The SNIP

[Hobbit]

Should they not have another referendum though ? Since the last one circumstances have changed dramatically for the UK and it’s going in another direction - so it’s prob right to ask Scotland if they want to carry on being part of the Union or they want to break out on their own

Surely as a very ardent supporter of Independance from the EU for the UK you would ( and indeed anyone who voted to leave ) be very much supportive of the desire for a referendum for Scotland and indeed Wales and NI if they so wish and they if they voted to leave the UK be right behind them all the way

As a supposed equal partner in the Union should they even have to ask? To me, it should be an internal discussion in the Scottish Parliament, and if they decision is to have another refrendum, crack on.

 

[Lord Tyrion]

Maybe the UK govt is a little tied up right now on a matter that affects the whole country. Get Brexit fully resolved and then look at another referendum once it has settled down. Trying to deal with separation from the EU and then (possibly) Scotland as well would be too big an ask right now. BJ may not be appeasing part of the Scottish vote but on this issue I do think he is looking after the country as a whole (this subject alone). Once Brexit has been done and settled down, different matter.

 

[Wolf]

Maybe the UK govt is a little tied up right now on a matter that affects the whole country. Get Brexit fully resolved and then look at another referendum once it has settled down. Trying to deal with separation from the EU and then (possibly) Scotland as well would be too big an ask right now. BJ may not be appeasing part of the Scottish vote but on this issue I do think he is looking after the country as a whole (this subject alone). Once Brexit has been done and settled down, different matter.

Your post deserves an infraction LT... You've come onto a thread where your not allowed to post something that actually makes sense, consider yourself told off..

 

[Lord Tyrion]

Your post deserves an infraction LT... You've come onto a thread where your not allowed to post something that actually makes sense, consider yourself told off..

Telling off received. Apologies for my foolishness

 

[KenL]

As a supposed equal partner in the Union should they even have to ask? To me, it should be an internal discussion in the Scottish Parliament, and if they decision is to have another refrendum, crack on.

You need to remember how stressful this is for people living through this.

 

[Kellfire]

Your post deserves an infraction LT... You've come onto a thread where your not allowed to post something that actually makes sense, consider yourself told off..

Only it doesn’t make sense because negotiations the UK are involved in would need to take into account a future Scottish exit from the union or else that’ll be another thing to renegotiate in the near future as our bargaining power is smaller once again.

 

[Lord Tyrion]

Only it doesn’t make sense because negotiations the UK are involved in would need to take into account a future Scottish exit from the union or else that’ll be another thing to renegotiate in the near future as our bargaining power is smaller once again.

So you want the UK to weaken its bargaining hand at this stage in the negotiations? If a deal is struck this year then that is the deal for the UK going forwards. If Scotland decides to go independent in the future the EU will not be back to renegotiate, the deal still stands. Any negotiations will be solely between Scotland and the EU regarding entry, nothing to do with the UK.

 

[Kellfire]

So you want the UK to weaken its bargaining hand at this stage in the negotiations? If a deal is struck this year then that is the deal for the UK going forwards. If Scotland decides to go independent in the future the EU will not be back to renegotiate, the deal still stands. Any negotiations will be solely between Scotland and the EU regarding entry, nothing to do with the UK.

If the Scottish want independence from the UK, I can only assume the government would support that in line with their support for Brexit.

We, as a population, have shown that the ramifications are not something we are overly bothered about.

 

[chrisd]

Should they not have another referendum though ?

No!

 

[Fade and Die]

I think you are getting confused between the SNP and The Independence movement/Yes/AUOB campaigns....they are all separate things.
As I have said many times on here not all SNP supporters want independence and there are many people who dislike the SNP but do want independence.
As an example.....One of my neighbours is an Tory supporter who wants Independence, she is English. Her Scots husband is a Union Jack waving Tory voter who is no friend of the SNP and the idea of Independence.
It is complicated and generalisations that you [and others] use show a lack of understanding.

Ah the old “you don’t understand the situation” cop out.
What about @KenL? Does he not understand the situation either?

#UnionJock?

 

[Deleted member 15344]

No!

Why not ?

I’m surprised at your stance when you consider your pro independence stance from the EU ?

 

[chrisd]

Why not ?

I’m surprised at your stance when you consider your pro independence stance from the EU ?

Their position is the same as remoaners - dont get the result they want so have to keep going until they do. It was a once in a generation vote, they voted to stay, no caveat about, if other circumstances change then we can keep bleating for another go. They should wait until we see the longer term effects of Brexit and then they would have more of a case.

