The Footie Thread

[Tashyboy]

Re yesterday, like I said congratulations to Utd. They set up and Did a job and it paid off. Once more City and Pep over thought it. Once more in a final. I could go on about City, Pep, Haaland, KDB ETC. But at the end of the day we have a Premier league title in a season that was a transitional season so I will more than take that.
Seeing as the talk is about Utd I will put my two pennuth worth in.
Utd looked solid yesterday. There is no doubt that they have had a savage season re injuries. I wonder if Mainoo would have broken into the team should they be at full strength. So there are positives. But if some players are injured others have to stand up and put there big girl knickers on. Players like Rashford didn’t. But yesterday on the big stage he did. Onana. Had a good game. But the goal Onana let in was typical of him.
The times I have seen Utd play, I honestly don’t know what there style of play is, when squad players come in, it seems like a direct replacement Against better teams, it is park the bus. Against mid table and lesser teams it is more open and like Coventry in the last game concede 3. That’s a TH team and a million miles away from what Utd fans expect to see. I saw a stat the other day that said Bruno has created over 100 chances this season. Who is he passing to Stevie wonder.
I agree with Alex, the win could muddy the waters for Utd. If TH stays what will change. Re the Glaziers, staduim, style of football. Nothing. Whatever the outcome. Now the season has finished there needs to be a big clear out at Utd and managers like Z Zidane and players like Kronos need to come in and shake that changing room up.
I have a feeling it is going to be a roller coaster ride for Utd fans over the close season.

 

[Slime]

Came downstairs this morning and turned the telly on.
Hey, guess what, it wasn't a dream.

 

[Billysboots]

Came downstairs this morning and turned the telly on.
Hey, guess what, it wasn't a dream.

View attachment 53499

And yet it still feels very much like the win has been totally overshadowed by the issues regarding the manager.

I was at the final in 2016 and, as early as the drive home, all the radio talk was about LVG going and Mourinho coming in. I hated the brand of football under LVG and was pleased to see him gone but I knew it would be equally as turgid under Mourinho, and so it proved.

Fan opinion seemed back then to want the manager out. I’m not feeling that at all this time, and it’s really taking the gloss off a thoroughly professional performance yesterday.

We all know what’s coming if we’re honest. The silence from INEOS speaks volumes. If we’d lost yesterday ETH would already be history. The win just feels as though it’s delayed the inevitable, and it all seems very sordid and undignified.

 

[Tashyboy]

And yet it still feels very much like the win has been totally overshadowed by the issues regarding the manager.

I was at the final in 2016 and, as early as the drive home, all the radio talk was about LVG going and Mourinho coming in. I hated the brand of football under LVG and was pleased to see him gone but I knew it would be equally as turgid under Mourinho, and so it proved.

Fan opinion seemed back then to want the manager out. I’m not feeling that at all this time, and it’s really taking the gloss off a thoroughly professional performance yesterday.

We all know what’s coming if we’re honest. The silence from INEOS speaks volumes. If we’d lost yesterday ETH would already be history. The win just feels as though it’s delayed the inevitable, and it all seems very sordid and undignified.

It has and it shouldn’t. Personally I think it has made the decision in getting rid of TH more difficult. If players had given 100% through a difficult season. Utd would not be in the state they are now. TH has his problems, Pep admitted he got the selection wrong yesterday. It happens with managers. But a manager is not responsible for players not putting in a “ shift”. That is what will see him gone.

 

[Bunkermagnet]

And yet it still feels very much like the win has been totally overshadowed by the issues regarding the manager.

I was at the final in 2016 and, as early as the drive home, all the radio talk was about LVG going and Mourinho coming in. I hated the brand of football under LVG and was pleased to see him gone but I knew it would be equally as turgid under Mourinho, and so it proved.

Fan opinion seemed back then to want the manager out. I’m not feeling that at all this time, and it’s really taking the gloss off a thoroughly professional performance yesterday.

We all know what’s coming if we’re honest. The silence from INEOS speaks volumes. If we’d lost yesterday ETH would already be history. The win just feels as though it’s delayed the inevitable, and it all seems very sordid and undignified.

