clubchamp98
Journeyman Pro
Yes the 95% should be variable depending on the field make up.
But the way it’s going we would all need a math degree to work it out.
WHS - current GM article
- Thread starter Teebs
- Start date
But the way it’s going we would all need a math degree to work it out.
Speak for yourself...my golf's good, it's the company that's lousy...
You love him really
Even if he is the better golfer
clubchamp98
Journeyman Pro
Imurg
The Grinder Of Pars (Semi Crocked)
You love him really
IanM
Journeyman Pro
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clubchamp98
Journeyman Pro
See post #279.
clubchamp98
Journeyman Pro
Yes but we might just learn something if any evidence is put forward."Discussion" implies some listening and digesting takes place
Sadly it’s a secret!
Ssshhh! If they tell you, they’ll have to kill you…
Nobody has to work out or understand anything. Just type in your score.
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clubchamp98
Journeyman Pro
This is what I mainly do.
But you must concede that some people take their golf handicap seriously and therefore might want to understand it.
Thats not to much to ask for is it.?
Keeping it a secret just fuels the scepticism.
Voyager EMH
Slipper Wearing Plucker of Pheasants
I don't hand in any general play scores.
My observation (anecdotal, sorry) of those that do has made me realise one important difference for the very low handicappers that do so.
For general play scores they have a choice. Weather and course conditions both good - hand in a score. Conditions unfavourable - don't register for a general play score.
For elite competition play - Compulsory to play whatever the weather and course conditions.
It would not surprise me to see a lower average to their general play scores.
How to assess when this difference is "unreasonable" ? Yet again, I feel, no perfect way of doing so.
This is not a fault of WHS.
My observation (anecdotal, sorry) of those that do has made me realise one important difference for the very low handicappers that do so.
For general play scores they have a choice. Weather and course conditions both good - hand in a score. Conditions unfavourable - don't register for a general play score.
For elite competition play - Compulsory to play whatever the weather and course conditions.
It would not surprise me to see a lower average to their general play scores.
How to assess when this difference is "unreasonable" ? Yet again, I feel, no perfect way of doing so.
This is not a fault of WHS.
wjemather
Well-known member
I summarised this in #250.
Yes, I am suggesting the same, thats why I would consider many low HIs are vanity-lite ones.
Captain_Black.
Well-known member
It's obvious to everyone (with the exception of a very few) that WHS has major flaws & heavily favours higher handicappers.
Regardless of claims by some that the (hidden) data says otherwise, we can all see with our own eyes the issue.
I have no doubt that the authorities are fully aware (as we are) of the issues & they will in time have to address it.
But, there is no way back unfortunately & they are being very slow to react to the problems.
I have no doubt that they are being deluged with complaints, it cannot be right that any system is skewed against better players.
Some have said, just introduce divisions.
But that only elevates the problem to a degree, it doesn't solve the problem when a board comp is concerned.
Another temporary fix, which I think some clubs will have to look at, is to run comps with a cut limit.
We run 2 or 3 of these per year.
The club champs usually have a cut limit of 12 & they also run a Senior Stableford with a cut limit of 13.
Until the authorities come up with a viable fix to the issues, this is probably the way forward, as at the moment we are getting into a situation whereby the lower handicappers just aren't competing, which is a shame for them & not really what club golf should be about.
Regardless of claims by some that the (hidden) data says otherwise, we can all see with our own eyes the issue.
I have no doubt that the authorities are fully aware (as we are) of the issues & they will in time have to address it.
But, there is no way back unfortunately & they are being very slow to react to the problems.
I have no doubt that they are being deluged with complaints, it cannot be right that any system is skewed against better players.
Some have said, just introduce divisions.
But that only elevates the problem to a degree, it doesn't solve the problem when a board comp is concerned.
Another temporary fix, which I think some clubs will have to look at, is to run comps with a cut limit.
We run 2 or 3 of these per year.
The club champs usually have a cut limit of 12 & they also run a Senior Stableford with a cut limit of 13.
Until the authorities come up with a viable fix to the issues, this is probably the way forward, as at the moment we are getting into a situation whereby the lower handicappers just aren't competing, which is a shame for them & not really what club golf should be about.
Not really. Any sceptics are an insignificantly miniscule portion of golfers. You could get most golfers to take an interest in handicap calculation, PCC, the statistics of handicap adjustment for field equality, etc, even if you paid them.
clubchamp98
Journeyman Pro
Yes you did but you still think balloting out players with to many GP cards in a ballot is still not the policy.
clubchamp98
Journeyman Pro
Yes it is. Imo.
It facilitates unlimited GP cards.
Didnt the old system have a limit on them to cat1 players
That was there for a reason , I wonder why that was changed?
cliveb
Head Pro
IMHO WHS is actually a pretty good way to track your current form, certainly better than UHS was. The thrust of this thread seems to be that people are concerned that handicaps are being manipulated. Perhaps the way WHS works makes it easier to manipulate one's HI. But let's be realistic - any handicapping system that isn't rigourously enforced by official observers accompanying players on all counting rounds will be vulnerable to manipulation. But of course that's not feasible. So some players will choose to manipulate it. Therefore "fair competition" in handicapped events is pretty much unachievable.
I'm not a good golfer (currently 14.9) and I treat this game as me against the course. I use HI as a moderately objective way to measure my own progress (or lack thereof). I don't care what others' HI is. When I enter comps, getting in the prizes is not the goal (although I'll admit it's a nice bonus). And when someone comes in with a ridiculous score, the inevitable chorus of "bandit" around the clubhouse is just good natured banter. Nobody is genuinely outraged - not at my club, anyway.
If serious golfers want fair competition, just enter scratch events.
I'm not a good golfer (currently 14.9) and I treat this game as me against the course. I use HI as a moderately objective way to measure my own progress (or lack thereof). I don't care what others' HI is. When I enter comps, getting in the prizes is not the goal (although I'll admit it's a nice bonus). And when someone comes in with a ridiculous score, the inevitable chorus of "bandit" around the clubhouse is just good natured banter. Nobody is genuinely outraged - not at my club, anyway.
If serious golfers want fair competition, just enter scratch events.
Depreston
Club Champion
Two of my mates both off 3 played in a pairs open better ball and they were about 7 under between them
Think they finished 5th
I’m not sure what the answer is for low handicappers at club level think the only comps won by a low capper this year were the handicap 2 rounder and club champs
Think they finished 5th
I’m not sure what the answer is for low handicappers at club level think the only comps won by a low capper this year were the handicap 2 rounder and club champs
wjemather
Well-known member
That is because that is not the policy.
The policy is to refuse entries to players whose handicap records show a significant discrepancy between their gp and comp score differentials. It is not a limit on the number of gp scores a player can have. In the absence of any significant discrepancy, 4 (or more) gp scores is acceptable for entry.
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