The SNIP

[Captainron]

Problem for a lot of the northern places is that they were built on outdated requirements (coal, wool etc) where London was always a commerce hub.

So when the large areas of the north became “redundant” they were up the creek because their entire existence was built around skills which were not needed.

 

[Hobbit]

Problem for a lot of the northern places is that they were built on outdated requirements (coal, wool etc) where London was always a commerce hub.

So when the large areas of the north became “redundant” they were up the creek because their entire existence was built around skills which were not needed.

And govt investment and incentives? Is the U.K. the only Northern European country to experience this? Why don’t other Northern European countries exhibit the massive centralisation the U.K. does?

If Westminster wants to nullify the SNP and the Tories want to retain the northern seats they’ve just won, something’s got to change.

 

[Captainron]

And govt investment and incentives? Is the U.K. the only Northern European country to experience this? Why don’t other Northern European countries exhibit the massive centralisation the U.K. does?

If Westminster wants to nullify the SNP and the Tories want to retain the northern seats they’ve just won, something’s got to change.

That’s how it was Bri. Not saying it’s definitely going to stay that way but I don’t see huge changes. Just an observation about why the north is they way it is.

The likelihood of massive infrastructure boosts to places which are not within commuteable distance to a larger town/city are probably unlikely as the gain is not commensurate with the outlay. So people living in small rural towns probably won’t feel any real benefit.

 

[Deleted member 16999]

That’s how it was Bri. Not saying it’s definitely going to stay that way but I don’t see huge changes. Just an observation about why the north is they way it is.

The likelihood of massive infrastructure boosts to places which are not within commuteable distance to a larger town/city are probably unlikely as the gain is not commensurate with the outlay. So people living in small rural towns probably won’t feel any real benefit.

London was built on the Docks along with many other ports around the Country, look how that area has been regenerated, ie Canary Wharf amongst others.

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

And govt investment and incentives? Is the U.K. the only Northern European country to experience this? Why don’t other Northern European countries exhibit the massive centralisation the U.K. does?

If Westminster wants to nullify the SNP and the Tories want to retain the northern seats they’ve just won, something’s got to change.

Exactly right - this whole idea being pushed by some here that there is no point Westminster investing in Scottish infrastructure or in moving business/government depts to Scotland in case Scotland becomes independent is as sure a pointer as anyone can give to Scots that Westminster expects Scotland to become independent.

If Westminster government actually cares about the Union then it has to be very positive about investment in Scotland and in decentralisation.

Scotland apart, there is the same expectation now sitting with millions of northern Tory voters - they expect as they were promised significant change by Johnson and Crew.

 

[drdel]

And govt investment and incentives? Is the U.K. the only Northern European country to experience this? Why don’t other Northern European countries exhibit the massive centralisation the U.K. does?

If Westminster wants to nullify the SNP and the Tories want to retain the northern seats they’ve just won, something’s got to change.

If Scotland and the SNP would stop banging on about independence and work with the UK to make it a stable place for investment then change may slowly be gained. At the moment they are shooting themselves in the foot with their rhetoric. Northern Europe does have historic centralisation commonly near transport, raw material hubs e.g. Rotterdam, Schipol, etc.

I've worked for many international companies (including at least 3 big Scottish organisations) looking at establishing themselves and refining their supply chains: these are long term investments. The standard assessment begins with the market network and demographics balanced against the sources of supply and the magnitude of bulk movement against the network for distribution. One has to recognise where the major ports, airports and populations are. If you locate in Scotland you'll also need infrastructure 'south' to receive bulk shipments. However if you look at the UK's centre of gravity for most logistical systems you either end up south of Birmingham or south of London depending on the exact flows of that sector. Take a look at where industrial 'parks' are being built by developers.

Unfortunately adding to the political is a small domestics market of 5m people, poor transport links and some difficult terrain international companies locating in Scotland incur additional supply chain costs that are not countered by lower property/operating costs - the sums just do not add up. The same issues are relevant to a degree in Cornwall, Devon, west Wales, Cumbria, and the NE. It is no accident that the Government is looking at 'Freeports' to stimulate international trade - the word PORT is the best indicator - air or sea.

 

[drdel]

Exactly right - this whole idea being pushed by some here that there is no point Westminster investing in Scottish infrastructure or in moving business/government depts to Scotland in case Scotland becomes independent is as sure a pointer as anyone can give to Scots that Westminster expects Scotland to become independent.