Personally, I think Ineos and Ratcliffe have bitten off more than they can chew or control. Football isn't like sailing, cycling or motor racing. Brailsford isn't going to be able to shave 100's of a second of the time it take for a ball to be crossed or passed, let alone the speed the players run at.
Football is too basic for that with the fans demands and interaction of the officials. The way Ratcliffe has been appearing to be wanting to get invloved in the team, the manager, tactics and everything would, if I were Utd fan, worry me a great deal.
There has been too many "owners" of PL clubs who think they know best and want certain players in the team or certain tactics or styles. Likewise there has been a good amount who have left the manager and team to it.
As I'm not a Utd fan I hope its the former, but if Ratcliffe and Ineos leave the manager and team to it they could come back very strong.
You can say what you like about Liverpool, FSG and Klopp, but when Klopp was taken on, he was given a 3 yr contract and a year later a 5 yr extension. Change takes time, and as fans we have to accept that and also not trying to return to the past.

 

[Billysboots]

Personally, I think Ineos and Ratcliffe have bitten off more than they can chew or control. Football isn't like sailing, cycling or motor racing. Brailsford isn't going to be able to shave 100's of a second of the time it take for a ball to be crossed or passed, let alone the speed the players run at.
Football is too basic for that with the fans demands and interaction of the officials. The way Ratcliffe has been appearing to be wanting to get invloved in the team, the manager, tactics and everything would, if I were Utd fan, worry me a great deal.
There has been too many "owners" of PL clubs who think they know best and want certain players in the team or certain tactics or styles. Likewise there has been a good amount who have left the manager and team to it.
As I'm not a Utd fan I hope its the former, but if Ratcliffe and Ineos leave the manager and team to it they could come back very strong.
You can say what you like about Liverpool, FSG and Klopp, but when Klopp was taken on, he was given a 3 yr contract and a year later a 5 yr extension. Change takes time, and as fans we have to accept that and also not trying to return to the past.

Not sure Ratcliffe has involved himself in any tactical decisions, BM. I must have missed that!

 

[Bunkermagnet]

Not sure Ratcliffe has involved himself in any tactical decisions, BM. I must have missed that!

I think it was more about ETH and Sancho when he was first coming in, but even so.

 

[Swango1980]

Re yesterday, like I said congratulations to Utd. They set up and Did a job and it paid off. Once more City and Pep over thought it. Once more in a final. I could go on about City, Pep, Haaland, KDB ETC. But at the end of the day we have a Premier league title in a season that was a transitional season so I will more than take that.
Seeing as the talk is about Utd I will put my two pennuth worth in.
Utd looked solid yesterday. There is no doubt that they have had a savage season re injuries. I wonder if Mainoo would have broken into the team should they be at full strength. So there are positives. But if some players are injured others have to stand up and put there big girl knickers on. Players like Rashford didn’t. But yesterday on the big stage he did. Onana. Had a good game. But the goal Onana let in was typical of him.
The times I have seen Utd play, I honestly don’t know what there style of play is, when squad players come in, it seems like a direct replacement Against better teams, it is park the bus. Against mid table and lesser teams it is more open and like Coventry in the last game concede 3. That’s a TH team and a million miles away from what Utd fans expect to see. I saw a stat the other day that said Bruno has created over 100 chances this season. Who is he passing to Stevie wonder.
I agree with Alex, the win could muddy the waters for Utd. If TH stays what will change. Re the Glaziers, staduim, style of football. Nothing. Whatever the outcome. Now the season has finished there needs to be a big clear out at Utd and managers like Z Zidane and players like Kronos need to come in and shake that changing room up.
I have a feeling it is going to be a roller coaster ride for Utd fans over the close season.

Regarding Mainoo, the plan was definitely to break into side this season, and looked great pre season. Then he had a bad injury. So yes, he didn't get in due to luck that others were injured. He probably has had more game time than expected though, as I'm sure the plan wasn't to play him in every game when fit.

Man Utd fans may expect to see a better brand of football. But, interestingly, look at the reaction on ETH. I think every United fan in here want him to stay, even if Billy might have veered to the dark side for a while . The vast majority of fans I hear on social media wany ETH to stay. Sky showed a poll yesterday, 73% of Utd fans want him to stay. Whereas, it is almost 100% of fans and pundits from other clubs who are adamant he isn't good enough.

Utd fans know the club more than others. They are the biggest critics of their team, eagle eyed on every incident during each game. Yes, it had been awful, but it isn't all on ETH. We know it is unlikely another manager will come in and get this broken side playing great football. Utd fans want Utd to do well, so if ETH was truly that bad, I'm sure they'd be the first to demand change.

