What is a fair suspension ?

[Chico84]

Have you considered contacting The President and saying we both may have done/ said things in haste which we both have later regret.

Explain you were out of order for what you said but in the heat of the moment and apologise. Explain what you want from the situation and want an amicable resolution.


Also you do not want to leave the Club, if this is the case, and try and offer an olive branch, perhaps through gritted teeth.

Somebody has to make the first move and if there is no movement/ attempt to meet halfway you have done your best and then consider your options after you have explained your position

This is far too sensible a suggestion

 

[Green Bay Hacker]

I might have missed it but why was the president the recipient of the irate email?

Surely the president is just a figurehead at the club and it is the main committee that make the decisions and take the flak or am I just basing that on my own club.

 

[clubchamp98]

I might have missed it but why was the president the recipient of the irate email?

Surely the president is just a figurehead at the club and it is the main committee that make the decisions and take the flak or am I just basing that on my own club.

Good question.
He might be chair of comittiee. Or he was the one delivering the brush off over the legal advice.

 

[Springveldt]

Golf Is all about integrity and honesty, it’s what the game is built on...

So let’s question the presidents integrity and honesty by calling him a liar in colourful terms and see what happens.

Just because he's a president doesn't make him immune from "stretching the truth". Just need to look no further than that orange buffoon across the pond.

 

[Blue in Munich]

I might have missed it but why was the president the recipient of the irate email?

Surely the president is just a figurehead at the club and it is the main committee that make the decisions and take the flak or am I just basing that on my own club.

See one of the OP's posts below, should explain it.

Not quite. I was merely responding to what was generally accepted was an aggressive email from the club saying everybody had to pay during lock down which they received a lot of complaints about. I had a zoom call with the President and Club general manager ( very civil) when they told me that the reason why they had sent out the email was they had a bona fida letter from a lawyer saying they could. All I did was ask to see the letter. I never suggested I wasn't going to pay just wanted clarification as to how they had arrived at believing we had no option but to pay.

 

[3offTheTee]

The club have already suspended him, what's the point of any of that?
They'll just say thanks, see you when your suspension ends.

Trami

He will never know if he does not try. It all depends on what he wants and what the Club wants. They will not wish to have the publicity, possibly local paper.

The president may regret how things have evolved. It has been said there are always 2 sides to most disputes and if he has tried everything possible to resolve the situation he will come out with his head held high.


We all react differently to situations; from my experience I feel that is a preferable option.

 

[Ross61]

Have you considered contacting The President and saying we both may have done/ said things in haste which we both have later regret.

Explain you were out of order for what you said but in the heat of the moment and apologise. Explain what you want from the situation and want an amicable resolution.


Also you do not want to leave the Club, if this is the case, and try and offer an olive branch, perhaps through gritted teeth.

Somebody has to make the first move and if there is no movement/ attempt to meet halfway you have done your best and then consider your options after you have explained your position

The OP has already stated in an earlier post:

“I did try to keep it civil but it was escalated on both sides. I apologised for what i said in a private email. There was disrespect on both sides.”

 

[Robster59]

What an interesting thread. I think that each club has their own rules about how to deal with disciplinary procedures, they have their own constitutions and management structure as to who makes the decisions but here's my thoughts, for what they're worth.

• If it is a members club, and the club say they have taken legal advice about paying the membership, and use that for coercing/forcing/demanding the members pay their membership, then I would say the members have the right to have that advice shared with them.
• The OP hasn't really done themselves any favours by getting personal/abusive and calling the integrity of the President into question. And in writing. That's an example of where my old boss would write an email, save it, and then come back the next day to see if he still wanted to send it. Often he didn't.
• The President sounds like he is being thin-skinned. When I was Vice Captain, a member wanted to see us about a dispute he had. I explained part of the situation to him and he pretty much called me a liar. I let it by as I knew he was annoyed he wasn't getting his way (he was in the wrong btw) and was trying to get a rise out of me. I certainly wouldn't have banned him for three months.
• By the sound of it the club haven't handled it well in what they have done either. Call you in and show you the document, or give you the chance to apologies, or just talk it over.
• We have had to call people in for infringements, some of which I would say have been worse than the OP but in most instances the individual has know what they have done has been wrong and it was left at that. In one instance there could almost certainly have been a ban but he showed contrition so it was simply a warning.
• At the end of the day, if you have an issue, there are ways to handle it. Making inflammatory and unfounded allegations then you really have to expect a reaction. Maybe that's what you were after but just didn't expect the reaction you got.

