USPGA course

[Blue in Munich]

The ones I'd most want to play are not Tour stops; Cypress Point, The National Golf Links & Pine Valley.

Tour stops, any of Shinnecock Hills, Merion, Winged Foot, The Country Club, Sawgrass, Pinehurst No. 2, Whistling Straits, Pacific Dunes, Pebble Beach & Spyglass Hill; if pushed to just one of those then probably Pinehurst.

Alternatively if any Southern Hemisphere events are co-sanctioned with the US PGA Tour then Royal Melbourne, Kingston Heath or Lake Karrinyup please.

Just waiting for Glyn to get his finger out & sort it...

 

[Grizzly]

Never thought to consider the quality of courses before, so I just looked at the PGA tour calender. Its not that bad guys - the run January- the Masters is actually mostly pretty good in my opinion, thereafter just a bit samey. TPC Scottsdale would be fun, and Pebble Beach is on most people's bucket lists - though Muirfield and Colonial would be my picks.

 

[Springveldt]

As someone else said, Trinity Forest would be my pick just because it's a bit different to most PGA stops. Pity they are moving away from it after this year.

 

[Trapdraw]

Pine Valley and Cypress Point if only you could get the chance to play them, one can only dream though.

 

[Grant85]

Also, on a wider point they are going to keep moving further and further away from the types of courses that amateurs would enjoy playing.

I guess this is just out of necessity to control the scoring and make the tournaments enough of a test to show them having a challenge of some kind.

It seems in America there is a big culture of regular guys wanting to turn up and 'play from the tips' and it is a big business model is for courses to get on the tour, get a presence and then charge chunky visitor green fees. I guess it is human nature to an extent that golfers obviously want to turn up at Torrey Pines or Bethpage Black and play the most challenging golf imaginable to them and see if they can have a great round and shoot something respectable. I certainly wouldn't enjoy that, and def not on a regular basis.

Obviously length is one thing, but thick and heavy rough where you can easily lose a ball slows down the game and personally is not enjoyable to me as a handicap golfer. More and more venues have to incorporate both to remain tour stops.

Saw a bit of the Dubai event over the weekend and the fairways had been brought in to slivers with thick rough and no opportunity for a wide shot to run further wide into desert. And in Dubai, and California for that matter, it must cost them a fortune in water. For me these set ups hugely favours the bombers, as in those conditions even the shorter hitters are missing most fairways, but they are 20 yards further back hitting out of the rough with a 6 iron rather than a 9 iron.

Def want to see more variance in courses where scoring can be controlled with tapering of fairways and bunkers can be moved / added to catch the longer hitters as often as the shorter hitters, and for fairway bunkers to be more of a penalty with higher lips so that pros think twice about taking them on.

 

[clubchamp98]

Also, on a wider point they are going to keep moving further and further away from the types of courses that amateurs would enjoy playing.

I guess this is just out of necessity to control the scoring and make the tournaments enough of a test to show them having a challenge of some kind.

It seems in America there is a big culture of regular guys wanting to turn up and 'play from the tips' and it is a big business model is for courses to get on the tour, get a presence and then charge chunky visitor green fees. I guess it is human nature to an extent that golfers obviously want to turn up at Torrey Pines or Bethpage Black and play the most challenging golf imaginable to them and see if they can have a great round and shoot something respectable. I certainly wouldn't enjoy that, and def not on a regular basis.

Obviously length is one thing, but thick and heavy rough where you can easily lose a ball slows down the game and personally is not enjoyable to me as a handicap golfer. More and more venues have to incorporate both to remain tour stops.

Saw a bit of the Dubai event over the weekend and the fairways had been brought in to slivers with thick rough and no opportunity for a wide shot to run further wide into desert. And in Dubai, and California for that matter, it must cost them a fortune in water. For me these set ups hugely favours the bombers, as in those conditions even the shorter hitters are missing most fairways, but they are 20 yards further back hitting out of the rough with a 6 iron rather than a 9 iron.

Def want to see more variance in courses where scoring can be controlled with tapering of fairways and bunkers can be moved / added to catch the longer hitters as often as the shorter hitters, and for fairway bunkers to be more of a penalty with higher lips so that pros think twice about taking them on.

We played Orange County National in Florida couple of years ago.
The week before Frank Lictlighter had shot 27 under in the tour Q school.
So Billy big time all single figure two scratch we decided to play the tips 7400 yds.
Absolute disaster we couldn’t even reach the par fours in two.
We decided never to play anything over 6500 yds on our hols.
7400 yds in damp morning conditions is just another game???
Not for me!