But, the injuries have been horrific. So many big players out. The players who cover for them out. It isn't just games they miss. They can't train when injured. When they come back, they need to get fit. So, ETH made another good point, how can you develop and work with these players individually and as a team, when so many are constantly on the treatment table? When they do gey back, they are often rushed back into side as other players have broken down, and there is no other option.

Shearer, like many pundits, makes me laugh. He said to ETH he should understand the criticism, and that all sides get injuries. However, if I asked Shearer "why have Newcastle performed worse this season than last, should Howe be sacked?", he'd probably be the first to point at injuries as a major reason why they dropped off this year.

 

[PaulMdj]

And yet it still feels very much like the win has been totally overshadowed by the issues regarding the manager.

I was at the final in 2016 and, as early as the drive home, all the radio talk was about LVG going and Mourinho coming in. I hated the brand of football under LVG and was pleased to see him gone but I knew it would be equally as turgid under Mourinho, and so it proved.

Fan opinion seemed back then to want the manager out. I’m not feeling that at all this time, and it’s really taking the gloss off a thoroughly professional performance yesterday.

We all know what’s coming if we’re honest. The silence from INEOS speaks volumes. If we’d lost yesterday ETH would already be history. The win just feels as though it’s delayed the inevitable, and it all seems very sordid and undignified.

Do you put the win yesterday down to the manager or the players?

Yesterday before the game there were questions from Utd fans about Team Selection, over the past week many players have been questioned.

Fantastic to win the Cup, can only dream we might get there again one day, but has yesterday actually done anything to change attitudes towards the manager and players?

 

[Billysboots]

Do you put the win yesterday down to the manager or the players?

Yesterday before the game there were questions from Utd fans about Team Selection, over the past week many players have been questioned.

Fantastic to win the Cup, can only dream we might get there again one day, but has yesterday actually done anything to change attitudes towards the manager and players?

Both. Ten Hag clearly had a plan, and the players executed it.

I get the impression the majority of the players like the manager. And the fans certainly do.

INEOS have a problem. Sack ten Hag and they run the risk of alienating many fans before they’ve even got their feet under the table.

It’s all a bit of a mess.

 

[Billysboots]

I think every United fan in here want him to stay, even if Billy might have veered to the dark side for a while .

I had a dreadful case of Coventry City induced confusion. I think I’m just about over it.

 

[PaulMdj]

Both. Ten Hag clearly had a plan, and the players executed it.

I get the impression the majority of the players like the manager. And the fans certainly do.

INEOS have a problem. Sack ten Hag and they run the risk of alienating many fans before they’ve even got their feet under the table.

It’s all a bit of a mess.

OK, It comes across as some fans are worried about another “new” manager coming in and more upheaval, even you yourself were despondent and stunned with his team selection prior to kick off, hence the confusion

You’re wanting him to stay, he has a plan, but lacking a certain amount of trust in him.

 

[Billysboots]

OK, It comes across as some fans are worried about another “new” manager coming in and more upheaval, even you yourself were despondent and stunned with his team selection prior to kick off, hence the confusion

You’re wanting him to stay, he has a plan, but lacking a certain amount of trust in him.

I was absolutely despondent to see his selection. But he’s a football manager. I deliver cars part time! What do I know?

 

[Hobbit]

Both. Ten Hag clearly had a plan, and the players executed it.

I get the impression the majority of the players like the manager. And the fans certainly do.

INEOS have a problem. Sack ten Hag and they run the risk of alienating many fans before they’ve even got their feet under the table.

It’s all a bit of a mess.

I dare say some fans have seen the similarities between Sir Alex and Ten Hag, i.e. a possible win or be sacked scenario.

 

[Swango1980]

OK, It comes across as some fans are worried about another “new” manager coming in and more upheaval, even you yourself were despondent and stunned with his team selection prior to kick off, hence the confusion

You’re wanting him to stay, he has a plan, but lacking a certain amount of trust in hihim

I guess every fan is different. Certainly, I really like Hojlund. If I were to pick Utd's best 11, he'd be in it.

But, Utd probably struggle to beat Man City by picking their best 11 and try and play like they would like to play against 80% of other sides.

So, personally I actually liked his starting 11 in final, albeit surprised. It was similar to last few league games, where is worked well. It also mean5 that if things didn't work so well, there were positive options on the bench to change things. Whereas if he went with the standard best players, and things didn't work out, options on bench may feel a lot more depressing?

If Utd had more striker options, and more robustness in midfield, starting with Hojlund or another striker might be a lot more likely in that game.