 

[NeilG]

It's nothing to do with letting people walk all over me. It's about understanding what is best for me in the long-run - putting aside any short-term satisfaction I might get...

A few years I was moved off an assignment (I was effectively sacked from that assignment) and the rationale of the boss responsible was I felt to be extremely unfair and unmerited. Indeed it seemed to me at the time that the impact of being 'sacked' would be very significant and that as well as the extreme upset I felt, I considered that I had to leave the company. I spoke with the HR Director and she agreed that the way the situation was handled was unacceptable - and she agreed that I had grounds for going down the constructive dismissal route. However I reflected on the implications of doing so. On how going through such a process would impact me personally and my family, and what would I benefit from doing so - and by leaving the company.

In the end I decided to take on board the criticisms and understand my part in what had happened - because the victim of such an injustice often has had a part to play, even though that part might be tiny and not justify what happened. I just accepted being 'sacked' and put it behind me. I was able to move to another part of the company and just got on with life. I hold no resentments whatsoever against the boss who 'sacked' me - because I did not pursue retribution. And in the years since, my company has been extremely supportive to me through some very difficult personal times.

If someone chooses to walk over me and I can do little or nothing to prevent that, then I can, through acceptance and other means, find the strength that means there is no impact on me beyond the knowledge that someone has felt they have gained something - but I have not suffered any long term damage or built up any resentments or guilt - and can get on with life.

Some really good advice in this. Sometimes we can get fixated on proving that we were in the right, when that isn't always the optimum route to follow.

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

The club have already suspended him, what's the point of any of that?
They'll just say thanks, see you when your suspension ends.

As @3offTheTee says - that ain't necessarily so...

We can all, at times, forget our part in any disagreement or conflict - and sometimes it really helps if look at our part - not the part of the other party - and with some humility admit our fault to the other party. It is then up to the other party to decide whether or not to do likewise - but unless someone takes a lead (and I suggest that that's unlikely to be the club) then nothing will happen. And the wound will fester and the pain, resentments and anger will worsen.

Just my experience.

 

[Swango1980]

Yes I see your point.
But the President should quieten him by proving he wasn’t lying instead of using his mates on the comittiee to get rid of his accuser.
That’s what Dictators do.

Member gets into heated argument with President of club. Member gets suspended by club (regardless if the Committee are mates, they are probably voted into that Committee by members and ultimately feel the member over stepped the mark, and are not bothered if they never rejoin again). Member takes club to court. Member goes online to give his version of events, initially naming club, potentially harming their reputation.

Now, perhaps members at this club are about to revolt against a terrible Committee and nasty President. However, I have my suspicions that this is a particular member that most clubs would rather was not at their club.

So, I think it is harsh for anyone to assume the President is some sort of Dictator (not all Presidents are like Trump)

But, I agree, I'm loving the drama

 

[Neil Grice]

Is it possible it might not even be as straightforward as a win or lose for either side

Depending on what particular act/incident the member was suspended for the suspension itself might be totally warranted, even if its then found as part of a suspension they are/are not liable for fees

Private exchange or not if I were on the receiving end of someone swearing at me and calling me a liar in my capacity as a committee member (which is an assumption by me to explain the OP saying; ‘suggesting he hadn’t told the truth using colourful language’) It’d then come down to:

1. If I was also swearing/insulting etc then its all fair, can't really suspend the bloke
2. If I wasn’t swearing/insulting then a 3 month (mostly off season) suspension isn’t OTT

Regardless of whether a document exists people can’t just say/do what they like and not expect repercussions if they choose to fling insults around. Fortunately as it was by email it’ll be easy to see if it’s just the OP (which he's admitted to) or if both are at fault[/QUO

It certainly seems that the majority on here have decided that the OP's version of events is the unalloyed truth. Personally I prefer to hear both sides of the story before condemning the Committee.