 

[Grant85]

We played Orange County National in Florida couple of years ago.
The week before Frank Lictlighter had shot 27 under in the tour Q school.
So Billy big time all single figure two scratch we decided to play the tips 7400 yds.
Absolute disaster we couldn’t even reach the par fours in two.
We decided never to play anything over 6500 yds on our hols.
7400 yds in damp morning conditions is just another game???
Not for me!

Absolutely. I play a decent track as my members club, but its still only 6100 yards, par 70 and is fairly forgiving off the tee.

For the par 72s, add on a few hundred.

But a tight 7,000+ yarder is not going to be much fun. Even for a scratch golfer who can get his drives out there. He probably got to scratch playing a 6,400 yard par 72 where he can reduce most par 4s to a sub-100 yard par 3 with a decent drive.

 

[Deleted member 1147]

Absolutely. I play a decent track as my members club, but its still only 6100 yards, par 70 and is fairly forgiving off the tee.

For the par 72s, add on a few hundred.

But a tight 7,000+ yarder is not going to be much fun. Even for a scratch golfer who can get his drives out there. He probably got to scratch playing a 6,400 yard par 72 where he can reduce most par 4s to a sub-100 yard par 3 with a decent drive.

Unlikely, as the shorter par 72 courses probably have lower standard scratch, whereas a long slog of a course will likely have SSS over par.

My track is 6,700 off the whites - par 72, SSS 73,
the blues are 7,000 - par 70, SSS 74

If a scratch player goes round in level par or a couple over (which is perfectly likely) they have played under SSS

 

[Deleted member 1147]

Absolutely. I play a decent track as my members club, but its still only 6100 yards, par 70 and is fairly forgiving off the tee.

For the par 72s, add on a few hundred.

But a tight 7,000+ yarder is not going to be much fun. Even for a scratch golfer who can get his drives out there. He probably got to scratch playing a 6,400 yard par 72 where he can reduce most par 4s to a sub-100 yard par 3 with a decent drive.

7,000 divided by 18 = 388.88 yards per hole on average - which isn't long by any means.

So take out say 800 yds for a few par 3s, and add them to some par 4's and par 5's it's very manageable for most decent ball strikers.

What is important is good design - for example only one of our really long/tough par 4's is down wind (assuming the prevailing wind), all of the other long ones of 430, 460, 440, 450 are down wind. So on a normal day they don;t seem too long. It's when the wind switches direction that it can get really difficult, length wise.

 

[garyinderry]

It's been said that you should be playing a course that is the length your 5iron goes x36 .

 

[Deleted member 1147]

It's been said that you should be playing a course that is the length your 5iron goes x36 .

Never heard of that before - but it works pretty well.

200yd 5 irons gives 7,200
180yds gives 6,500
150yds gives 5,400

 

[Orikoru]

Sawgrass, so I can have the pleasure of shanking a PW into the lake on the 17th.

 

[Orikoru]

It's been said that you should be playing a course that is the length your 5iron goes x36 .

My 5 iron goes nowhere, it's sat in the cupboard.

 

[patricks148]

My 5 iron goes nowhere, it's sat in the cupboard.

depends if its a links or parkland cupboard

 

[Grant85]

7,000 divided by 18 = 388.88 yards per hole on average - which isn't long by any means.

So take out say 800 yds for a few par 3s, and add them to some par 4's and par 5's it's very manageable for most decent ball strikers.

What is important is good design - for example only one of our really long/tough par 4's is down wind (assuming the prevailing wind), all of the other long ones of 430, 460, 440, 450 are down wind. So on a normal day they don;t seem too long. It's when the wind switches direction that it can get really difficult, length wise.

Yes - design is very important, albeit length has an intimidation factor that works at all levels of golf.

At handicap level, it's obviously important to have a course that is accessible for high handicapper but also a challenge for low guys. Which I think in the main the vast majority of members club will be set up to do.

Also if the higher guys really care about scoring, then they have to learn to use their shots on tougher / longer courses. The chances of them making a par on a 460 yard par 4 are remote, but so many players (even mid handicappers) will be trying to pound a 3 wood from 250 yards out, and risk bringing all kinds of numbers into play. In reality, 250 yards is an easy par 4 - 7 iron, wedge, 2 putts (easy 5).