What I was most ecstatic about was that Martinez was playing. It just always feels he calms down the entire team significantly.

 

[road2ruin]

OK, It comes across as some fans are worried about another “new” manager coming in and more upheaval, even you yourself were despondent and stunned with his team selection prior to kick off, hence the confusion

You’re wanting him to stay, he has a plan, but lacking a certain amount of trust in him.

I want him to stay because I look at the options out there and I don’t see an upgrade on ETH.

I would like to see more of the dead wood shown the door, strengthen in the obvious areas and have a season far less affected by injuries.

If INEOS go down this route and still not be convinced by the manager they can identify the one they really want and not end up with Gareth Southgate as he’s the best of a limited bunch.

 

[Tashyboy]

I had a dreadful case of Coventry City induced confusion. I think I’m just about over it.

Winning a trophy does that. You can borrow our trophy polish.

 

[Hobbit]

I want him to stay because I look at the options out there and I don’t see an upgrade on ETH.

I would like to see more of the dead wood shown the door, strengthen in the obvious areas and have a season far less affected by injuries.

If INEOS go down this route and still not be convinced by the manager they can identify the one they really want and not end up with Gareth Southgate as he’s the best of a limited bunch.

Steve McClaren is the assistant there. Why not move him up if Hag is booted?

 

[Billysboots]

Steve McClaren is the assistant there. Why not move him up if Hag is booted?

Fantastic coach. Poor manager.

 

[Arthur Wedge]

Regarding Mainoo, the plan was definitely to break into side this season, and looked great pre season. Then he had a bad injury. So yes, he didn't get in due to luck that others were injured. He probably has had more game time than expected though, as I'm sure the plan wasn't to play him in every game when fit.

Man Utd fans may expect to see a better brand of football. But, interestingly, look at the reaction on ETH. I think every United fan in here want him to stay, even if Billy might have veered to the dark side for a while . The vast majority of fans I hear on social media wany ETH to stay. Sky showed a poll yesterday, 73% of Utd fans want him to stay. Whereas, it is almost 100% of fans and pundits from other clubs who are adamant he isn't good enough.

Utd fans know the club more than others. They are the biggest critics of their team, eagle eyed on every incident during each game. Yes, it had been awful, but it isn't all on ETH. We know it is unlikely another manager will come in and get this broken side playing great football. Utd fans want Utd to do well, so if ETH was truly that bad, I'm sure they'd be the first to demand change.

But, the injuries have been horrific. So many big players out. The players who cover for them out. It isn't just games they miss. They can't train when injured. When they come back, they need to get fit. So, ETH made another good point, how can you develop and work with these players individually and as a team, when so many are constantly on the treatment table? When they do gey back, they are often rushed back into side as other players have broken down, and there is no other option.

Shearer, like many pundits, makes me laugh. He said to ETH he should understand the criticism, and that all sides get injuries. However, if I asked Shearer "why have Newcastle performed worse this season than last, should Howe be sacked?", he'd probably be the first to point at injuries as a major reason why they dropped off this year.

Red Cafe are running a poll in regards ETH

Erik ten Hag - Manchester United manager / awaiting clarity from the club over his position

www.redcafe.net

When you look at the managers Man Utd have had since Ferguson left then imo he is alongside the likes of OGS - as a rival fan i would prefer him to stay and I wonder what other rival fans would say

I want him to stay because I look at the options out there and I don’t see an upgrade on ETH.

I would like to see more of the dead wood shown the door, strengthen in the obvious areas and have a season far less affected by injuries.

If INEOS go down this route and still not be convinced by the manager they can identify the one they really want and not end up with Gareth Southgate as he’s the best of a limited bunch.

I think it’s a dangerous road if the reason to keep a manager is because of not liking or seeing a better upgrade - the likes of Tuchel have won the big trophies , Pochettino has proven to get the best out of players at a couple of prem clubs and then there are the likes of

Allegri , Xavi available , or even Zidane

And INEOS themselves also are very much going to be in the spotlight, they have proven themselves in other sports , football going to present a massive challenge

Is it a case of it’s going to get worse before getting better

Think the key at the moment is getting momentum going forward

Heard a lot on phone ins talking about Klopp only getting 8th in his first season - that was after taking over halfway through - he then after spent 3 seasons moving forward and improving each year. ETH and his team seem to have gone backwards this season , and next season is going to be even tougher with others improving