What is clear is that many think it OK to criticise Committee members in quite colourful terms whilst happily posting on a forum where open criticism of Moderators and their rulings is rightly prohibited.

Is that not clear double standards?

I am absolutely adamant that the clubs side should be heard before decisions are made. I named the club in the hope of getting some feedback as currently my dispute is being hushed up and i suspect many members don't know the club is being sued. The club are currently refusing to even confirm my ban will be lifted as at 1st Oct when it is up.

 

[Siolag]

I am absolutely adamant that the clubs side should be heard before decisions are made. I named the club in the hope of getting some feedback as currently my dispute is being hushed up and i suspect many members don't know the club is being sued. The club are currently refusing to even confirm my ban will be lifted as at 1st Oct when it is up.

You are taking the club to court and are also hoping that your suspension will be lifted? Have you informed the club that this is the route you are taking? If so, then are you really expecting to be back there any time soon?

 

[Slab]

I am absolutely adamant that the clubs side should be heard before decisions are made. I named the club in the hope of getting some feedback as currently my dispute is being hushed up and i suspect many members don't know the club is being sued. The club are currently refusing to even confirm my ban will be lifted as at 1st Oct when it is up.

You say 'hushed up' but might they be maintaining a silence only because you’re taking a legal route, Is it not the correct thing for them to do under those circumstances so that they don’t compromise proceedings with ongoing fruitless discussions ?

 

[Jacko_G]

Why are so many people on here blowing smoke up the backside of the "president". They're just a person at a golf club not someone to be in awe of in any shape or form.

Can't wait to come in from work tonight to pick up on the latest twists and drama's of GM SuspensionGate!!!!

 

[Swango1980]

Why are so many people on here blowing smoke up the backside of the "president". They're just a person at a golf club not someone to be in awe of in any shape or form.

If they act and conduct themselves as a tit - treat them like a tit. (basing on the fact that I read the "president" sent derogatory remarks also)

Can't wait to come in from work tonight to pick up on the latest twists and drama's of GM SuspensionGate!!!!

Who is blowing smoke up his backside? Some are just saying, maybe, just maybe, he is not actually a tit!?

 

[Jacko_G]

Who is blowing smoke up his backside? Some are just saying, maybe, just maybe, he is not actually a tit!?

Perhaps.

 

[Neil Grice]

Member gets into heated argument with President of club. Member gets suspended by club (regardless if the Committee are mates, they are probably voted into that Committee by members and ultimately feel the member over stepped the mark, and are not bothered if they never rejoin again). Member takes club to court. Member goes online to give his version of events, initially naming club, potentially harming their reputation.

Now, perhaps members at this club are about to revolt against a terrible Committee and nasty President. However, I have my suspicions that this is a particular member that most clubs would rather was not at their club.

So, I think it is harsh for anyone to assume the President is some sort of Dictator (not all Presidents are like Trump)

But, I agree, I'm loving the drama

Not sure i can agree i have been a loyal member of 4 years never any trouble. I just don't like secrecy or bullies and feel I should stand up to them. it is a members club not the Presidents. Have currently spent over £2000 on this and likely £2k more to get to court . I see this as a principled stance on a honest question. I don't see myself as a trouble maker but also i am not going to role over and see the club managed in this way.

 

[Neil Grice]

Have you considered contacting The President and saying we both may have done/ said things in haste which we both have later regret.

Explain you were out of order for what you said but in the heat of the moment and apologise. Explain what you want from the situation and want an amicable resolution.


Also you do not want to leave the Club, if this is the case, and try and offer an olive branch, perhaps through gritted teeth.

Somebody has to make the first move and if there is no movement/ attempt to meet halfway you have done your best and then consider your options after you have explained your position

Already done I agreed to drop my complaint against his attack on me. He refused and insisted on the complaint being dealt with.

 

[Neil Grice]

You are taking the club to court and are also hoping that your suspension will be lifted? Have you informed the club that this is the route you are taking? If so, then are you really expecting to be back there any time soon?

I have served my suspension all 3 months of it.In full. I am going to court on there refusal to issue the legal advice they claim to have . As a members club we are entitled to see this. I am also going to court over being forced to pay fees whilst suspended which we believe to be illegal as is the suspension as it was meted out by what everyone even the club now agree was a unfair process.