The Masters 2025

[Slab]

Post #412 - all good in tour events but he needs a caddy that can stand up in a major and either interact and keep him distracted or have the guts to give him different clubs. Tour events and majors are very obviously different beasts. He seems to have issues in the majors and the caddy does nothing to help

I dunno if we can know/say that’s the case though
They’re out there for 5-6 hours, for all we know the caddy ‘helped’ save Rory several shots during the round with a bit of advice or saying the right thing. But because the result was a bog-standard par, it’ll never be highlighted

 

[HomerJSimpson]

I dunno if we can know/say that’s the case though
They’re out there for 5-6 hours, for all we know the caddy ‘helped’ save Rory several shots during the round with a bit of advice or saying the right thing. But because the result was a bog-standard par, it’ll never be highlighted

In my opinion, there is no real pressure on Rory in a tour event, not matter what one it is. If he wins then great and cements his standing as world #2. However look at the record in majors since his last win and they are simply littered with errors, usually at least one round that is poor and plays him out of the event or gives him too much to do. Surely somewhere in there it takes a caddy to say the right thing, even if that isn't what he needs to hear. All the best caddies have never been afraid to step in

 

[Slab]

Could also be that the caddy’s absolutely fine and Rory’s just not quite as good as some folks hope/want him to be

 

[Slab]

Anyway... What about that Rotella fella that never has a bad word said about him on here. Hasn’t he been working with Rory too. What’s his role in the double bogeys yesterday? Why isn’t Rorys (clearly flawed) decision to use him being called into question? Is Bobs counsel only ever relevant to the clubhouse and actually pretty useless during a round?

 

[Swango1980]

How was his caddy when we was winning at Peeble or in the Players ?

A caddy relationship will be determined by the player and what they want

To me, McIlroy is an incredible player. I'm a huge fan, I'm sure I've an extra soft spot for him as he is from 10 mins up the road, and his coach was the head pro at my boyhood club up until a few years ago, when he went over to the US. So, my default is not to be critical of McIlroy, I'm more likely to defend him.

How many players have consistently stayed as one of the best handful of players in the world since they pretty much started as a pro? Many players are brilliant for a season or two, then go through a long period of indifference. On pure ability, McIlroy is unbelievable, and will always win golf tournaments on raw talent alone. As I said, I could caddy for him for a season, and he'd win golf tournaments just as easily. My ability as a caddy would matter not.

Faldo said yesterday, early in his round, that golf is three thinks, technical, physical and mental. McIlroy had two of those covered with easy, the third is still under question. I wonder which he was talking about? As I have said, nearly every top player I have seen frequently use their caddy for more than handing them their club. They'll discuss shots, and sometimes the player will respect that the caddies advice actually makes better sense than their own instinct.

Is it an ego thing for McIlroy? Does he simply tell himself that he knows best, no matter what? Did he have bad experiences with his previous caddy, and has therefore told himself he needs a yes man, rather than think there could be other great caddies that could give him better advice, but in a way that he can deal with? A player of his ability not winning a Major in so long, it is obvious questions need to be asked. You can be unlucky sometimes, not good enough others. But when you are a player that good and not won in 39 attempts questions would be asked. And, had his caddy been someone like Bones yesterday, I'd love to know how he would approach that chip shot on 15th. Would McIlroy just tell him to leave him alone, or could they have a team discussion on his options at least?

 

[Swango1980]

Could also be that the caddy’s absolutely fine and Rory’s just not quite as good as some folks hope/want him to be

It's a difficult argument to back up when McIlroy is consistently one of the best players in the world, and much worse players have crossed the line.

I think the other issue is that McIlroy's failure is often attributed to significant unforced errors that have put him out of contention. When he made that chip into the water yesterday, my golf WhatsApp group started buzzing, people saying things like "no way does Scheffler make that mistake". I get that point. When you get top players in the purple patch of their careers, you rarely see them make as many bad mistakes.

And, I'm sure McIlroy will be hammering himself since the round ended. Not because he didn't play well enough, but because he made errors that were avoidable.

I really hope McIlroy wins a Major, as much for Harry Diamond. I agree it must be a weight on his shoulders that McIlroy has not won a Major with him on the bag. Personally, I don't think he is a great caddy in comparison to many of the other caddies on tour. But, on a human level, it would be nice for them both to finally get the job done.

 

[HomerJSimpson]

Personally, I don't think he is a great caddy in comparison to many of the other caddies on tour. But, on a human level, it would be nice for them both to finally get the job done.

And there is the crux of my argument. He isn't (in my opinion) the sort of guy Rory needs on a major bag but I do agree from a sentiment point of view it would be good to get a major win. Sadly I can't see it now

 

[Springveldt]

I don't think it was 3 yards too far. Probably 10 yards too far, as I think most top players would plan to keep it short.

If McIlroy's attitude is to play it stiff, there are plenty of shots that this is a good plan. But not for every shot, because then you leave yourself fine margins from a disaster.

Day 4 where you absolutely need a birdie, yes go for it. Day 1 when you are in a great position, don't do anything to throw it away.

It was a ridiculous shot, it was nowhere near as difficult as Cantlay's chip who was further back. He had one job to do on that chip and it was don't put it in the water. Even if he just bumps it into the fringe and leaves it 20 foot short, it would have been a good shot. Instead he carries it about 5 yards onto the green, as soon as the ball was in the air I said "that's in the water".

 

[Slab]

It's a difficult argument to back up when McIlroy is consistently one of the best players in the world, and much worse players have crossed the line.