If Westminster government actually cares about the Union then it has to be very positive about investment in Scotland and in decentralisation.

Scotland apart, there is the same expectation now sitting with millions of northern Tory voters - they expect as they were promised significant change by Johnson and Crew.

Governments do not run businesses; they can 'try' and improve conditions but economic realities and demographics will always prevail which is the why the EU's CAP consumes such a huge part of the EU budget.

 

[azazel]

So as a brief summary of what a couple of posters appear to be saying, there’s no way the government is going to invest in Scotland and there’s no way for Scotland to do anything about it as, even if the will was there to spend some government money on business development, it wouldn’t be worthwhile anyway?
Should we all just pack up and move to London then?
I’m certainly not finding much in these “economic” arguments to suggest there’s any point in Scotland staying in the UK, that’s for sure.

 

[Slab]

If you were Boris and you had a choice where to commit and support to away from the SE, would you go northern England where you have just picked up only dreamt of seats, or to Scotland where the ruling party are going to cry "leave" at every opportunity ?

He would choose NE every time even if Scotland said nothing about indy, in fact even more so (and I suspect you know that too) so.... Scotland MUST develop a bargaining position of whatever strength it can

Make no mistake, when it comes to fighting for the scraps the SE doesn't want it is not and never has been a fair fight, brexit will not change that

 

[drdel]

So as a brief summary of what a couple of posters appear to be saying, there’s no way the government is going to invest in Scotland and there’s no way for Scotland to do anything about it as, even if the will was there to spend some government money on business development, it wouldn’t be worthwhile anyway?
Should we all just pack up and move to London then?
I’m certainly not finding much in these “economic” arguments to suggest there’s any point in Scotland staying in the UK, that’s for sure.

Geography and demographics are realities, but the ongoing political uncertainty is simply unhelpful.

 

[Doon frae Troon]

Doon, now you are in the realm of sheer fantasy.

The Shard was financed from Qatar, The Gherkin from Brazil, it’s all private finance apart from the MI5 building.

You aren’t doing yourself or your cause any favours with these outlandish comments

I think that skyline includes more than two buildings.

 

[Dando]

I think that skyline includes more than two buildings.

so what buildings were down to Scotlands oil money?

 

[chrisd]

so what buildings were down to Scotlands oil money?

Shouldn't that be the UK oil money?

 

[Dando]

Shouldn't that be the UK oil money?

The only decent thing bliar did was move the boundary lines

 

[Jacko_G]

Get JOCXIT done.

Scots hate Westminster not the English. I'll happily pay extra taxes for my future generations.

That said it's going to cost Westminster more to build the infrastructure to house trident in their own waters.

 

[Jacko_G]

Geography and demographics are realities, but the ongoing political uncertainty is simply unhelpful.

Put some of that snake oil on your heid.

 

[Deleted member 15344]

Get JOCXIT done.

Scots hate Westminster not the English. I'll happily pay extra taxes for my future generations.

That said it's going to cost Westminster more to build the infrastructure to house trident in their own waters.

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www....yed-at-the-faslane-nuclear-base-1-4361349/amp

Just got to find jobs for the thousands employed in and around Faslane because Trident is there.

 

[chrisd]

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www....yed-at-the-faslane-nuclear-base-1-4361349/amp

Just got to find jobs for the thousands employed in and around Faslane because Trident is there.

About 11,000 directly and indirectly from 2020 I believe

 

[KenL]

Get JOCXIT done.

Scots hate Westminster not the English. I'll happily pay extra taxes for my future generations.

That said it's going to cost Westminster more to build the infrastructure to house trident in their own waters.

Some Scots maybe. I certainly do not hate Westminster.

Some Scots do hate England, stupid small-minded Scots!

 

[williamalex1]

Surely anyone with the slightest bit of patriotism in their blood would prefer to be governed from within their own borders / country by their peers, if remotely possible ???.
Sadly I don't think that's possible for the foreseeable future , but just maybe/ hopefully stand on our own one day.
ATM we have Westminster , Brussels and fekin Holyrood ruling us .
BTW I quite like you Sassenachs especially the lassies
Can you imagine England being governed by a Scottish or N.I majority government based in Holyrood or Stormont, how would you guys and Gals like it .