone, for whatever reason takes a competition 'more seriously' they may well create more pressure on themselves.
For all the 'its just another round of golf' or 'I just go out and play' talk, if it is just so easy to treat every round the same, how come the Pros don't? The last round of a Major is exactly just another round but some Pros create more internal pressure than others.

Pros are playing for their job (and a lot of money) and a place in history for the biggest tournaments.

I do feel the butterflies if I’m on to shoot my best score. But that’s excitement more than nerves. I enjoy the competitive nature of match play.

I just don’t get why some people soil themselves playing in a weekly club comp. It genuinely baffles me why some elevate a comp for a few quid of shop credit to such a level they fall apart. Especially when you have a no control over the outcome l. You can have the best round of your life and still not win. And that’s before you consider how many of those you are competing against are probably playing to a completely different set of rules to you.
It’s just not worth getting worked in a tizz about.

That’s my opinion, fine if it’s not yours.

 

[D-S]

Well as EG are saying that players with more than 4 GP scores on their records and where the GP vs Competition rounds show more than a 2 shot average difference cannot enter their elite tournaments - then they clearly think there is a difference in GP reflecting true golfing ability in competition.
Either that or they are tacitly accusing players with such records of ‘manipulating’ their handicaps.