I think the other issue is that McIlroy's failure is often attributed to significant unforced errors that have put him out of contention. When he made that chip into the water yesterday, my golf WhatsApp group started buzzing, people saying things like "no way does Scheffler make that mistake". I get that point. When you get top players in the purple patch of their careers, you rarely see them make as many bad mistakes.

And, I'm sure McIlroy will be hammering himself since the round ended. Not because he didn't play well enough, but because he made errors that were avoidable.

I really hope McIlroy wins a Major, as much for Harry Diamond. I agree it must be a weight on his shoulders that McIlroy has not won a Major with him on the bag. Personally, I don't think he is a great caddy in comparison to many of the other caddies on tour. But, on a human level, it would be nice for them both to finally get the job done.

Maybe because he plays to such a high level compared to many of his peers, it’s possible that Rory’s own personal 2yr purple patch was actually 10yrs ago and its gone now. And because of the level he was at it means he can still win more often than most players outside the purple patch but maybe like most players he just doesn’t reach that level again

 

[Arthur Wedge]

He played a bad shot - and got a big punishment for it

I don’t see why he is being dragged across the coals because of it

They all play bad shots , some get away with it , some are punished

He is only human

 

[HomerJSimpson]

He played a bad shot - and got a big punishment for it

I don’t see why he is being dragged across the coals because of it

They all play bad shots , some get away with it , some are punished

He is only human

But not many are chasing a career grand slam and have as much major scar tissue. Also as you've said before on many threads it's only "banter" and "discussion". Just because a narrative and opinions don't match your view, and there are plenty who have said the shot played was a bad decision and badly executed

 

[Springveldt]

Is the bird noise edited in, cos it’s the same sound, regardless of which player is hitting or which hole they are on.
Always the same noise at the same volume.

Yes, they have speakers in the bushes. It's as fake as the rest of the course.

 

[Springveldt]

He played a bad shot - and got a big punishment for it

I don’t see why he is being dragged across the coals because of it

They all play bad shots , some get away with it , some are punished

He is only human

I think it's probably because he seems to make these stupid, unforced errors more than other top players. Whether that is fair or not, I don't know as he also seems to be in contention at more majors than every other player. If he ever does win another major I wouldn't be surprised if he wins by about 5 shots as he finally puts 4 mostly error free rounds together.

With the way the rest of his game was yesterday I think he'll probably still end up top 5 this week but I can't see him making up 4 shots on Scheffler or Aberg from here. He's probably going to have to shoot 67 or better today to get back into it based on the other two guys last 4 rounds they have played at Augusta.

 

[larmen]

When on the leader board and clicking on a player name to see the highlights, that voice over is dreadful. Not only the tone, but also the information is out of sync with teh actual video.

Just had a look at both of Rory's double bogies. I think he got unlucky on 15 that the chip went into the drink, maybe he could have 'laid up'? But who of us here would have played it that way?
On 17, he was way past the hole. Not sure what happened there, then he should have rescued a bogey, I think.

But overall the leaderboard seems tight, like engine is out yet, an certainly no-one is running away with it.

 

[HomerJSimpson]

Interesting stat

An opening round that initially offered so many positives finished in familiar fashion for McIlroy, who now enters a seventh consecutive year of being six or more strokes back after the opening day at Augusta National.

 

[Fore Right]

He played a bad shot - and got a big punishment for it

I don’t see why he is being dragged across the coals because of it

They all play bad shots , some get away with it , some are punished

He is only human

Also worth noting by all the short game wizards here that on 15 his landing area to keep that on the green was so small that the margin for error was tiny.
Were talking the smallest of fractions here.
2 of the world's top 10 players put that shot in the water 3 times and many that were not caught on camera woukd have as well.

 

[evemccc]

The Augusta Scar tissue just keeps adding up for Rory which makes it harder to win with each passing year.

He must look at some of the faces on the Champions dinner photo and think how am I not sat at that table and they are.

Because he hasn’t won a Major in 11 years, because when he won between 2011-14 the leading competitors in the field were NOTHING like as solid as the strength in depth of the field of today, because he won 2X PGA and a US Open, which are primarily won by bombers

Rory has all the talent and skill to be in the top 3 in the world and has been for years. Maybe he hasn’t the temperament needed

Maybe a parallel could be Greg Norman’s career?

Edit: before the expected pile on starts, I have NOTHING against him as a person or golfer and think he’s got the most beautiful swing, and I trust him off the tee over pretty much anyone. Especially with the Driver.
I am sick of the media just acting as cheer-leaders and professional golf being the ‘Tiger and Rory’ show….its pathetic

 

[Leftitshort]

are we playing Rory cliche bingo yet? if so....House !!

 

[pokerjoke]

For me it's pretty simple. He hasn't won a major in over a decade now. Ignore all his other wins as everyone says majors are the ones people look back on (IE jack Vs tiger) so that's a long time to not win a major. With his talent. He is an incredible player. He should be getting over the line. His caddies seem yes men. Rather than someone to go nope have a think again. IE pulling driver on the 18th at the us open .. a good caddy would be going put that away, 3 wood and we got this.

If he was winning majors questions wouldn't be raised.

Bryson hit driver and won

 

[pokerjoke]

Interesting stat

An opening round that initially offered so many positives finished in familiar fashion for McIlroy, who now enters a seventh consecutive year of being six or more strokes back after the opening day at Augusta National.

I’m not a fan of Rory’s however,as much as I agree with some of the things you are saying Martin please change the record.
He made a mistake,it cost him, however for 14 holes he played well and had his game under control.
Although Cantlay was further back your not ripping him a new one.
Let’s see today how’s he’s been effected by yesterday.

Overall though what a fantastic leaderboard