 

[Hobbit]

You need to remember how stressful this is for people living through this.

But, equally, there's almost an equal number want this to happen. I hear what you're saying, and its bl00dy annoying to hear the whining of some but it needs resolving. It needs a decisive majority either way to put it to bed. It was so close last time and, as others have said, there's been a significant change (Brexit) which clearly wasn't supported by Scotland.

Also, this is the SNP thread, not an independence thread. The SNP appear to have little opposition and, dare I say by virtue of their propaganda, can do little wrong. Their record on the NHS and education in recent years is rank bad. And saying "its better than rUK" doesn't make it right but some seem to think that's good enough. Its not! Have some bl00dy ambition and hold them to account. By all means return them but at least rattle their cage.

 

[lobthewedge]

Should they not have another referendum though ? Since the last one circumstances have changed dramatically for the UK and it’s going in another direction - so it’s prob right to ask Scotland if they want to carry on being part of the Union or they want to break out on their own

Is it unreasonable to ask the we (Scottish voters) actually get to see how Brexit pans out before we have another referendum, enabling us to make a more informed and educated choice?

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

Is it unreasonable to ask the we (Scottish voters) actually get to see how Brexit pans out before we have another referendum, enabling us to make a more informed and educated choice?

How long do you expect to have to wait for that? 5yrs, 10yrs? Rees-Mogg reckoned 50yrs before the full economic consequences of Brexit would be known...would suit many I am sure - but not the rest

 

[Deleted member 15344]

Their position is the same as remoaners - dont get the result they want so have to keep going until they do. It was a once in a generation vote, they voted to stay, no caveat about, if other circumstances change then we can keep bleating for another go. They should wait until we see the longer term effects of Brexit and then they would have more of a case.

Remoaners?! Good to see that’s still going on

Do you see the reason why they want to ask the question again.

During the original referendum they were told plainly that the only way for Scotland to stay within the EU was to stay in the UK Union - that’s a fact that can’t be denied

So a couple after that promise the UK have an EU vote of which Scotland clearly vote to stay within the EU but the UK overall vote is to leave

So that promise has gone , so the situation and circumstances has staged significantly

It’s very valid for them to ask the question again because of those changes in circumstances- it’s the right thing to do

Why should they wait ? Why can’t they have a say in their future and look to become Independant?

It almost seems like a touch of hypocrisy for people to laud independance from the EU but then not allow the countries within in the Union if they can be independent. Right now before all trade deals etc are sorted it’s a good time for Scotland to ask the questions again - I don’t see why people would be so asgainst it

 

[chrisd]

Remoaners?! Good to see that’s still going on

Do you see the reason why they want to ask the question again.

During the original referendum they were told plainly that the only way for Scotland to stay within the EU was to stay in the UK Union - that’s a fact that can’t be denied

So a couple after that promise the UK have an EU vote of which Scotland clearly vote to stay within the EU but the UK overall vote is to leave

So that promise has gone , so the situation and circumstances has staged significantly

It’s very valid for them to ask the question again because of those changes in circumstances- it’s the right thing to do

Why should they wait ? Why can’t they have a say in their future and look to become Independant?

It almost seems like a touch of hypocrisy for people to laud independance from the EU but then not allow the countries within in the Union if they can be independent. Right now before all trade deals etc are sorted it’s a good time for Scotland to ask the questions again - I don’t see why people would be so asgainst it

That's your opinion Phil

 

[Wolf]

https://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/1237601/Nicola-sturgeon-news-SNP-EU-Brexit-Scottish-independence

Well that's awkward... ?

 

[Jacko_G]

But, equally, there's almost an equal number want this to happen. I hear what you're saying, and its bl00dy annoying to hear the whining of some but it needs resolving. It needs a decisive majority either way to put it to bed. It was so close last time and, as others have said, there's been a significant change (Brexit) which clearly wasn't supported by Scotland.

Also, this is the SNP thread, not an independence thread. The SNP appear to have little opposition and, dare I say by virtue of their propaganda, can do little wrong. Their record on the NHS and education in recent years is rank bad. And saying "its better than rUK" doesn't make it right but some seem to think that's good enough. Its not! Have some bl00dy ambition and hold them to account. By all means return them but at least rattle their cage.

Its not any worse than the rest of the UK and in some instances probably better.

 

[Jacko_G]

https://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/1237601/Nicola-sturgeon-news-SNP-EU-Brexit-Scottish-independence

Well that's awkward... ?

Tory propaganda - hardly worth using instead of toilet paper.

What will be will be - independence will come, maybe 2 years, maybe 22 years mark my words it will come.